Project Natal - Xbox's motion sensor thingy

pepitko

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2007
Messages
1,913
Location
Prague, CZ
Car(s)
Audi A5, Ducati M796
This has been mentioned a bit in the E3 thread, but it deserves a thread of its own :).

The Project Natal is a motion sensor camera for Xbox that was introduced at E3 just a couple of days ago.
What do you people think? Would you buy it and more importantly would you use it?
I think it's quite cool, but will work on only a certain types of games, PS3's Heavy Rain could be fun, but for majority of games, I think I'd still use a regular controller.

In case you don't know what I'm on about have a look below:
[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oACt9R9z37U[/YOUTUBE]
 
Last edited:
I knwo that one is just a demo, but it looks FUCKING AWESOME. I WANT ONE NOW!
I really do hope that it is just a addon and it isnt too expensive.
 
I knwo that one is just a demo, but it looks FUCKING AWESOME. I WANT ONE NOW!
I really do hope that it is just a addon and it isnt too expensive.

The VP guy who introduced it said it will be available for "...every Xbox 360 we have sold, and every Xbox 360 we will sell." So, yes, it is an addon; as for cost, I would hope relatively cheap, as they are aiming this at people who are casual gamers, or people who haven't gotten into gaming.
 
I know this is a forum orientated around TV / Entertainment and most the members are couch potatoes, so my reply will probably not go down at all well.

I find this use of technology depressing. Why would you want to stay in your own house with a bunch of friends when you could be out enjoying yourselves and making the most of the fantastic weather we're in receipt of at the moment?

It's like the Nintendo Wii and that fitness training hogswash, I think someone recently posted on FinalGear about a man who managed to lose 12Lbs with that over two months. Personally, I prefer going to the gym. I've managed to use the current depression situation to barter them down to giving me a fantastic membership deal and by my calculations the cost of buying "Wii fit," is the same as 3-4 months of my membership fees and there are shed loads of other benefits too.

Looks like gaming is severely starting to infringe on the way people live their lives.
 
I know this is a forum orientated around TV / Entertainment and most the members are couch potatoes, so my reply will probably not go down at all well.

I find this use of technology depressing. Why would you want to stay in your own house with a bunch of friends when you could be out enjoying yourselves and making the most of the fantastic weather we're in receipt of at the moment?

It's like the Nintendo Wii and that fitness training hogswash, I think someone recently posted on FinalGear about a man who managed to lose 12Lbs with that over two months. Personally, I prefer going to the gym. I've managed to use the current depression situation to barter them down to giving me a fantastic membership deal and by my calculations the cost of buying "Wii fit," is the same as 3-4 months of my membership fees and there are shed loads of other benefits too.

Looks like gaming is severely starting to infringe on the way people live their lives.

When you get a little bit older you'll understand, that generally people find time for everything, the gym, work, studies and hobbies (including gaming), only to do away with "Why?" question.
 
Last edited:
When you get a little bit older you'll understand, that generally people find time for everything, the gym, work, studies and hobbies (including gaming), only to do away with "Why?" question.

The problem is that judging by the age range of the people chosen for this video, the product is aimed for people of my age range. I'm still not convinced ;)
 
I find this use of technology depressing. Why would you want to stay in your own house with a bunch of friends when you could be out enjoying yourselves and making the most of the fantastic weather we're in receipt of at the moment?

ehhh, I actually used to game a TON more back when all I had was an Atari and a black and white TV.

But in regards to Project Natal: Unless they're going to make "Wheelchair Accessible" games for this, I'll have to stick to the controller :D
 
ehhh, I actually used to game a TON more back when all I had was an Atari and a black and white TV.

But in regards to Project Natal: Unless they're going to make "Wheelchair Accessible" games for this, I'll have to stick to the controller :D

You can still get that motion-sensing "wand" thing for the PS3, which I think is a lot better and looked a lot smoother than "Natal" (hate that name BTW). :D
 
honestly if they pulled that off that would be an insane leap in technology that I really don't see working just yet.

I mean, motions by people for arbitrary controls? How could it distinguish so easily between one PRECISE movement and another?

Just seems like total bullshit to me.

But a cool idea.
 
honestly if they pulled that off that would be an insane leap in technology that I really don't see working just yet.
I mean, motions by people for arbitrary controls? How could it distinguish so easily between one PRECISE movement and another?
Just seems like total bullshit to me.
But a cool idea.

Well, it's Microsoft, so it will work...sort of. You install the camera, set it up, then the side bar pops up, a security question whether you want to allow yourself deny the warning about allowing yourself read the warning, then BSOD, so eventually you give up and roll back to Sega Genesis.
 
Last edited:
Well, it's Microsoft, so it will work...sort of. You install the camera, set it up, then the side bar pops up, a security question whether you want to allow yourself deny the warning about allowing yourself read the warning, then BSOD, so eventually you give up and roll back to Sega Genesis.

You know, knock on wood, but I have never had any significant problem with Microsoft. I have owned 10 pc's so far and currently own a laptop, a netbook, and a desktop and have never had a BSOD.

But on the topic of this Natal, looks cool, I like the voice activated features. I was so enamored when I first got a cell phone that did that. I will probably finally buy a gaming console soon and if this works as well as the video shows, might tip the scale back to getting an XBOX.
 
Meh, I really don't see the point in these things. If I want a good gaming experience, I want to be ensconced in a La-z-boy will a regular control pad in my hands. None of that Wii-wave-your-arms-like-a-lunatic nonsense. If I want to exercise, I'll just go outside or to the gym.
 
Meh, I really don't see the point in these things. If I want a good gaming experience, I want to be ensconced in a La-z-boy will a regular control pad in my hands. None of that Wii-wave-your-arms-like-a-lunatic nonsense. If I want to exercise, I'll just go outside or to the gym.

It's not just about "exercise", it's also about immersion. Can you honestly tell me that pushing some buttons is more "immersive" than projecting your virtual self into a game or simulation?

The possibilities for this kind of technology are almost limitless.

Ever wanted to go mano-a-mano with Kobe Bryant? Well, insert NBA Live 2015, where Kobe's real-life stats (strength, speed, etc.) are perfectly modeled into the game, and then even Gramps there can (try) to dunk on the Mamba.

And what about physical therapy applications? Sure, the Wii opened the door to this, but Natal takes this to a whole another level in physical therapy and treatment.

Natal is just a tech demo opening the door to thousands of different applications, it's now up to the developers themselves to come up with cool ways to implement it. And given that MS has said 1000 Natal development kits have shipped to studios during E3, I'm sure we'll be seeing some innovative stuff in the future.

I'm by no means a MS/360 fanboy or anything, but this technology is just cool and a huge breakthrough in adding that all-elusive element of "immersion" to the virtual world. Just think what virtual reality (which is not that far off away TBH) + Natal-type controls can accomplish.
 
Last edited:
I'll stick with a controller for games, like a proper gamer nerd. All this motion control nonsense is for people without enduring hands, capable of grasping a controller no matter how sweaty they get.

And the name is stupid, as well. Thought up by one of those new-age hippies.
 
I'll stick with a controller for games, like a proper gamer nerd. All this motion control nonsense is for people without enduring hands, capable of grasping a controller no matter how sweaty they get.

And the name is stupid, as well. Thought up by one of those new-age hippies.

FYI, "Project Natal" is just a code name for the project, obviously they are going to name it something else (and less hippy-ish, if you want) when it gets out of prototype.

From Wiki
Code name

The name "Project Natal" follows in Microsoft's tradition of using cities as code names. Microsoft director Alex Kipman, who incubated the project, chose to name it after the Brazilian city Natal as a tribute to his country of origin, and because the word natal relates to birth, which Kipman felt reflected the new audiences the project would deliver for the Xbox 360.
 
engadget said:
We had a chance to go one-on-one with Project Natal -- as well as its steward, Kudo Tsunoda -- and we wanted to give you a little insight on Microsoft's next big play. Plus, how could we pass up an opportunity to show off a video of us essentially flailing around like teenagers on a coffee high?

The first thing to note is that Microsoft is very protective of the actual technology right now, so they weren't letting us film or photograph any of the box itself, though what they had was an extremely rough version of what the device will look like (not at all like the press shot above). It consisted of a small, black box aimed out into the room -- about the size of a Roku Player -- with sensors along the front. It almost looked a bit like a mid-size (between pico and full size) projector.

The first demo that we played was a 3D breakout game, where the player is trying to bat a red ball (or in the case of this version, sometimes 10 red balls) toward a line of bricks at the end of a long (virtual) space. The body tracking is truly impressive -- according to Kudo, it's picking up 48 joint points on the human body. As soon as we stepped into line in front of the box, the avatar immediately took on our stance and movements. And we mean really took them on -- little gestures with our arms, the posture we had, front and back movements -- it tracked with complete accuracy. We did notice a bit of stutter during some finer movements, but overall the effect was impressive (and more than a little eerie).

The second demo was actually just a hack of Burnout Paradise, and in some ways was more interesting than the ball swatting. Kudo and his team retrofitted the racing game to take advantage of the Natal, implementing a virtual wheel for steering, and a foot forward or back as the gas pedal. The effect was nothing short of amazing -- the first time we stepped in to play it was immediately natural (save for the part about having to imagine a wheel in your hands). Sure, we wrecked the hell out of a few cars, but it was striking how easy it was to pick up the feel for it. Kudo insinuated that it would be easy for developers to incorporate this tech into pre-existing games, and we have to say, the possibilities are exciting.

After our meeting, we actually had a chance to speak with another source who was able to show us the software guts behind the Natal, so that we could understand the method by which tracking is done. The box uses two sensors for input: a video camera, and an infrared camera (that light you see in the press photo is either power, or some part of the IR setup). The infrared data is used to gauge depth and the video camera movement, but it's the software Microsoft has developed which is really doing the magic. We were shown an example of the raw output of the system, which melds the two sources and then breaks them down into a wireframe of objects, a heatmap (for depth), and a point-map (which is akin to one of those hand imprint needle toys). The software merges all of this together to create a picture of movement in the room, allowing for some pretty crazy detail of what is going on. We watched a chair being dragged into the middle of the playing field, and the software was able to continue to track the human movement, as well as that person sitting down -- it didn't break a sweat. The accuracy is far better than you would imagine it could be; it's very impressive stuff.

Obviously, Microsoft is still working out kinks and perfecting this thing, but what we saw at our demo (and super-secret demo) was mighty convincing. The demo that Sony showed of its new motion controller was interesting, but the fact that Natal is forgoing physical controls of any kind sets your mind reeling. For the other two competitors in this space, Natal could make a very, very strong rival. Ultimately it's up to developers to find truly compelling ways of using this stuff -- though they'd be fools to waste an opportunity like this.

Source:
http://www.engadget.com/2009/06/03/project-natal-video-hands-on-impressions-and-further-details/
 
Have to say this interests me so very little.
 
All i'll say is this: People had enough problems throwing their WII remotes into their TVs, what happens when we have them now doing jump-kicks?

Do not want.
 
You know where I like my gaming? On the couch. Pass on all that exercise crap. That's what the gym is for.
 
It's not just about "exercise", it's also about immersion. Can you honestly tell me that pushing some buttons is more "immersive" than projecting your virtual self into a game or simulation?

The possibilities for this kind of technology are almost limitless.

Ever wanted to go mano-a-mano with Kobe Bryant? Well, insert NBA Live 2015, where Kobe's real-life stats (strength, speed, etc.) are perfectly modeled into the game, and then even Gramps there can (try) to dunk on the Mamba.

And what about physical therapy applications? Sure, the Wii opened the door to this, but Natal takes this to a whole another level in physical therapy and treatment.

Natal is just a tech demo opening the door to thousands of different applications, it's now up to the developers themselves to come up with cool ways to implement it. And given that MS has said 1000 Natal development kits have shipped to studios during E3, I'm sure we'll be seeing some innovative stuff in the future.

I'm by no means a MS/360 fanboy or anything, but this technology is just cool and a huge breakthrough in adding that all-elusive element of "immersion" to the virtual world. Just think what virtual reality (which is not that far off away TBH) + Natal-type controls can accomplish.

Gramps dunk on #24? Do you hate your grandfather that much that you want him to throw his back out?

I really don't consider any of that immersion. Immersion is a great storyline with memorable characters that you end up really caring about, with solid gameplay and little tedium. Think God of War, MGS4, Halo, etc, etc. Definitely don't need newfangled motion sensor crap to play those games.
 
Top