GM Zeta platform back on

Let me see if I can lay this out for some of you.

Australia:
total: 810,641 km
paved: 336,962 km
unpaved: 473,679 km (2004)

United States:
total: 6,430,366 km
paved: 4,165,110 km (includes 75,009 km of expressways)
unpaved: 2,265,256 km (2005)

There is the difference.
 
that doesn't really prove a whole lot jetsetter
 
um how? Do numbers tell you the quality of something? can you measure the quality of a road on how much there is?
 
um how? Do numbers tell you the quality of something? can you measure the quality of a road on how much there is?

I'm not talking about the quality of roads, I am talking of the type of automobile. If you want to talk about road condition, it is a state to state thing.
 
How much do you want to bet?

What do you have to bet that I'd want?

American roads are historically underfunded by a gross amount once they are built, for a variety of reasons.

Here's a good example. One of the main surface streets in Dallas is named Mockingbird Lane. It is one of the crucial commerce roads in the city, a major artery, and it is notoriously ill-maintained. At one recent city council, there were *47* large potholes (defined as .3 meters in diameter or larger) in about a 1 kilometer stretch. And this is typical! (The council deferred the repairs... again.)

Never heard of a major .au city having similar problems.

Dallas roads have taken their toll on my cars' suspensions. Ball joint replacement on the Series III is every two years or less, and it looks like the XKR is going to be about the same way. I've even bent control arms and tie rod ends.
 
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Roads are not that bad everywhere in the United States. As I said, it varies from state to state, city to city, county to county.

As for the Australia thing, have you done any research?
 
The only reasons American cars still don't handle as well as they should is partially because of the miss conception with buyers that a good handling car is going to require a harsh ride. And most people in this country (I've pulled this number from my ass) only really care about cruising at high speed on the freeway in comfort, and getting up to those speeds, followed by fuel economy.

Thats probably why trucks/SUV's have become so damn popular, in the late 90's the only way to get a big engine (remember a lot still thing big engine = more powerful) for the most part was buying a truck or SUV, and with the right suspension option they were rather comfortable.

What do you have to bet that I'd want?

American roads are historically underfunded by a gross amount once they are built, for a variety of reasons.

Here's a good example. One of the main surface streets in Dallas is named Mockingbird Lane. It is one of the crucial commerce roads in the city, a major artery, and it is notoriously ill-maintained. At one recent city council, there were *47* large potholes (defined as .3 meters in diameter or larger) in about a 1 kilometer stretch. And this is typical! (The council deferred the repairs... again.)

Never heard of a major .au city having similar problems.

Dallas roads have taken their toll on my cars' suspensions. Ball joint replacement on the Series III is every two years or less, and it looks like the XKR is going to be about the same way. I've even bent control arms and tie rod ends.

Driving into Oklahoma City from the west heading east on I-40 in a moving truck was THE WORST drive I've ever been on. for 20 miles it just jarred the living shit out my dad and I. Any harshly suspended sports car would have been just as uncomfortable I'm sure.

The closest I can equate the feeling to anyone is to imagine riding on a bicycle up a curb (where you just lift the front wheel over, and let the back wheel smack the curb then go over it). Now imagine that feeling every 1-2 seconds for 20 miles, with 6 second breaks every 8 times it happened.

Roads are not that bad everywhere in the United States. As I said, it varies from state to state, city to city, county to county.

As for the Australia thing, have you done any research?

I've read an article recently about many aussie's complaining of how horrible the roads were and wanting something done about it. The roads (mostly dirt ones outside the big cities) looked like an accordion in the pictures.

I'm not quite sure what your trying to point out with our massive size thing compared to Australia, it doesn't have much relevance as most of OZ's population is on the coasts.

As far as road quality goes, a large amount of them in this country are shit. I've heard the North East is complete shit, I know southern California is pretty bad in some area's, Colorado's were rather nice, Much of Eastern Missouri is complete shit thanks to all the trucks.
 
Australia:

paved: 336,962 km


United States:

paved: 4,165,110 km (includes 75,009 km of expressways)


There is the difference.

(Ignore unpaved)
In the US each citizen has 0.013808032km of road to pay maintenance for.
In Australia each citizen has 0.0161907553km of road to pay maintenance for.

This would suggest roughly the same funding per km is being pumped into the road systems in the US and OZ so it would seem likely they are of similar quality.

If you compare this to somewhere like the UK, we have only 0.00613768663km to pay for each, less than half. It would seem inevitable that your roads are generally of poorer quality.
 
AWESOME! after that quite horrifying post a month ago said the Zeta was gone, i had lost all faith in everything. this has once again risen my soul :D
 
(Ignore unpaved)
In the US each citizen has 0.013808032km of road to pay maintenance for.
In Australia each citizen has 0.0161907553km of road to pay maintenance for.

This would suggest roughly the same funding per km is being pumped into the road systems in the US and OZ so it would seem likely they are of similar quality.

If you compare this to somewhere like the UK, we have only 0.00613768663km to pay for each, less than half. It would seem inevitable that your roads are generally of poorer quality.

I'm pretty sure that we actually spend less money on the roads than the Aussies do, in terms of money that actually goes to road repair. Road funds are notorious for getting diverted or stuffed in people's pockets here. And, in addition, various studies here have shown that each state underfunds its roads so badly that there's a $1 *billion* per state average deficit of backlogged/unfunded repairs and maintenance.
 
More info...

More info...

GM insiders talk CTS/Zeta/Alpha plans

GM insiders have disclosed new information regarding GM's latest rear-wheel-drive plans including details on the forthcoming large RWD Zeta cars, the Alpha platform, and future Cadillac offerings.

GM sources told GMInsideNews that Cadillac would like to use its Sigma platform to exploit market niches it doesn't currently offer product in. Since development of CTS and the Sigma II platform is complete and the expense would be rather minimal, Cadillac will offer several variants of its new CTS sedan including a coupe aimed at the BMW 6-series, as well as a wagon. The RWD wagon and a new FWD crossover dubbed BRX (which rides on a combined Theta-Epsilon platform) will replace the SRX when it is phased out in the summer of 2009. The new coupe, station wagon and crossover will launch in late 2009 for the 2010 model year.

In 2010 ? for the 2011 model year ? the CTS will undergo a refresh as part of GM's effort to gradually move it upmarket to become a 5-Series, E-Class competitor. The update will give the CTS a revised exterior, a brand new interior, and a revised, more powerful powertrain line-up, the report claims. Since GM's new Northstar engine is expected to arrive around this time, look for it to premier in the 2011 CTS.

The STS will be phased out during the summer of 2010, leaving the CTS as the only car riding on the Sigma chassis, the sources say. When the CTS is moved from Sigma to a modified form of Zeta in 2012, the Sigma platform will be scrapped.

Alpha news

The new Alpha platform is a go, with development underway in Australia by GM's Holden unit, GMI says. The new Cadillac BLS will move from front-wheel-drive Epsilon to RWD Alpha between 2011 and 2012, allowing it to compete against the BMW 3-Series and Mercedes C-Class.

Expect the BLS to also have coupe and wagon variants launching shortly after the sedan. Opel/Vauxhall will also get an Alpha variant and since Saturn has been twinned with Opel, they probably will too.

The Pontiac G6 will move also move from FWD Epsilon to RWD Alpha by 2013, due to lead times in getting Alpha into production. Because of this, the G6 will be overhauled and moved to Epsilon II for the 2009 model year for a short run, and then will be moved to Alpha, according to the report. The G6 will mostly likely be similar to the upcoming Holden Torana.

The Zeta platform can't really be scaled down because its over-engineered too accommodate a variety of body styles and applications. Thus, the need for the Alpha platform. It will probably feature a somewhat unique front suspension set up: a coil-over spring coupled with a 4-link strut should provide the necessary characteristics with size and weight advantages over Zeta's articulated McPherson. The rear suspension would be similar to the set up found in both the Zeta and Sigma cars. The platform would also be modular and scalable.

The Alpha chassis will have roughly a 110-inch wheelbase and length between 170 and 180 inches. It will probably feature support for both I4 and V6 engines, eschewing a V8 option due to space and emissions constraints.

Impala, GTO still on track

In Zeta news, the full size Chevy RWD car will indeed be called the Impala, but its launch has been moved back to between November 2009 and June 2010 to allow GM to modify its powertrain offerings for the car. Chevrolet could also get a new El Camino. If given the green light, the El Camino would hit dealers lots 2009-2010 time frame.

Pontiac will get another GTO from Australia. Based off of the all new Commodore Monaro, the GTO will reach America's shores from down under in the fall of 2009 to complement the Pontiac G8, the sources say.

Source
 
Good news.
 
We're getting another monaro!?!? :think:

Hmmm.
 
if the new monaro/GTO looks more like the G8 then i think itll be a fabulous looking muscle car :thumbsup:
 
I don't see why it wouldn't given the last one was just a commodore with 2 doors (literally that was the only difference)
 
GM will change their minds. Again.

I think it was just a bit of a publicity stunt, or at least some kind of scare tactic. They know how much the public want these cars, perhaps it was a way to slow down the seeds of change.

Considering how many sites and magazines covered it, I'm sure it was just to get publicity.
 
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