~The First One Hundred Days~

Dogbert said:
While the point about children being on state insurance instead of private insurance is a loosely valid one, if not highly debatable... really? The "you're taxing the poor by taxing cigarettes" defense again? Bonus points for trying to keep children of legal immigrants from qualifying.
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I have an easy solution: stop smoking.
 
So when they start increasing the tax on gasoline to pay for "X". The solution would be to stop driving as much?
 
Firecat said:
So when they start increasing the tax on gasoline to pay for "X". The solution would be to stop driving as much?
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No, because I can see the point with driving a car. With smoking, I can't. Sorry... :dunno:
 
Does it matter if you don't see the point in smoking? If people want to, they have the right to do so.
 
Firecat said:
Does it matter if you don't see the point in smoking? If people want to, they have the right to do so.
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And they also have the right to pay taxes on whatever they want to do.

If my state government were to raise the 7-odd percent tax on everything I buy, does that mean that they want me to stop buying things? No. If the government wants to raise the tax on fuel, does that mean they want me to stop driving? No. If they wanted me to stop doing anything, why would they increase the amount of money they get from me when I do it?
 
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Why? Because they know all smokers will suck it up (pun intended) and pay?
 
I just think it's wrong to target one group and make them subsidize a program.
 
Then what's sales tax? That targets any for-profit institution or individual.
What's personal property tax? That targets property owners.
What's income tax? That targets anyone that makes a certain amount of money.

If you're against taxes, then that's fine and we just disagree on principle... but you can't say you're against "targeting" smokers for higher taxes when other groups of people are targeted all the time.
 
You can't compare it with sales or income tax. But if they were to raise property tax and say the money gained from the increase will go specifically towards whatever program (welfare or not) which doesn't benefit me as a homeowner, then I would have a problem with that.

They are going after smokers because they are an easy target.
 
But why are they an easy target? What makes them so special?
 
Because there is a stigma associated with smokers and the tobacco industry, so they know that non-smokers probably won't care if they tax them further.

If they want to increase programs etc, they should refrain from raising taxes and look at cutting spending.
 
Firecat said:
Does it matter if you don't see the point in smoking? If people want to, they have the right to do so.
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The difference is, your enjoyment is harming somebody else. If people want to smoke in their own home, then fine. Just not in public, where some poor bastard has to breath the stuff in and go home stinking of cigarettes.
 
Plissken said:
The difference is, your enjoyment is harming somebody else. If people want to smoke in their own home, then fine. Just not in public, where some poor bastard has to breath the stuff in and go home stinking of cigarettes.
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That was not part of the discussion. And I don't think cigarette smoking is adding that much to the air pollution that already exists and people are breathing in.
 
Twerp128 said:
^Funny, because of rising health care costs my uncle doesn't think he'll be able to offer his employees health insurance next year because of rising costs, a slow economy, on top of that he's expecting his business to be taxed quite a bit more this coming year.

But hey at least their kids we'll be able to have health care, and by then hopefully Obama will have a social program to force all those other adults into, if they should be so grateful.

I really do like some of the things Obama has done, he handled the Daschle thing well, and I'm liking his foreign policy, but you can't fix a broken economy by raising taxes and spending more.
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The expansion/re-authorization of SCHIP has been floating around Congress for about two years now. It passed twice with fairly strong Bi-Partisan support but Bush vetoed it TWICE. The second time they thought they might have enough votes to beat the veto but they didn't quite make it. The dems pulled some stuff out of the bill that were included in this version. The coverage for legal immigrant children was one of the things that was put back in. This would have been passed long ago if Bush had just taken the hint from the majority of his party and passed it and it would have been more in line with republican ideals too.
 
Firecat said:
That was not part of the discussion. And I don't think cigarette smoking is adding that much to the air pollution that already exists and people are breathing in.
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Smokers aren't allowed to smoke in most public places anyway. I'm not a smoker, I just see people who smoke a pack a week get it up the ass from taxes then insurance. Who are they going to target next, tea drinkers?
 
Here's the bottom line...
Smokers are taxed because lawmakers know they'll pay it. Taxing addicting things is so easy.

If the government were to suddenly start taxing tea and make it at a level you think was "unreasonable", you'd stop drinking tea, right?

How many smokers do you think stop buying cigarettes every time they raise taxes? For every person that runs out of money or decides to kick their addiction, I'm sure there's another one that takes their place.
 
Dogbert said:
Here's the bottom line...
Smokers are taxed because lawmakers know they'll pay it. Taxing addicting things is so easy.

If the government were to suddenly start taxing tea and make it at a level you think was "unreasonable", you'd stop drinking tea, right?

How many smokers do you think stop buying cigarettes every time they raise taxes? For every person that runs out of money or decides to kick their addiction, I'm sure there's another one that takes their place.
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You know what addiction they need start taxing...

WOW memberships.
 
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