Fence out Mexico?

[Ultra_Kool_Dude]

A fence between the US and Mexico?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/usatoday/200...smexicanborder

[ESPNSTI]

And wire-cutters aren't available in Mexico?

What about a medieval moat, drawbridge and stone wall instead.

[Firecat]

Stupid idea. Walls don't work....

[bone]

the fence is against terrorists, and those can't take wire-cutters on the plane to mexico

[Firecat]

lol...the group that is pushing this doesn't want mexicans entering the US, they are using terrorism as a front.

I say America should just return (to mexico) Utah, California, and Nevada. Oh, and whatever parts they controlled earlier of Texas, Arizona, Wyoming, Colorado, and New Mexico.

[bihus]

I haven't read the article, but what I've heard before was of a wall... Well, the wiring will do, and if there's a border, then you can't pass it, so why not putting up a separation?

I just hope that americans don't have to run away to Mexico, and they close their borders... Like a movie I once saw. It was funny as hell.

[gtrietsc]

We should have built a wall a long time ago. But, that's water under the bridge - we need a secure border now to keep terrorists out.

[YF19pilot]

Originally Posted by ESPNSTI

And wire-cutters aren't available in Mexico?

That's why you make it an electric fence.


A fence is a good idea, but i don't like people who use 'terrorism' as a tool to validate their reasons for keeping mexicans out. Granted I don't like illegal immigrants as much as the next person, but I don't like discrimination, especially when my dad is Hispanic.


Oh, and Firecat, Texas won its independance from Mexico, and then joined the US. If the US was to return Texas to anyone, they'd be returning Texas to...well, Texas, not Mexico.

[gtrietsc]

Yes, I should clarify. We should make a real border, that is secure.

Another reason for having it is that not having a secure border, and looking the other way as people cross from Mexico to the US, is that it is a slap in the face to the thousands of people a year who emigrate here LEGALLY. It is not easy, and very time consuming.

[Firecat]

Originally Posted by YF19pilot

Oh, and Firecat, Texas won its independance from Mexico, and then joined the US. If the US was to return Texas to anyone, they'd be returning Texas to...well, Texas, not Mexico.

Well, I did say "parts"...I'm not 100% sure, but I think part of what is present-day texas was still part of mexico after Texas had won their independence....i.e. those parts were later surrendered under some treaty after the mexican-american war....there was probably some other things going on...anyway, that's besides the point...I was just being humorous. 8)

[YF19pilot]

Originally Posted by Firecat

Well, I did say "parts"...I'm not 100% sure, but I think part of what is present-day texas was still part of mexico after Texas had won their independence....i.e. those parts were later surrendered under some treaty after the mexican-american war....there was probably some other things going on...anyway, that's besides the point...I was just being humorous. 8)

Actually, it seems that all of Texas was under the territory. But they'd have to give parts of Oklahoma and what not to Texas as well...

[zenkidori]

The idea of a fence on the US-Mexico border for terrorism is pretty futile once you consider that the Canadian border is MUCH larger and even more open. Maybe we should just pull our troops from the sandbox and stick them on border patrol, much more effective I think. I am all for keeping people who want to enter illegally out, but this idea just isn't practical. Without monitoring, even if it's electrified, it would be trivial to defeat such a fence. If we either pulled troops to border patrol or employed a good many more border agents, that money spent would actually do some good for the economy rather than just be wasted on something that is going to need repairs constantly.

[gtrietsc]

I dont think we have to actively militarize the border to secure it. There are many technologies available today we could use to keep better track of who is coming across. The problem is a political one - to close off our borders means to get serious about stopping illegal immigrants, and no one wants to lose the Hispanic vote.

[hokiethang]

Yeah, a fence isn't the right answer. There really is no good way of dealing with it short of putting guard stations every couple of miles or so, with a bunch of electronic monitoring equipment, so they can detect a crossing. All a fence would do is slow them down.

I have a problem with illegal immigrants getting the same benefits from the government as are available to me in this country. They shouldn't be allowed full access to public facilities, since they aren't paying for it. I do think they have an important role to play in modern society, they do a number of jobs that most people won't do unless they absolutely have to. It's the same argument that I make for outsourcing, it's not that they are taking your jobs as doctors and lawyers, they are doing things that Americans don't want to do, like landscaping and housekeeping (and in the case of outsourcing, answering phones and writing crap code).

As for the terrorism prevention, clearly someone's head is placed firmly in their rear, because terrorists can probably still get in to this country on an airplane. I don't believe the TSA improvements have helped greatly. I have faith it may have stopped a greater percentage of evildoers, but I don't think the system how it is currently run can completely seal the country from terrorists. We need to fix the TSA and the shipping ports, then worry about our neighbors to the north / south. I'd be more worried about terrorists coming in through Cuba than through Mexico or Canada, what's the government solution for that? Fencing off Florida?

[Firecat]

lol...I know a bunch of americans that would take those jobs being outsourced.

I don't understand why they can't hire more people to patrol the border, it makes you wonder if the government wants them coming in.

[Ultra_Kool_Dude]

Illegal Mexicans are great for the US economy - basically it just bumps everyone up on the economic ladder - and better intelligence is $$$ better spent than a big wall.

[justin syder]

My great theory, (and yes this is my first post since being away, in the political section, go figure), get the hell out of China!!

That gov't is so damn deceitful and they are going to be a thorn in our ass.

They are trying to build up their military, they have spies trying to get info on our military tech and they are so unhelpful in terms of trade and politics.

I say, move all the factories to Mexico, that would slow down the illegal immigration greatly and we wouldnt be putting money in the pockets of the Chinese. It would cut costs of shipping since its next door and would greatly benefit Mexican economy. LETS GET OUT OF CHINA!! Cheap labor can be found in mexico and they wouldnt want to get into an arm race like the Chinese are slowly starting to do.

[transtek]

Hey, hey!
I'm from Mexico, so keep it down!!!
No, really, I'm from the UK, but I've lived south of the border for nigh on 14 years, so I know my stuff!
Here you get all the news on the TV saying that they are shooting illegal Mexican immigrants, etc. and that they want to take away their rights, etc..
First of all, if you are an illegal immigrant living in Mexico, then you do not have ANY rights, no public services, no health care, absolutely NOTHING, so I cannot see why they complain when knowingly they illegally enter another country and then want everything for free!
On the other hand, Mexican laborers are an important work force in the US, so why notrganize better permits to keep a track of the legal workers, say for 6-month, 1-year periods, renewable if they can prove they have paid their social security, taxes, etc. or day-passes for day workers... then you could put up a fence as high as you want, as all the workers would be legal and controlled.
But BOTH governments would have to want to make it work and make it easy to do, just fill-out a form with your pasport, proof of address and a letter from your boss, etc., and then it would be legal for US companies to advertise for laborers and we would eliminate the so-called polleros or people smugglers as well.
Just a slightly long and drawn out thought from someone on the other side!

[zenkidori]

Stopping illegial immigration does not mean that there are going to be no more mexicans to take those jobs. There are PLENTY of AMERICANS that would love to have those jobs anyway, so there isn't going to be a shortage of laborers. Also, if they are illegal, they don't pay taxes, which isn't very good for the economy.

Putting more people patrolling along the border creates more jobs and would be a more effective guard than a fence which can be easily bypassed. Why not hire a company like the one that guards Area51? They seem to do a pretty damn good job!

As for the use of lethal force, well, why not? Any unauthorized intrusion into our country can be looked at as an invasion, and with work permits and the like there would be no reason to cross illegally other than to smuggle something. shoot down the drug planes, sink the drug boats, like Clear and Present Danger, heh.

[hokiethang]

Originally Posted by zenkidori

Why not hire a company like the one that guards Area51? They seem to do a pretty damn good job!

That company is the federal government (even though no one directly admits it), and they only have to guard something like a 50 - 100 mile border. Border security doesn't scale easily, so it wouldn't be possible to support that along an entire border with another country.