Oh man GM releases another hybrid SUV (Escalade Hybrid)

[zeoniks]

http://www.autoblog.com/2008/08/08/c...-685/#comments

Granted the jump in mileage is significantly higher than it's non-hybrid version (20 city/21 highway), but comparatively speaking it's still worse than most gasoline-only cars.

I don't know if the rest feel this way, but I find that most hybrid versions of many cars aren't that much better than gasoline-only counter parts; their mileage doesn't justify the significantly higher price tag and they're not better for the environment, despite what many people think.

The only hybrid cars that I like are the Prius and possibly the new Honda hybrid coming out, despite this forum's hate toward the Prius.

EDIT:

Whoops. Suppose to be in General Automotive

[smitman556678]

lmao, I can't wait to here Clarkson's rant on this next season!!

[matt2000]

Wow 20mpg! That's still about 10 short of most cars these days. I like the way they boast about it dropping down to 4 cylinders to save fuel, but why not just make a 4 cylinder car instead of having 8? Anyway Cars have done that for years, especially in Formula 1.

Putting big 'HYBRID' stickers on the side isn't going to help save you from Greenpeace either.

[Cole P]

Lol, such a waste of time and money, but I suppose there are people out there that would think they're cheating the environmentalists. Speaking of hybrids, I checked out that study Jeremy referenced early in the series about hybrids being more detrimental to the environment than a Hummer and its true, I'll never look at a hybrid the same way again.

Here's a link to that article: http://clubs.ccsu.edu/recorder/edito...asp?NewsID=188

[bartboy9891]

Originally Posted by Cole P

Lol, such a waste of time and money, but I suppose there are people out there that would think they're cheating the environmentalists. Speaking of hybrids, I checked out that study Jeremy referenced early in the series about hybrids being more detrimental to the environment than a Hummer and its true, I'll never look at a hybrid the same way again.

Here's a link to that article: http://clubs.ccsu.edu/recorder/edito...asp?NewsID=188

There are a few problems with both that article and the "Dust to Dust" report. They mention the Sudbury nickel mines as being very barren and it being used to simulate the surface of the moon. But that is an outdated assumption since millions of trees have been planted around that area to bring it back to the way it was.
http://www.sudburysoilsstudy.com/EN/...background.asp

There is a land reclamation program in Sudbury that the mining companies themselves take part in. Here's a report of their progress from a few years ago:
http://www.city.greatersudbury.on.ca...ort%202005.pdf

The "Dust to Dust" report itself has come under fire because many of the assumptions they make may not be completely true. The "Dust to Dust" report has been updated several times so I don't know if their original conclusion has changed or not. I think the main discrepancy was between the resources that the Prius compared to the resources that the Hummer H3 uses. There was an argument that the Hummer uses significantly more metal than the Prius does to the point where it's worse than the Prius in terms of lifetime CO2 production. Whether the CNW "Dust to Dust" report has addressed these issues, I don't know.

[Cobol74]

Things are much more complex than Governments can actually deal with - so long as car manufacturers are trying to bring down emissions whilst at the same time improve performance which I beleive they are trying to do then I am happy (well ish).


This is one such attempt and should be recognised as such.

[Old Lace]

I don't know if everyone thinks the same as me but from what I've seen most hybrid owners only bought said car as a type of eco-minded status symbol. It kinda annoys me.

[racingfan1]

And we're surprised by GM releasing an Escalade hybrid? I mean, they've already done it, see Chevrolet Tahoe Hybrid, same vehicle.

[zeoniks]

Originally Posted by Old Lace

I don't know if everyone thinks the same as me but from what I've seen most hybrid owners only bought said car as a type of eco-minded status symbol. It kinda annoys me.

That's one of the main reasons that people buy hybrids, but as far as I'm concerned, people in New York City who drive this car buy it because 1) it gets amazing mileage 2) gets to brag about said mileage.

I think the Prius does the job well as far as hybrid vehicles go. 45 city miles per gallon is an amazing feat and there is no denying it.

[zeoniks]

Originally Posted by Cobol74

Things are much more complex than Governments can actually deal with - so long as car manufacturers are trying to bring down emissions whilst at the same time improve performance which I beleive they are trying to do then I am happy (well ish).


This is one such attempt and should be recognised as such.

I totally agree with you on this, but SUVs aren't desirable anymore. Hybrid or not, they still drink gasoline like people drink water. It's an improvement in mileage, but an SUV will always be an SUV. Why not turn the Chevy Cobalt into a hybrid?

[Cobol74]

If there were money in it (or someone thought so) they would do it. One thought: -

what Governments say they mean and what they really mean are not always the same.

If one was to drive around in a non polluting motor, do you think that (I mean everyone, if the motor manufacturers get an answer) the tax bill would be zero?



No neither do I.

[Fenah]

Its better then getting 10 mpg. A useless hybrid yes, but heck suvs ( that does not include trucks ) are such a waste in todays market anyways. I guess every bit helps?

[optimusprime]

While I find hybrid vehicles thermodynamically ridiculous, in concept SUVs benefit most.

EX (assumptions - 40% city, 60% highway):
Escalade - 16.2mpg = 0.0617 gallon/mile
Escalade hybrid - 20.6mpg = 0.0485 gallons/mile

Over, say, 100k miles vehicle life, the hybrid will save over 1300 gallons of gas ~$5k.

EX2:
Toyota Corolla - 31.4mpg = 0.0318 gallon/mile
Toyota Prius - 46.2mpg = 0.0216 gallon/mile

Again, 100k miles, and the hybrid saves only 1020 gallons of gas ~$4k.

Corolla MSRP - $15,250
Prius MSRP - $21,500

In conclusion, an Escalade hybrid will save more gas than a Prius. Also, buying a Corolla instead of a Prius will save you over $2k, even at $4/gal gasoline. More importantly, you're less likely to be an eco-idiot... unless you're a smart eco-idiot who realizes the extremely un-green aspects of Prius production.

[Vette Boss]

Looks like all the idiot celebrities can trade in the Prius now, for one of these.

[Hidden_Hunter]

Originally Posted by matt2000

Wow 20mpg! That's still about 10 short of most cars these days. I like the way they boast about it dropping down to 4 cylinders to save fuel, but why not just make a 4 cylinder car instead of having 8? Anyway Cars have done that for years, especially in Formula 1.

Putting big 'HYBRID' stickers on the side isn't going to help save you from Greenpeace either.

Because as a four cyl you'd probably get just as bad economy because the engine would have to be in the stratosphere all the time because the car is so heavy

[optimusprime]

Oh, and also, an Escalade seats 9 compared to the Prius' 5.

Thus -
Escalade hybrid - 0.00538 gallons/mile/passenger
Prius - 0.00432 gallons/mile/passenger

So, on a 9-passenger, 10k mile voyage, a (two) Prius(es) will save just 53 gallons ($200) over the gas-guzzlingest SUV.

Eat it, greenies.

[optimusprime]

In conclusion, the most economical vehicle in the world a very large van.

Ford E-Series - 17.4mpg - 0.05747 gallons/mile
0.003831 gallons/mile/passenger

On a 1k mile, 15-passenger trip (like, for example, to an eco-convention?), a gigantic van is more fuel efficient than a Toyota Prius by a full 7 gallons - almost exactly 100kg of that most evil of gasses, CO2.

[Cole P]

Originally Posted by Cobol74

Things are much more complex than Governments can actually deal with - so long as car manufacturers are trying to bring down emissions whilst at the same time improve performance which I beleive they are trying to do then I am happy (well ish).


This is one such attempt and should be recognised as such.

I agree completely. The problem, I believe, is that most manufactures pander to the average consumer who sees only the MPG rating. Manufacturers need to take a look at their supply chain and material consumption as well.

Also, I think too much emphasis is placed on the automotive industry as the source of CO2. They are a major contributor yes, but they get most of the bad press.

[Old Lace]

Exactly! No one mentions other factors such as factories and power plants. I think it's because we see cars everyday and that's the first thing people jump all over and scapegoat. I wonder if these eco people are doing anything else beside moan about how evil cars are while drinking their overpriced starbucks latte.

[zeoniks]

Originally Posted by optimusprime

Oh, and also, an Escalade seats 9 compared to the Prius' 5.

Thus -
Escalade hybrid - 0.00538 gallons/mile/passenger
Prius - 0.00432 gallons/mile/passenger

So, on a 9-passenger, 10k mile voyage, a (two) Prius(es) will save just 53 gallons ($200) over the gas-guzzlingest SUV.

Eat it, greenies.

You're assuming that most cars are filled up to capacity when they hit the road. I'm not saying you're wrong, but can only applied to one specific situation.