Clarkson: The Good, The Bad, and the Ugly discussion thread

[Vitamin J]

The Ariel is a car made out of tubes in a shed, with an engine from a jap roadster.

And you have been on and on about the cars being prized differntly. Yeah, a S7 costs pretty much the same as the Ariel. Really, it does.

Well it can't be any dumber than comparing it to a fucking pickup truck now can it?

btw, the engine isn't from a Japanese roadster, it's from a Civic.

 

[Peter3hg]

just be careful you don't pass one of those "big brother" speed cameras while trying to enjoy your drive

The roads I'm talking about don't have speed cameras on them, or anyway near them.

Ha yeah, and stopping to pay for congestion charges or tolls or whatever other bullshit they charge you for.

I live in Manchester, about 200 miles from London so the congestion charge really isn't going to effect me.

I've driven pretty much all over England and Scotland while on vacation. The roads were awesome, but the traffic was terrible until you get way up north.

What roads were you driving on? All the best roads have barely any traffic on them. Its only the major roads that get heavy traffic, and they are generally boring anyway.

And for every good road you have, we have about 20.

So the US is around 45 times the size of the UK so we have around twice the density of good roads

 

[Peter3hg]

btw, the engine isn't from a Japanese roadster, it's from a Civic.

Actually it is far more similar to the old S2000 engine rather than the Civic engine.

 

[Vitamin J]

So the US is around 45 times the size of the UK so we have around twice the density of good roads

That's because the US is young enough that cities and roads were mapped out based on logic. England's old as fuck so the roads just go "where the horse wandered." But there's some sick roads here in Colorado, during the summer I can just drive and drive all day, I've used 2 full tanks of gas in one day before. Just cruising in my Miata, that was awesome.

But there's no shortage of straight roads either, but that's because the US is huge and putting a winding road through the middle of a flat desert is stupid.

Actually it is far more similar to the old S2000 engine rather than the Civic engine.

No, it is the Civic Si (Type-R) engine.

 

[nomix]

Yes, you have more roads, but America is huge. As pointed out. And yes, America is rather young.

And really, the first European inhabittants of America rode around in their Ford Mustangs till they got to some place that was better to farm than the little piece of land they had on the Island they used to live on in the western part of Norway (i.e.). And to be honest, you could give them a childrens sand box, and it would be much better.

So they pretty much settled relatively randomly.

And you can't say that i.e. San Fransisco is placed wisely?

If you wish to try horrible roads, come to Norway, I'll show you one that's quite interesting.

And if you didn't get it, the point was, that you have been shitting on Jezza for days cause he made a dumb comparison, and then say you'd like a just as dumb comparison.

About the engine, you were right. It's from the Civic Type-R. Sorry about that, I was under the impression it was from the S2000. That actually makes my point even better, the pinacle of british enginering, is a car made of tubes, with an engine from e Japanese hatchback!

 

[teletubby-warrior]

Why can't we all just be:
http://img396.imageshack.**/img396/1708/friendscast44884fnl9.jpg

 

[BlaRo]

Because Friends sucked! Bunch of damn beautiful people, having sex with each other, makes me jealous...

 

[nomix]

Nah. It was fun.

But I guess that being friends would be very, very boring. Vitamin is probably a very nice guy to have a pint of ale with, but it's still fun to argue.

 

[bartboy9891]

Well it can't be any dumber than comparing it to a fucking pickup truck now can it?

btw, the engine isn't from a Japanese roadster, it's from a Civic.

it was just a joke. Its like in "Hot Metal" Where he drove an Austin 1100 against a CL65 AMG in a drag race.

 

[r3dline]

this level of thinking is exactly why American cars/motorcycles are rubbish.

a Boss Hoss can't TURN! A gold wing is faster. heck a 250ex is faster!

if you want to talk drag then a busa or the new kawi is still faster stock.

Any super sport today is into the sub 3's in terms of 0-60 and hit well over 100mph without a thought.


Not to mention with a sports bike we can actually do 2 things a hoss does't even know exists. one is called turning. yep stock with stock tires you can scrape ELBOWS! and stop.


then lets look at economy. sport bikes are cheeper to buy, maintain, and run.

thinking about this. it's like a dodge ram HEMI vs the atom. atom wins hands down.

A Boss Hoss would outperform most shit on the roads permanently.

But if you put the engine from a Skyline with some mods into a CBR600, it'll go like stink too.

And guys, you don't get it. What he's on about, is - as said several times - what Americans and Brits define as fast. Get it?

Some of you seem really, really angry, like you have been smacked in the face with a codd.

 

[Vitamin J]

this level of thinking is exactly why American cars/motorcycles are rubbish.

a Boss Hoss can't TURN! A gold wing is faster. heck a 250ex is faster!

if you want to talk drag then a busa or the new kawi is still faster stock.

Any super sport today is into the sub 3's in terms of 0-60 and hit well over 100mph without a thought.


Not to mention with a sports bike we can actually do 2 things a hoss does't even know exists. one is called turning. yep stock with stock tires you can scrape ELBOWS! and stop.


then lets look at economy. sport bikes are cheeper to buy, maintain, and run.

thinking about this. it's like a dodge ram HEMI vs the atom. atom wins hands down.

I was just reading about a few American made SPORT BIKES that out cornered, accelerated, and braked Japanese and European rivals. The name escapes me at the moment, but its in my bike magazine at home.


Also, an Atom can't tow, go offroad, haul, let alone have an A/C, heater, or radio. So the Dodge wins hands down.

I'm gonna quote myself, cuz I dont think anyone read it the first time:

I think it's pretty presumptious for the Brits to lecture Americans on how to build a good car. Honestly, should we copy the glorious Rover? Should we build cars as reliable as TVRs? Should we build one-purpose cars like Lotus? What about make heavy underperforming boats like Jaguar?

There's a reason the British auto-industry is a joke nowadays.

Why would American car companies try to compete with European companies? If I wanted a BMW I'd buy a BMW.

Cheap, fast, luxurious. Pick two. That's how American companies build cars. Europeans (try) to build all 3, and it ends up costing a helluva lot more money for a marginally better car. Hell, a $25k 2002 Camaro SS would smoke a $45k 2002 BMW M3 on any track, straight or crooked. A $40k Corvette will smoke an $80k BMW, Porsche, or Jag on any track, straight or crooked. And its the same story with a $21k Cobalt SS will and a $29k GTI.


Sure the run-of-the-mill American sedans are pretty fucking shitty, but then again so is a Corolla, or an A-Class, or a Skoda. And who cares about those cars anyway? They're designed with no soul at a price, to make profit thats it.

Nah. It was fun.

But I guess that being friends would be very, very boring. Vitamin is probably a very nice guy to have a pint of ale with, but it's still fun to argue.

Likewise. I enjoy talking about cars, doesn't matter what kind. I'm always learning something new. But when it comes to American vs. European, I like to clear up a few misconceptions people have.

 

[BlaRo]

r3dline, thank you for proving nomix's point perfectly.

I'm still waiting for pics of that CBR...

 

[Ottobon]

i have no use in reading 14 pages of argueing, however i will be happy to point out that on a pure entertainment bases this is probably the best Clarkson DVD out their, and I'm American, so if anybody should be upset shouldn't it be me?

i liked the horse vs car, just wish he wouldnt have blatently lied, even with the lieing it was good entertainment , etc etc, just enjoy the damn thing

 

[transtek]

Reading just some of the foregoing pages, it looks like Clarkson achieved what he always sets out to do!! (i.e. be polemic, speak his mind, even if sometimes his opinions may be just slightly biggoted, and, above all, give people something to argue about!!)

 

[hajj]

Reading just some of the foregoing pages, it looks like Clarkson achieved what he always sets out to do!! (i.e. be polemic, speak his mind, even if sometimes his opinions may be just slightly biggoted, and, above all, give people something to argue about!!)

We should sent him a copy of this thread, so that he can be happy about the impact his DVD has.

 

[thedguy]

I saw 1800 freakin miles of this shit driving from LA to St. Louis.

Then 800 some odd miles of this from STL to Denver.

Coming from LA to Denver once, I drove thru arizona and new mexico. New mexico was all desert with one left turn somewhere near the center. All I could think of was Bugs Bunny's "I should have made that left turn at albuquerque"

The American Southwest is a boring place to drive... if you only stick to the higways

Get off the highways and some of the best driving roads come up. Including a few that are famous for the car chases filmed on and movies based on nothing but the racing people did on them.

I'm of the opinion if American car companies used So.Cal's back roads for suspension tuning, their cars would handle loads better, and still be quite comfy.

Not quite sure how this is relates to the rest of the thread. Just thought I'd point that out.

 

[nomix]

We should sent him a copy of this thread, so that he can be happy about the impact his DVD has.

He'll get it printed as an extra to the next DVD.

 

[Peter3hg]

Also, an Atom can't tow, go offroad, haul, let alone have an A/C, heater, or radio. So the Dodge wins hands down.

Of course you have A/C, it's called fresh air.:lol:

Cheap, fast, luxurious. Pick two. That's how American companies build cars. Europeans (try) to build all 3, and it ends up costing a helluva lot more money for a marginally better car.

European cars tend to also cost more due to increased manufacturing and labour costs. The main area of difference always seems to be the quality of the interior and where do you spend all your time in a car?

Hell, a $25k 2002 Camaro SS would smoke a $45k 2002 BMW M3 on any track, straight or crooked. A $40k Corvette will smoke an $80k BMW, Porsche, or Jag on any track, straight or crooked. And its the same story with a $21k Cobalt SS will and a $29k GTI.

I'll have to take your word on the Camaro and CObalt because obvously I have no experience with them.

 

[nomix]

Isn't the Camaro based on the Monaro? Just wondering, might very well be wrong.

 

[Vitamin J]

European cars tend to also cost more due to increased manufacturing and labour costs. The main area of difference always seems to be the quality of the interior and where do you spend all your time in a car?


I'll have to take your word on the Camaro and CObalt because obvously I have no experience with them.

The interior on an average American car is better than the average Japanese car. I sat in my friend's 2001 Toyota Celica and that was terrible, it made a Camaro's interior seem nice.

Also, you don't have to take my word for it. Just look at SCCA Showroom Stock results. BTW, the Pontiac Solstice just won the SSB Runnoffs:
http://www.scca.com/News/News.asp?IdS=0D89FD-17EFD60&Id=920&~=

Isn't the Camaro based on the Monaro? Just wondering, might very well be wrong.

No, the GTO is the Manaro. The Camaro is running on an all new chassis.