Driving a manual... your experiences.

[ChaoZ]

Now, this may sound very silly, but I have not driven a manual transmission car.

Being only 22 in a middle-class family in Canada, all I've driven is the driving instructor's car and the family cars (1992 Honda Accord, 2003 Acura TSX). In Canada, were the vast majority of cars are automatic, it's not very surprising to not have driven a manual here.

Right now, I'm on the verge of graduating from university and will likely get my own car within a year. I have had my eyes of the 2004 Civic SiR (160hp Civic Hatch). That car is manual only (with a cool, rally-style, shifter).

My question and concern: although manuals are a requirement almost for race driving, how does it faire in day-to-day driving in stop and go traffic? Fortunately, I live in a relatively flat city, so not that many hills to worry about, but there are quite a few traffic lights.

Also: Is it hard to learn how to drive a manual? How long does it take for it to become second nature for most people?


I'd like to hear your experiences in learning to drive a manual, especially those of you who started on automatics.

[Jostyrostelli]

Well I didn't start with an automatic but have driven some.

I didn't find it hard to learn to drive and shift, learned it in a couple of times, after that you're gonna perfect your drivingstyle and shiftstyle. First the changing gear will be quite rough and bumpy but it gets better every week. The main thing to learn is getting the car rolling without stalling the car. Changing from 2nd to 3rd etc isn't that hard (just change and drop the clutch gently)
Just drive a few times with your dad or whatever and practice on parkinglots.

Manual requires (of course) some work, esp in the city. I hate it in trafficjams. When you have a heavy clutch you can get cramps when driving veeerryyyy slowly and have to get the car rolling over and over again.

The big plus is you can choose when to shift, you can shift directly from 3rd to 5th..I like that about manuals.


Hope it helps..

[Greatgraddage]

The only automatic I've ever driven is an old 4.5l jag (around a field!) so I'm not going to be hugely helpful but your best bet is to practice a lot before going on the roads properly, get a friend or family who has experiance to take you out, it will be like learning partly to drive again. In the UK if you take your test in an auto you have to retake it to drive a manual (you can drive both if you are tested in a manual), I assume that isn't the case in canada, but it may be worth checking. Manulas are much more rewarding to drive I feel, the satisfaction of a perfect gearchange when accelerating hard is bliss! You'll won't regret choosing a manual.

[Jostyrostelli]

the satisfaction of a perfect gearchange when accelerating hard is bliss! You'll won't regret choosing a manual.

Agreed! And it doesn't make you feel lazy either!

[Ultra_Kool_Dude]

Manual may not be ideal if you are going to be in a lot of stop & go traffic. My experience with manual was with my bike, and it was incredibly difficult to not stall. When I was learning I would stall it at huge intersections . Once I stalled it right in the middle of a busy intersection, and a transport was trying to turn left - That was embarrassing.

[bone]

i've only driven an automatic once, and i totally hated it.

what i hated most was the fact that you can't brake on the engine. when you see lights popping to red, and you're going 80kmh, go into 2nd, and the car will slow down automatically, with an automatic you realy have to push that bloody brake every time

i hate braking, i dunno why, but if i can slow down on the engine, i will

[ChaoZ]

Originally Posted by bone

i've only driven an automatic once, and i totally hated it.

what i hated most was the fact that you can't brake on the engine. when you see lights popping to red, and you're going 80kmh, go into 2nd, and the car will slow down automatically, with an automatic you realy have to push that bloody brake every time

i hate braking, i dunno why, but if i can slow down on the engine, i will

Quite conversely, when I experimented with the semi-auto in the TSX, I found it disconcerting to use the engine for braking. I don't know how different it is from a real manual though. There's a certain lag behind my shift and the engine response, so that may have ruined things for me.

[Jostyrostelli]

Slowing down on the engine saves fuel too! On modern cars at least. It stops injecting fuel in the cilinders, so when you do it alot, it saves you money and you save the brakescalipers/drums too

[zeffez]

and on old cars you can make flames when enginebraking a tuned engine.. not that I've ever done that

as far as driving a manual, it's more or less a matter of getting used to it.. main thing is getting used to using you left leg
Once you get good enough you start playing with left-foot-braking or turbolag braking

[Jostyrostelli]

LOL left food braking? I tried that a few times, and my head nearly touched the windshield

Turbolag braking?

[zeffez]

left foot braking and turbolag braking are much the same.. depends on which foot you use.. left foot braking you put down the clutch and brake with the same foot leaving your right foot free to keep engine revs up.
turbo-lag braking is left foot on clutch and brake+rev with right foot..

kindda takes some practice to master.. I'm not nearly there.. only just learning

for now I'm still faster driving like my driving instructor showed me when I got my license.. but improving my racing skills every time I'm bored

[Jostyrostelli]

Ahh oke, used to do that in the DHL Merc 311, the diesel, I could do it in that one!! Not in any other cars i've driving though..

[mmap]

hmmm... Have driven a lot of automatics (everything from 40's americans to the latest eurothingys) and when ever I am in a traffic jam with one of them I just have a smile on my face because of the ease of driving. But when driving normally I always curse them for not changing when I want them to or them being in the wrong gear... (works vice versa also, if I am in a traffic jam with a manual you can see me screaming to it )

like Jostyrostelli said the only real problem with a manual is getting the car rolling, once moving changing gears is an easy and natural thing...

And about how long it takes to learn this?? well I have been driving manuals for 8 years now and still I have to learn the clutch/gas combo on every new car I drive cause they are almost all different. (anyone with any experiece with Lada Samaras?? ABSOLUTELY the worst ones out there!!)

[ChaoZ]

One further thing: As said above, there cars with heavy and light clutches. Do Hondas generally have good and easy to handle MTs?

[Phix]

Originally Posted by zeffez

left foot braking and turbolag braking are much the same.. depends on which foot you use.. left foot braking you put down the clutch and brake with the same foot leaving your right foot free to keep engine revs up.
turbo-lag braking is left foot on clutch and brake+rev with right foot..

kindda takes some practice to master.. I'm not nearly there.. only just learning

for now I'm still faster driving like my driving instructor showed me when I got my license.. but improving my racing skills every time I'm bored

I think you mean 'Heel-Toe Downshift' where you start braking for a corner, at the last moment clutch in and while still on the brakes move the heel of your right foot over to the throttle and blip the throttle and downshift so the revs are high and when you come out of the corner it'll all be smooth and nice. That takes A LOT of practice though and you can practice it on the roads as well since it's nothing dangerous.

Left-foot braking is mostly used in front-wheel cars to counter understeer. Used usually after the heel-toe manuver and mid-corner, you can slide your left foot onto the brake and gently pulse it to increase traction on the front... obviously, this is really difficult since too much braking will just fuck it up. and I've never heard of turbo-lag braking

Also, always always ALWAYS easier to learn manual after you've learned the proper driving techniques. I first learned to drive at the age of 14 in a 1996 Chevy Lumina automatic (P.O.S.) It was blah. Then my brother bought a 1992 Toyota Paseo 5-spd as a temporary car until he can get a 240SX. I only stalled it in rare occasions because I was so afraid of stalling it that I would give it way too much gas thus killing the clutch and tires. After I remedied this problem, I hit another. Balancing the clutch and gas from a stop to gently move in stop-and-go traffic kept making me lug the engine... thus killign the tranny and engine. Eventually, I got rid of that problem too. At most, I'd rev it up to 2000 which is still a lot to get the car moving but a lot better than before.

A problem I have now is shifting... when I chagne gears and mid-way through releasing the clutch pedal I give it gas too early so I kill the clutch. Or I change gears but wait too long to actually give it some gas and release the clutch. Over the last few months I've gotten rid of that problem as well. Now, I'm working on downshifting for corners (not heel-toe, just regular downshifting) and so far I've been getting better. First time I did it I "blipped" (more like /kicked/) the throttle and I got it up .... hah, 6000rpm (6800rpm redline) and let go of the clutch pedal. Let's just say I'm surprised the drivetrain survived that. I was going from 3rd to 2nd, btw.

Anyway, shit, I just got caught up in the moment remembering all the fun I had learning manny tranny and the shit I've done to my brother's car. All in all, it all comes down to balancing the clutch and gas. Ayup.

[sain]

Heel & toe

[Jostyrostelli]

Originally Posted by ChaoZ

One further thing: As said above, there cars with heavy and light clutches. Do Hondas generally have good and easy to handle MTs?

Ask Sir_Dude, he might give you some advice on the old Honda Civics.

[zeffez]

@PHix: I guess it's different over there.. I use leftfoot braking for fast cornering/drifting in high boost rally cars (controlling the drift with the clutch and brakes without loosing boost) and turbolagbraking is for tight corners where you change gears (clutch all the way down) and keep revs on the engine while max braking.. not much use on the streets though.. ain't really room for big drifts and sideways cornering

[Go Low]

If you do your drivers test in Germany on an automatic you are not allowed to drive manual (which basically means, virtually noone does it over here). Since my parents always had and have automatic, I've driven quite a lot of them. You can use the engine for breaking, of course. Some have either an overdrive button (which turns the highest gear "off) or if not at least they have a 3, 2, 1 or L or whatever where you can put the stick in. My driving teacher always told me it is ok to shift down, but not if you rev the engine up (if you are driving like a responsible driver and want to be gently to your engine), because the engine is not made for braking, for braking there is something called... brakes Another thing that I noticed, I thought it is much easier to start rolling in the snow with automatic, because the car starts rolling against the break, so you can adjust it very precise. And driving in a traffic jam is a lot more comfortable with an automatic. But I don't want to say that I always prefer automatic, I have more comfort with automatic, but more fun with manual stick

[ESPNSTI]

It's been ages since I learned to drive manual, so I don't remember how long it takes.
I don't find it a hassle at all during stop and go, but maybe that's just me.
Every car is different, and some cars are easier than others.
Interestingly, the STI seems to be smoothest if you drive it fast

Basically I think the easiest way to learn is this:
Step on the clutch.
Give it a bit of gas (2000 rpm or so) and hold it there.
Slowly release the clutch until you feel it "grip".
At that point you can feed in more power and release the clutch (gently).

In certain cars, you can get the car rolling without pressing the gas pedal at all if you release the clutch slow enough.
I guess that would be the easiest to practice first.