LinkBack URL
About LinkBacksWell torque is what makes you accelerate. And yes I did mean that. Thanks for correcting me.Originally Posted by Peter3hg
I'm with Coco.
132Well torque is what makes you accelerate. And yes I did mean that. Thanks for correcting me.
108Big enough turbo and you wont even hear it
Its difficult to describe what effect torque actually has on moving a car. Yes it is what twists the wheels, but, especially on a diesel engine, the higher the engine rev's the harder it is to produce the torque (just imagine being in a really low gear on a bike, take off is very quick, but once you get to a certain point its hard to spin your legs fast enough to make any more additional force to the pedals, you outpace yourself) Hp is a way to measure torque across the RPM band and is a bit more useful (if not pretty much a fantasy number) in determining how fast a car will go.
There are two ways to make power: make a lot of torque(Viper), or make it rev very very high(S2000, F1). Since hp is an equation based on torque x rpm, raising either substantially will make good gains in power. Diesels have traditionally been high torque engines, but are hampered by usually redlining below 5,000rpm so horsepower output is far from a petrol engine.
102http://www.thetorquereport.com/2008/...v12_tdi_c.html
OH. MY. GOD. /FAP
0
Article/information from TopGear.com:
Some lovely pictures:Surprise! It's the diesel R8
We knew Audi was planning something big in Detroit, and here is it: the world's first diesel supercar.
This is the Audi R8 V12 TDi, and although it's being billed as a concept, it should be on the road within a couple of years.
Tearing massive holes in the road, quite possibly. The R8 V12 isn't a cooled-down version of Top Gear's Car of Year: in fact, the diesel version is billed as faster, more powerful and - of course - far more torquey than its petrol brother.
A few raw figures for you. The R8 TDi gets a 5.9-litre V12 twin-turbo diesel with 493bhp and, more scarily, a massive 738lb ft of torque. That'll shove the R8 to 62mph in 4.2 seconds - nearly a half-second quicker than the petrol version - and on to a top speed 'well over 186mph', according to Audi.
Awesome performance, in other words. But it won't come at the expense of economy: The R8 V12 returns 23mpg - just 4mpg less than the V6 TT - and although there's no word on emissions, Audi says it'll meet the 2014 Euro 6 regulations.
All of which sounds like an intoxicating combination, leaving us with just one worry: weight. Audi doesn't quote how much heavier the TDi unit is than the petrol V8, but too much extra weight could play havoc with the R8's delicate, wieldy handling.
However, Audi has managed to shave some weight from the diesel block by using stronger cast iron, allowing for thinner crankcase walls, which reduces weight by some 15 per cent.
Although the bodyshell of the R8 V12 is taken straight from the petrol version, the diesel-burner does get a few cosmetic enhancements. There's a glass roof with a NACA air duct in the middle, as well a new single-piece front bumper and bigger air intakes.
Inside the cabin, there's a bit of extra carbon fibre and, you'll notice, a manual gearbox. Word is that all the diesel torque would simply devour the DSG ?box, so a six-speed shifter it is - good news, because that's the ?box we liked on the petrol R8 anyhow.
We won't see the diesel R8 on the road until after the new Lamborghini Gallardo - and you'll see a V10 petrol version of the R8 beforehand, too. The V12 TDi could be the most tempting of the bunch, though - if the Audi engineers can make it handle like the petrol version. Here's hoping.
I must say that it looks absolutely, positively AWESOME! It's design is now even more sharper, futuristic and even a bit scary.
13
man, this car is awesome!
35it looks completely exaggerated and very vulgar... but apart from the blingbling wheels I love it...
18
13I must say that I absolutely adore the R8 V12 TDI. With the stylistic enhancements, the R8 finally looks agressive enough.
To the engine: I really can't understand the prejudices some of you have against diesel engines.
First of all, I don't think that it will matter that you can only rev to 5000 rpm. As long as the gear ratios are appropriate, it will be perfectly fine. Furthermore, a modern diesel engine can rev eagerly. Anyone driven a 535d? The engine revs up to 5000 rpm really quickly and gets more punchy the higher you rev it. Considering that the V12 TDI is also Twin-Turbocharged, a similar characteristic can be expected.
The sound will be perfectly fine. It won't be anything spectacular, but it won't sound like a tractor, either. Modern Common-Rail diesel engines (>6 cylinders) sound rather nice and soft, but you can barely never hear them clearly, because their dimmed away in big luxury cars. The 911 Turbo or the new GT-R as a comparison don't sound anything like you would expect from a sportscar either.
The weight will increase over the petrol R8, but only by about 100 kg. Remember that the R8 it mid-engined, so the heavy engine won't bring front focused weight distribution with it. Therefore I think that the handling won't suffer noticeably.
83It's striking, but now looks like a riced out TT.
13i totally agree with you! you just sumed up everything, that's to be said about this incredible car!
about it's weight (r8 v8 + 100kg = 1660kg expected): no one complaines about the weight of an bmw m5, m6 or a merc. sl (or should i remind you of the weight category of the ferrari 599 gtb?!) this cars weigh even more and they are no mid-engined cars!
in my oinion the r8 v12 tdi is going to make a good impression even on race tracks and not only on the autobahn!
35me = no one
0
It looks brutal!
128 I like it. It can probably spin all four wheels in the first four gears in the wet.
713 Ugh...all the fins and slashes and bling and angriness in the world can't hide the fact that it's a diesel sports car.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm a pedant. But still, Audi's got an uphill battle to fight and this isn't doing much (for me, anyway).
13bollocks! i can't understand your diesel-hater's point! some of you seem to be personally offended just by the fact that there may be diesel-motorised supercar in the future. but please spare us with the needless "petrol-engines-are-better" discussion because that is exactly the point all you diesel-haters don't understand: the question is not which concept is the better one! instead of being happy about the diversity of all the interesting concepts you just get pissed off and post rubbish, just like you did it and disturb this interesting thread this way!
55Imagine if they put that engine into a Scania.
74 Peak torque is from 1750 rpm untill 3000. Now that's a prime example of a narrow torque band, nice in a tractor or a truck, but not in a sportscar. Peak power is reached at 4000 rpm. I'm sorry but that's no sportscar engine... It also says that the block of the V12 is made from cast iron, which means it will be quite heavy, expect it to be at least twice as heavy as the standard all-alloy V8. And of course all of the other mods made to the car to make it handle the torque and the power will also add their bit. I wouldn't be suprized if it turned out to be everything from 350 kg to half-a-tonne heavier than the standard R8. So it's perhaps a smart descicion by Audi not to mention the over all weight of the car, considering the standard R8 is a bit porky as it is...
On the subject of noise, I suspect it won't make any, as Audi has used the R10 TDi's quietness as a marketing asset. Now, this coupled with the narrow torque/power-band and the extra weight doesn't bode too well for a sportscar.
Perhaps there is a reason why nobody has been bothered to try and make a diesel sportscar before. Just sayin'...
I miss Texas already... 
713 Wow it's called an opinion, no need to be a zealot about it. Did you actually have a rebuttal or did you just feel like flipping shit at me?
Read marcos_eirik's post, he said it nicely.
13my point is that the car didn't go for just one metre on real streets, no one (exept the audi-eingineers) knows how much it actually weighs and how it performs, and you are denigrating it without any reason althoug you don't know (not speculate) anything more, than we do, so why not giving it a chance?!
I'm not a diesel-zealot, i like petrol cars at least as much as you do, but the difference between you and me is that I'm saying: "there hasn't been a diesel supercar before, so why not go out and try develop one" while you are saying: "this is not going to work at all" although you don't know anything about it exept that it is a 4wd diesel, with 500 bhp and about 738lb ft of torque!
... get my point?
35the point is: making a diesel supercar is a bold move, but if anyone can pull it off it´s gonna be audi. Be it for the technical problems involved (weight, useable rev band), or just plain image reasons (racing pedigree of the tdis).
I personally would take a lightweight car over all the torque in the world any day of the week. A sportscar needs to be light, which is why the Veyron is the most ridicoulous piece of engineering in the history of the automobile as far as I´m concerned. Of course it´s amazing how an M5, which weighs about as much as an aircraft carrier, can be so heavy and yet still so quick, but it isn´t a sportscar. Now diesels are heavy, and fuck weight distribution, more weight is more weight, but let modern technology do it´s work. The reason why they haven´t released any figures yet is probably because they´re still hoping to cut it down on as much fat as possible, because let´s face it, they need to make this thing work.
A diesel in a supercar is going to bring lots of problems with it, the useable rev band as stated above, isn´t necessarily going to be one of them I suspect. But the reason the tdis were so fast at leMans was due largely to their consumption advantages, and when you´re just having fun on the ring the time you spend in the pits really isn´t going to be one of your concerns. Because if you can afford a car like that you´re not gonna be too worried about mpg figures (unless you´re gay of course). The trick about driving properly fast in a diesel is to keep gear changes to a minimum, to use the torque properly, and it isn´t going to be as intuitive as it would be in an 8000 rpm purebred petrol engine, which should kill a lot of the fun.
Anyhow, this is all speculation. It´s as stupid to worship this thing as the future supercar of supercars, just because Audi has managed to make a good leMans prototype, as it is to dismiss it as a stupid attempt at combining two things that never really fit together before. So just wait and see what the Quattro gmbh has in store for us before you jump to any conclusions, be they positive or negative.
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions 
Reply With Quote
