Friends Don't Let Friends Modify Cars

[zenon]

I found this article on my morning run of blogs. It's a pretty controversial thing to say these days, but I can't really say I completely disagree with him:

Originally Posted by Edmunds.com

Friends Don't Let Friends Modify Cars

03-17-2005

Today, it's difficult to make cars better and extremely easy to make them worse. Or dangerous.

As a journalist driving modified cars, I've been sprayed with gasoline, boiling coolant, super-heated transmission fluid and nitrous oxide. (The latter was more entertaining than the former.) Several have burst into flames. Throttles have stuck wide open, brake calipers snapped clean off, suspensions ripped from their mounts and seatbelt mounting hardware has dropped into my lap. All this is on top of the expected thrown connecting rod, blown head gasket, exploded clutch, disintegrated turbocharger and broken timing belt.

The vast majority of these vehicles were built by professionals. Many were from big-name tuners. Most performed as if they were constructed in a shop class at a high school with a lax drug policy. Once, after a suspension component fell off a car from a big-name tuner, the car actually handled better.

For every modified and tuner car that performed better than stock, I've driven numerous examples that were slower. If they were quicker, it was often in an area that can't be used on the street. What's the use of gaining 0.2 second in the quarter-mile if the car is slower 0-60 mph? And costs $10,000 more?

Long ago — when your grandparents were kids and the president was Dwight Eisenhower — it was easy to improve cars. Back then, carmakers designed vehicles largely for production convenience. It's not difficult to improve the handling of a car that had one steering idler arm a little longer than a man's shoe and the other more than the length of his arm: Stiffen the suspension to the point that it doesn't move. Also, in the olden days, cars were so simple virtually anybody could work on them. Replacing the stock two-barrel carburetor (ask your grandfather) with a four-barrel reaped easy power: There were no sensors or computers to confuse, as often happens if you tinker with today's engines.

The Old Ones wonder why today's kids want to "improve" cars. This is partially because something like an '05 Mustang V6 — does the term "secretary's car" come to mind? — has more horsepower and is quicker than an '84 Corvette. Put both on the same tires and the '05 V6 would give the '84 Vette all it could handle on a road racing circuit.

I'm guilty of modifying cars. Mea culpa. In an effort to improve a very sweet handling sport sedan, I added the biggest antiroll bars and stiffest shocks I could find. The result sucked. One doesn't have to reinstall too many stock antiroll bars and redeal with a strut compressor to earn a bad attitude about modifying cars.

Recently, I autocrossed a pair of Subaru WRXs. One was a dead-stock WRX. The other, a tricked-out STi lowered with stiffer springs, shocks and bars and an exhaust kit and air filter. The STi is supposed to have an advantage of some 70 horsepower. Maybe the exhaust and filter moved the power up in the rev band where it couldn't be used. The lowered, stiffened STi regularly bottomed against its bump stops. When a car hits its bump stops, the spring rate goes to infinity and tire grip drops to near zero. This caused the STi to leap into the worst understeer I've experienced with inflated front tires. Meanwhile, in the unmodified WRX, I could be hard in the throttle at the same point. The result: The dead-stock WRX was at least as quick as the STi and far easier to drive. Easy to make worse, harder to make better.

Don't get me started on brake "upgrades." On one hand I can count the brake modifications that out-performed stock. Auto manufacturers spend millions of dollars on brake design, while aftermarket brake manufacturers often allow their customers to participate in the development process. Gulp.

Fitting larger-diameter wheels is another excellent opportunity to reduce performance. Wagon-wheel-sized wheels are all about bling and little about blast. Most larger-diameter wheels are notably heavier than what they're replacing: Aluminum is heavier than the air and rubber. This additional mass requires more horsepower to accelerate, more braking power to stop and more shock valving to control. Translation: Bigger equals slower. Also, lower-profile tires tend to be more difficult to drive at the limit. Most drivers will be quicker and in better control on 17s than on 19s.

On the street, it's almost impossible to accurately assess whether a modification has aided performance. People often judge handling by how the car rides and acceleration by noise: If it's rough and loud, it's got to handle better and be quicker, they think. This is the "Bactine Theory": If the medicine hurts, it must be working. The Placebo Effect also comes into play: If you've just spent a couple of grand to improve something, you will believe it's working.

The only modification that consistently produces positive results are tires. A change from original-equipment rubber to expensive gumballs will reap guaranteed thrills. If you like your car but want more from it, step up to the best ultrahigh-performance tire.

My best advice is this: If you don't like your car and want to make it better, buy something else.

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=105024

I'd be really interested in hearing people's thoughts on this subject. Post away.

[Jostyrostelli]

Well I think he knows what he's talking about. I agree that 'tuning' your car nowadays is a lot more difficult than in the 'olden days'. For instance, if you wanna change a light-bulb from your headlightset you'll need to go to the mechanic to do it, the engine-bay is fully packed with electronics. I don't believe bad cars are made today, so modifying a car to 'improve' it, is nearly impossible or very very expensive.

As he said, improving the Impreza WRX is useless. If you want to have a sportscar, buy a sportcar but don't modify a Civic, badly. Often when tuning a regular everyday-use car it's more expensive, and never the quality you wanted.

When I'm planning on buying a new car and I don't have a lot of money, I'll buy a cheap car with good mileage. Or maybe I'll save some more, use the train in the meantime, and buy a sportcar and leave it as stock as possible. But I'm definetly not planning on tuning my car, parts are expensive (for a student) so you're not gonna buy the most expensive, so you'll choose the cheaper ones, which are more sensitive to break down.
So, in the end you'll be losing more money on your rusty Civic, and you could've bought a nice car.

Interesting read btw.

[Ultra_Kool_Dude]

I say get a car that will get you from point a to b and not break down, and get a bike for when you want to go fast - It's cheaper. My bike was only 6k, and the only mods I need to do are adding cool Yoshimura stickers and a carbon fibre exhaust. 8)

[Jostyrostelli]

I think I've never seen pics of your bike...post em! 8)

[Ultra_Kool_Dude]

^ I've been meaning to get around to it. You've got to see how lousy my digital camera is (0.3 megalpixels).

[Dark_Templer_102]

I mean i see the point of that...but what about small modifcations to the engine and stuff? And peronally i would "mod" my car (if i get one) with a better sound system (nothing too special) and prob tune the engine a bit

[Jostyrostelli]

^He's talking about serious modifications to your car, new brakes, roll-bar, stiffer suspension, chiptuning, wider tyre etc. to 'enhance' performance...

[pdanev]

I get his point, and he's right about the everyday use - street issue. Even if u have a 1000+hp muscle car, or skyline or whatever, u will never make use of it. A lot of the "sport" equipment also isnt designed for everyday use, driving at normal rpm.

I think the reason why a lot of the big tuners make mistakes is due to cost saving attempts + profit desires. Several examples are just on the net, burned gemballa gt3, messed up gearbox in a gemballa cayenne, cracked up brabus brakes etc etc etc. And if u read all those stories, u most likely find that the car was tuned quickly, or crappy parts were used, or safety checks/test were simply skipped etc etc etc.

Nevertheless, i'd tune my car. But! I wouldnt buy a new car, i'd buy a second hand crappy one, and rip it apart completely anyway Or if money wouldnt be an issue i'd go to japan cos imo things are a bit different there

[andyhui01]

I honestly don't see the point in tuning every day normal cars like civics, over here people buy protons and transplant a Evo Engine and put a center and rear diff to make it 4wheel drive, they spend about 3-4k USD alltogether... I mean with that extra cash, you could have got a proper sports car.

However, tuning cars like Subaru's, Evo's, Skylines and all is ok.. because those cars are meant to be tuned... but please no civics

[.canada.loves.clarkson.]

You guys would laugh your balls off if you saw some of the shit the idiots do over here in ontario. Like a huge downforce wing on a Pontiac sunfire (94 bhp), with huge exhaust pipe tips and no muffler and neon glowing lights. Its so putrid. Me and my friends laugh at them and ask questions like..."Do you find with all that snarling Horsepower, you couldn't deal without the spoiler"?

[Leppy]

Some of what the guy says is true... but people who put 19's on their cars don't do it for performance. They do it for looks.

Brake upgrades? I don't understand his arguement about them... If you get brand name brake upgrades (AP racing etc) they'll be head and shoulders above stock.

Some of what he says is true.... but I don't agree with all of it.

[Dark_Templer_102]

U only really need those mods if ur like dirinv in the Gumball 3000

[bone]

Originally Posted by Jostyrostelli

Well I think he knows what he's talking about. I agree that 'tuning' your car nowadays is a lot more difficult than in the 'olden days'. For instance, if you wanna change a light-bulb from your headlightset you'll need to go to the mechanic to do it, the engine-bay is fully packed with electronics. I don't believe bad cars are made today, so modifying a car to 'improve' it, is nearly impossible or very very expensive.

i don't agree. modern cars are big compromise. they wanne give performance, but still wanne be luxerious. unless you buy a die hard sportscar, every (quality) aftermarket suspension will be better (for performance) than the original one. all cars benefit from wider tires, from factory they get tires which give enough grip, but don't have to much friction to improve mpg. and ALL cars benefit from chip tuning. a stock chip is made so the engine would work in all temperatures, with all qualities of fuel available. you don't need that, put in a chip with local settings, you power will increase, and so might your mpg
same with brakes, the bigger the better, no discussion
a car can be improved so much when it comes out of the factory (unless it's a WRX, so can an impreza)

[uncivilised]

the author didnt mention anything about engine conversions

the thing i like the most is getting normal every cars and making em into sleepers

for example

someone has put a toyota v8 into a 1985 MX73 toyota cressida. imagine the reactions when people hear a rumbling v8 coming out of a grandpa mobile

[zenon]

Originally Posted by uncivilised

someone has put a toyota v8 into a 1985 MX73 toyota cressida. imagine the reactions when people hear a rumbling v8 coming out of a grandpa mobile

...And then imagine their reactions as the extra weight in the front end makes it brutally understeer around the first corner it encounters.

[andyhui01]

dude... engine conversions are never cool.... you have to tell people what's under the hood... however... some are cool if they are tastefully done... but if you make a sleeper... it should be of something that is already quite modern... like putting a K20A type-r engine with bolt on turbo on a regular civic

[uncivilised]

"And then imagine their reactions as the extra weight in the front end makes it brutally understeer around the first corner it encounters"

soz to be a smartass but the toyota v8 (1uzfe) has an all alloy block
the stock motor of a cressida (5MGE-5ME depeding on country) has an iron block

the 1uzfe v8 is lighter than the 5mge straight 6

dont forget the suspension has been changed to suit the motor. this wasnt a dodgy conversion. this guy took his time with everything done.

i understand you have to be logical when doing engine conversions.

[chaos386]

I get the guys overall point, that most people don't need to mod their cars and only end up making their cars worse, but no one "needs" a sportscar either. Half the fun in modding a car is getting to know it inside out and making it your own. I doubt everyone who tunes their car uses it for auto-crossing or track racing, so even if the engine mods don't make it accelerate any faster, if it sounds cooler, feels faster and makes you happy, what's wrong with it?

I also think he has a very American view on suspension tuning (harder=better). I'm reminded of when Clarckson was describing the BMW Z4's suspension as American: "[American accent]Hey, it's sporty! It's got no suspension, it's sporty!" No wonder these cars handled worse. IMO the only way to improve suspension is to actually tune it, as in small changes to suit your driving style and conditions. You have to spend a lot of time on the track and have to be a pretty good racer before you know what will work for you. That's where adjustable suspension components are good, because you can try out different setups without buying new parts for each change.

In the end though, he has waaaaaaaaaaaayyyy more experience with this than I do, so he's more qualified to talk about it.

[andyhui01]

^modding your car is quite fun... and through the process of visiting the car garages and helping out my uncle at home to fix his cars or install parts... I've learnt alot about the engine and how it works, how to do this and that, what it is for and all...

[zenon]

Originally Posted by uncivilised

"And then imagine their reactions as the extra weight in the front end makes it brutally understeer around the first corner it encounters"

soz to be a smartass but the toyota v8 (1uzfe) has an all alloy block
the stock motor of a cressida (5MGE-5ME depeding on country) has an iron block

the 1uzfe v8 is lighter than the 5mge straight 6

dont forget the suspension has been changed to suit the motor. this wasnt a dodgy conversion. this guy took his time with everything done.

i understand you have to be logical when doing engine conversions.

Even with lighter engine swaps, you still run into issues from weight distribution. Even a light V8 is going to put more weight in front of the tires on a car designed for a 4 cylinder engine.

I do like the concept of an engine swap, but I've never seen an engine swapped car that can do more than just go fast in a straight line.