Wow, this thread took a dive. Should we officially write it off?
mostly I worry about shifting into the wrong gear as they are kind of close together and you are not looking.
Except a Miata and a Corvette are significantly different cars. An NB is extremely similar to an NA. The costs to put an LS1 into a Miata are significant. A butterfly brace for an NA is $400 and makes it stiffer than an NB.
That's generally not a challenge, at least on a transmission like mine. My transmission is very notchy and informative, and though the throws aren't long, they aren't stupid-short like an S2000 with a short shifter. It's easy to feel where you are.I am guessing my uncles acura TL had an easy one.
The same can be said for NA vs NC then. Butterfly brace, roll bar - way stiffer than NC. NB is just better than NA in pretty much every way. Not significantly better, but better nonetheless.
You speak from ignorance. The NC is significantly stiffer than the NB. The butterfly brace and rollbar would get the NB to about the stiffness of the NC Sport - maybe a little less stiff. Definitely not stiffer. Which isn't as stiff as the NC MS-R or NC GT. Additionally, the NC has a different engine location and different weight balance. The NA and NB have the same engine location and basic weight balance.
Do you have anything to back that up with? Because I honestly doubt that that's the case...
We weren't talking about weight balance, were we?
Pray tell. Because the NA and the NB weight differences are hardly worth mentioning because they are very small; its stiffer, as mentioned before; interior is better... All of the differences are small, but they are there.
Gee, how dare I, a mere naysayer, question your limitless wisdom and knowledge?But hey, what do I know. It's not like I've owned, built, and raced these cars or anything...
I don't have actual figures. I have the cars' behaviors. Also, the NC has around the same amount of cross bracing, from the factory, as the NB, yet has a significantly stiffer chassis. The NB has a lot of stiffness to gain before it is on par with the NC. When you can provide figures, let me know.
I am comparing the NA, NB, and NC, and talking about advantages and disadvantages of each. Weight balance is among the many things different between the NA/NB and NC.
If the weight difference is barely worth mentioning because it's so small, the stiffness difference is also barely worth mentioning because it's so small. The interior may be better in your opinion, but I actually prefer the NA's interior to the NB's, the steering wheel especially.
You didn't question. You stated things that are incorrect or poor interpretations. I welcome questions. I laugh at inaccuracies.
I never said that the NB is anywhere near as stiff as the NC. What I did say was that additional bracing would likely make the NB stiffer than a stock NC. No, I cant prove that, and neither can you prove your side of the story, so let's just leave it at that.
I believe the original issue at hand was NA vs NB.
The weight difference is what, 20lbs maybe? That's negligible. Additional chassis bracing that made a soft car more rigid - a bit more important, no?
The one and only thing that you've mentioned where the NA has an advantage over the NB is weight (see above - its hardly a difference). The NB is stiff more powerful, stiffer, I believe has bigger brakes, etc. The "oh well I can mod the NA and make it stiffer than the NB" argument is like saying that a GC Impreza is better than a new STI because you can swap an STI engine/drivetrain into the GC. Mods are a whole new ballgame. Stock-for-stock, new STI is better than old NA Impreza, and NB Miata is better than NA Miata.
Research, reading facts and figures, you know, the usual lot... rather than just what I thought when I drove both. Oh, and maybe its just me, but I think that if a car is better than another in virtually all areas except that its 20lbs heavier, its the better car.
I have experience with the cars to back up my claim. Yes, it's not as good as numbers, but it's better than nothing. What direct experience do you have?
The original issue at hand was "Is the MX-5 a girly car." We've gone well past that.
The weight difference NA to NB is closer to 100-200 pounds, for similar trim levels. Early NAs were around 2200 pounds, later NAs around 2300. NBs are around 2400, with the Mazdaspeed being in the 2500 range. This varies from car to car based on options and, by now, differences in how the cars have aged. But it's a lot more than 20 lbs. The listed curb weights on Wikipedia are either a bit optimistic or not US-market, but even there, a 250 pound difference is shown between the NA and NB.
You continue to use hyperbole. Try making your claims without the hyperbole and see how they stand up. There were a lot of little changes between the cars throughout the years, so pointing to exactly what makes which one better is a bit difficult, without picking a specific one. But one difference is the NAs pre-1996 are not OBDII, which helps with passing emissions testing in many areas, helps with tuning options, and in general gives the owner a wider array of toys they can play with. The 1.6L engines in the early NAs are a bit more freely revving than the 1.8Ls (yes, in the later NAs as well as NBs), which helps with that difficult to define "fun" factor. The lightest OEM wheels for a Miata were found on the NA. And NA/NB Miatas are specially sensitive to wheel/tire weight.
Hrm, research. Yup, I've done that, too. I've done a lot of that. I've also driven quite an array of Miatas. However, I'm not sure I trust your research, since you were off by, oh, around an order of magnitude on the weight difference.
Expecting a tyre to blow out?You can bring whatever shaved R-compound rubber you want. I was thinking something more like an informal "hairdresser's buying guide" and not timed, seeing as I'd be going up against a seasoned autocrosser. And if we're talking practicality, I don't need a trailer either:
https://pic.armedcats.net/l/la/labcoatguy/2010/06/27/0627101352-00.jpg
(yes, I know there's a rack available for the Miata too, but let me have my moment of perceived practicality)
You bother with a rack?!
That's a friend's car, not mine. But it could just as easily be done with my car. I think my car's spent more miles transporting tires without the trailer than with, though it does have a few thousand miles with trailer. It's also done its share of dirt road driving. When I say my car is durable, I mean I treat it like crap and drive it anywhere, yet somehow it's still running.
Nope, that's the top. The NC has a Z-fold top. That's a cloth top, not vinyl, IIRC, so maybe that's why it didn't scratch.
Seriously, WTF is with the roads here. My friend lives on a road that is so fucked up it's almost turned to gravel. Gravel would be smoother. I am REALLY PISSED OFF with public works in my town tearing up half the road for pipes and repaving that hole but avoiding the huge ass potholes next to it. Fuck you town. No wonder the PT's suspension crapped out at 40k miles.
Nope, that's the top. The NC has a Z-fold top. That's a cloth top, not vinyl, IIRC, so maybe that's why it didn't scratch.
A rallycross is likely to blow out the shocks. Maybe when I'm ready to buy the Ohlins I'll give it a try, but I'm not running the OEM shocks anymore, anyway.
