EU - ESC mandatory by 2012

[jack_christie]

The European Commission today confirmed new proposals for the mandatory introduction of Electronic Stability Control (ESC) on all new cars sold in the EU from 2012, following a successful campaign led by the FIA and FIA Foundation

http://217.204.13.141/mediacentre/Pr...230508-01.html

Looks like Max is back in business

[BerserkerCatSplat]

Enjoy your Lotus with electronic AIDS.

[Speedtouch]

How to get round that (Lotus). Have an off switch. Not exactly changing much then.

[emil_t]

what BerserkerCatSplat said ... yeah, it's nice to know that all those talented drivers that make abstract art with telegraph poles can live to see the next day, but only one problem i see here, some day ... (after 2012) ... this guy will conceive a monstrosity of a brain fart that will sounds something like this "i know why don't i get a car from one of the last thoroughbred car manufacter in the world and drive my little vaginna around cornes really really fast to impress da' women and give it a bad name ?" it's not enough that this happend to audi -well they did it with their own hands stupid marketing people ... damn them...- but it'll affect all cars, probaly lotus will get around this problem with that speciality law that says that cars in small numbers don't need to pass saftey regulations or something like that, i think catherman is using this law for their highly safe cars.

[jack_christie]

On the whole making ESC mandatory has to be a good thing.

A good example would be a friend of mine who has 30+ years of driving experience, but thought you should be driving in as low a gear as possible in slippy or icy conditions

[chaos386]

I sense this thread will soon be filled with mini-Schumachers telling us how much electronic aids are for wimps (which is probably why they still drive their 1.2L Polo diesel or 4-cyl Accord), but the fact is that as long as you're driving on a public road, you don't really have an excuse not to use TC/ESP. In any case, I doubt enthusiast sports cars will make it undefeatable, so you've got nothing to worry about for track days.

[GraemeH]

The EU ought to consider that drivers paying more attention more of the time is what reduces accidents. That's what they should be taking measures to ensure.

[Vette Boss]

I'm surprised it's taken this long to become a requirement. This is a good idea, it makes the 90% of drivers who don't know how to control over/understeer situations, much safer. Don't like it? Use the switch.

From what I gather, ESP is already on most European cars, this will simply push the last few to finally fit the system.

[prizrak]

Lots of cars have it already and all of them come with an off button My car has it and in reality I almost never have it kick in. There is more than enough mechanical grip to not have to use the system.

[emil_t]

Originally Posted by GraemeH

The EU ought to consider that drivers paying more attention more of the time is what reduces accidents. That's what they should be taking measures to ensure.

yeah may save you from some accidents, but that doesn't save you from all crashes, i think most things happen that everybody, no matter how experienced or how talented they are can't avoid freezing up, it's just too little time to see, examine and react, so the first thing you do is slam the brakes and then the wheels lock up (that's why all cars must have ABS in the EU, that's the most important thing) and you don't have control on the trajectory of the car, but that's not enough, you need something that makes the car stable when avoiding objects at high speed( and even low speeds, makes the car turn faster), that's when ESP comes in, these 2 are more important than all airbags and all super titanium space frame passanger cells, that's just when the inevitable happens, that's for another time ...

[jack_christie]

Victoria NSW seem to be step ahead of the EU in some regards.

Within NSW Victoria’s Safe System approach, arrive alive 2008-2017 addresses three critical elements:

• safer roads and roadsides
• safer vehicles
• safer road users

As part of Victoria’s safer vehicles strategy (pdf):

• From 1 January 2011 the installation of electronic stability control (ESC) will be compulsory in all new cars manufactured after this date
• From 1 January 2012 the installation of head protection technology, such as side-curtain airbags will be compulsory in all new cars manufactured after this date

However I still think you should have to do a driving test in a car with no driver aids and manual shift.

[Crazyjeeper]

As long as their is still an off switch I don't care. I do think its better to teach people to be able to manage a slide than give them an electronic nanny though.

[airmenair]

Next, we shall all be driving around in Nerf cars.

[jack_christie]

Originally Posted by airmenair

Next, we shall all be driving around in Nerf cars.

"Secure Foam" crash protection like Demolition Man would be cool though

[fbc]

Great idea - the technology is a life-saver. Of course there's more to be done in order to reduce the number of accidents - driver education being a big one, but this is still definitely a good step.

[Hidden_Hunter]

Originally Posted by jack_christie

However I still think you should have to do a driving test in a car with no driver aids and manual shift.

I'm of that belief here as well, stop kiddies trying to text while driving pretty quickly (Obviously in all practicality it would never work)

[wingnutsc]

Two things

1. Here's to hoping that if there is an off switch that it will ACTUALLY turn it off, rather than merely lessen its effects.

2. Drivers overall, at least here in the USA, need to learn better techniques like those taught in driving/racing school. Better driving leads to less accidents.

[Hidden_Hunter]

Originally Posted by wingnutsc

2. Drivers overall, at least here in the USA, need to learn better techniques like those taught in driving/racing school. Better driving leads to less accidents.

I found it interesting just how different people drive in different states, in TX everybody seems to speed and not indicate yet it seems to work just fine

[GraemeH]

Originally Posted by emil_t

yeah may save you from some accidents, but that doesn't save you from all crashes, i think most things happen that everybody, no matter how experienced or how talented they are can't avoid freezing up, it's just too little time to see, examine and react, so the first thing you do is slam the brakes and then the wheels lock up (that's why all cars must have ABS in the EU, that's the most important thing) and you don't have control on the trajectory of the car, but that's not enough, you need something that makes the car stable when avoiding objects at high speed( and even low speeds, makes the car turn faster), that's when ESP comes in, these 2 are more important than all airbags and all super titanium space frame passanger cells, that's just when the inevitable happens, that's for another time ...

Well there's a place for all these things, but the EU should consider the order or priority;

Crumple zones, air bags etc. are the most passive and don't prevent accidents, only injuries once accidents have happened.

Electronic stability assisted ashtray actuation or whatever other electronic aids are still passive. They'll only avoid a certain percent of accidents that are already about to happen.

The most active method of road safety, and the one that prevents the most injuries and accidents, is for drivers to pay attention and drive sensibly, not getting into a position where they have to brake sharply or swerve around in the first place.

In short, a good driver in one of those Chinese cherry suicide cars will be safer on the road than a bad driver in a 3 tonne pickup truck with 300 airbags and ABS coming out his ass. So I'd rather the EU spent more of its resources on raising the level of driver competance, than shoving the responsibility off to electronics.

[AiR]

The Eurovision Song Contest will be mandatory? Poor Italy!