Cheap first cars...how much do they REALLY cost

[Posmo]

Originally Posted by public

The Alfa 164 is one of the best-looking cars made in the late '80s.

Certainly one of the best looking sedans, don't know about best looking overall though ..

They don't fit this thread though, since maintaining any Alfa is going to be expensive

[_HighVoltage_]

Well, it will be a pain in the ass, but it may fit the budget. In the USA, with a bit of luck, you can find a 164 for $1000-$1500.
Then, if you find somebody who is willing to rebuild the engine for another $1,500 you should be ok. Unless you get one with the automatic gearbox. The manual ones were pretty sturdy, because they used Getrag gears.

[thedguy]

Originally Posted by _HighVoltage_

Well, it will be a pain in the ass, but it may fit the budget. In the USA, with a bit of luck, you can find a 164 for $1000-$1500.
Then, if you find somebody who is willing to rebuild the engine for another $1,500 you should be ok. Unless you get one with the automatic gearbox. The manual ones were pretty sturdy, because they used Getrag gears.

What exactly fails on the engines to require a rebuild?

As much as I was being an asshat about them earlier, I do like them, and I did see one just the other day that looked mint on the freeway.

Speaking of old italian cars surviving the ages, about 8 months ago I saw a Maserati Biturbo idling in a neighbors driveway. It looked fairly beat up and driven by a woman. I was surprised it was still running. If I can ever find a place to work on one, and the funds to own it I'd so restore/build one the way the factory SHOULD have done it.

[_HighVoltage_]

From what I've read, the Alfa V6 had the nasty habit of bending valves.
I know, most car can bend valves, but with Alfa that was a big problem because they didn't have a lot of service stations and parts were always a big PITA to find.

The V6 engine was actually just as reliable as most of its European competitors, and everyone who knows about European cars knows the first rule of thumb - at 60k miles, change the freaking timing belt/chain!

A good bunch of Alfa owners in the states neglected that advice, because they found it too...troublesome, and thought that it will be okay if they keep driving with the old belt.

Speaking of "bunch" of a Alfa owners, do you know how many 164's were sold in the states from 93 to 95? Less than 1500!
And here is another interesting historical fact. Back in 1989 when the car was scheduled to be introduced in the states, guess who was Alfa's partner...Chrysler. The italians delayed the car by a whole year, Chrysler became unpatient and left Alfa to fight on its own.
And now Alfa is saving Chrysler

[Spectre]

Originally Posted by _HighVoltage_

The italians delayed the car by a whole year, Chrysler became unpatient and left Alfa to fight on its own.
And now Alfa is saving Chrysler

Can't really blame Chrysler after the Italians promised a Maserati-Chrysler joint venture and this came out of it two years late because Maserati couldn't be bothered to do the job right:



No, that's not a LeBaron. Read more here.

[JCE]

Originally Posted by _HighVoltage_

By the way, is that the stock rating for your Camaro - 6.5 seconds?

I don't think so. That time was with over 240,000 miles, catback exhaust, intake and some cold weather. I believe the "rated" stock 0-60mph for my car was 7.2s I think? I've only done crude times using a video camera, I really need to get it timed using a good timer once I get my engine put back in. With a fresh engine rebuilt using the current drivetrain configuration and a gutted interior I am going to make a bold claim of 6.0s flat. Can't wait to prove or disprove it.

[thedguy]

Originally Posted by _HighVoltage_

I want one badly. It is a gorgeous looking thing.
It is somewhat fast - 140mph and 0-60 under 9 sec.
Reliability...ahem...from all the research I have done, it seems that there are two types of 164's. Ones that go 250k miles with no mechanical problems at all, and the second ones that need an engine rebuild at just 50k miles.

On the subject of a 164...

Found one with some poorly rolled fenders, new timing belt, water pump, rebuilt heads, and koni shocks and random interior electrics that don't work for "$800, flexible on price, and special discount if used in lemons."

Just gotta drive to Irvine to pick it up

[Captain Soviet]

My friend got a Mazda MX-3 with the 1.8 V6 for $700 Canadian sometime last year. The body is a little rough, but the mechanicals are all sound, the engine revs great, and the gearbox and clutch sound just fine. In addition to all that, it has quasi-racing bucket seats, and I'm-almost-positive-illegal tinted windows. Quite a steal, I think.