Horsepower

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torque

In laymen's terms, torque is basically what moves mass. The bigger the car the more torque you need to get it moving. This is why the old Buick 455's would produce 510ft lbs of torque (which was more than 426 HEMI of the day) to help get the cars off the line in a hurry.
 
of course, with that kind of power output figure, it means the engine is not stressing itself to death, you'd expect the engine to run forever : )

must be quite a cruiser mobile.... is it an automatic?

I think all the Lexcens are automatics, in fact, so are most Commodores, save for the sports models.

The advantage of the Commodore is that they're EVERYWHERE, so parts are dirt cheap. One of my friends had an old VN Commodore with the 3800, ran fine until he ran it without oil at 340,000km and seized it. It was trashed during that time, too.

Of course it is, it is GM's super reliable 3800! While it may lack in horsepower, it has, like most GM engines, a usable torque curve.

IMHO, people who only focus on horsepower and conveniently dismiss an engines torque rating and curve are grossly ignorant. :)

You're right that for an engine that's in essentially a family car, a good linear torque curve is much more useful than bucketloads of outright power (although the Falcon of the same era had a better engine than the Commodore's engine, more power and torque).

Would anyone agree with me that making a good normal car engine would be harder than making a good race engine? After all, the race engines would have higher budgets, not have to last as long, and concentrate mainly on outright performance. They'd be revving higher and running hotter, but they'd be running top-grade oil and top-grade fuel.

However, the car engine would have to have a good linear torque curve, last for >300,000km with 10-15,000km service intervals, run on ordinary low-grade pump fuel without detonation, not use very much fuel, meet current and future emissions requirements, run quietly and smoothly, and not be too expensive to produce.

It's amazing they can still get decent performance out of normal car engines.
 
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The VY commodore which featured the last revision of the engine before it was replaced was quite refined and very good for day to day use
 
The VY commodore which featured the last revision of the engine before it was replaced was quite refined and very good for day to day use

I spose the main question is is the Alloytec a noticably better motor? Particularly the 175/180kW version? You're right, the 3800 isn't a bad engine, my mate's old VX was a decent car, but does the engine in the VY differ much from the version in the VS?
 
Isn't 1 kW = 1,36 bhp instead of the before mentioned 1,34 ? Don't mean to be a wiseass. The 1 bhp = 1,024 hp is less of a factor here...
 
I spose the main question is is the Alloytec a noticably better motor? Particularly the 175/180kW version? You're right, the 3800 isn't a bad engine, my mate's old VX was a decent car, but does the engine in the VY differ much from the version in the VS?

Minor differences here and there, VY had NA power rating of around 153kw. Alloytec is a better motor but day to day drivability is much the same (pre ve anyway)

Personally I think pre ve designed peaked with the VY body shape (for non australians)

vy-ss01.jpg
 
Isn't 1 kW = 1,36 bhp instead of the before mentioned 1,34 ? Don't mean to be a wiseass. The 1 bhp = 1,024 hp is less of a factor here...

Depends on what unit of hp you're using (they vary, but only slightly). 1 kW =

1.340483 hp (electric)
1.341022 hp (international - I think this is the unit normally used in cars, and most comonly used elsewhere)
1.340405 hp (water)
1.359622 hp (metric, more comonly known as PS)

quick edit: bhp doens't nessicarily define another unit of measure, just the location of where you are taking measurements (flywheel, no drivetrain losses in the case of bhp).
 
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I wish I had seen that! What year was it? what engine? I had a '79 with the V-6, and that thing was still a great car. I wish it had a V-8, though. I'd probably still have it if my brother didn't decide to play Dukes of Hazard in a parking lot, thus leading to the untimely demise of the tranny. My first car, and what a great car it was...

...of course, I'm more partial to my Volvo now, despite the Pontiac's advantage in power.

Sorry for the derail...

It is a 2006 Grand Prix SE with the 3800 Series III V6. It has already been north of 100 mph by both my mom and dad.
 
Minor differences here and there, VY had NA power rating of around 153kw. Alloytec is a better motor but day to day drivability is much the same (pre ve anyway)

Personally I think pre ve designed peaked with the VY body shape (for non australians)

vy-ss01.jpg

I have to disagree, I don't like the VY all that much. The VT and VX were much nicer looking cars (especially compared to the homely AU). I'd say VT front with VX rear is a good mix. :)

I'd also say the BA is a far nicer looking car than the VY, particularly in XR trim.
 
Tell me those kinds of numbers don't make you wet your pants with excitement.

:drool:

And no supercharger on my mom's Grand Prix. It still has balls though compared to my Alero.
 
One thing I'd like to point out as a side note, as long as we are on the subject of number conversions, the MPG ratings used in Top gear and fifth gear do not translate straight over to the US ratings. Every 6 UK MPG is equal to 5 US.

I spose the main question is is the Alloytec a noticably better motor? Particularly the 175/180kW version? You're right, the 3800 isn't a bad engine, my mate's old VX was a decent car, but does the engine in the VY differ much from the version in the VS?

I can't vote from experience but I've read reviews saying the alloytec isn't quite as nice as the 3800.

quick edit: bhp doens't nessicarily define another unit of measure, just the location of where you are taking measurements (flywheel, no drivetrain losses in the case of bhp).

Actually BHP denotes the type of dyno used. Cheaper dynos are "inertia" dyno's and measure power based on the acceleration of a known mass. BHP is "Brake Horse power" they use some form of resistance, a lot these days use water pressure. Old dynos were a prawny (spelling?) brake, they literally stuck a bar at the end of a clutch and had it pushed on a scale to figure out power.

I thought I should show people just what a 3800 can do when are willing to play around with it a little bit. Now granted it costs 35 grand, but still.

http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/engine/buick_v6_turbo_block/
Tell me those kinds of numbers don't make you wet your pants with excitement.

Not like one needs to spend the 35k for the Aluminum bits. A machined Production engine with Rods and pistons are the kind of thing a 2jz owner will start crying "but but hp/liter". (DAMN IT! I said it).
 
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