India Bombed.... again

[LurkerPatrol]

Original: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/7527004.stm

Originally Posted by BBC NEWS

At least 38 people have been killed and more than 100 wounded after a series of explosions struck the western Indian city of Ahmedabad, officials have said.

Seventeen blasts within an hour hit residential areas, crowded markets, a train station and a bus in Gujarat state's commercial capital, they added.

It is thought the explosions were caused by crudely-made devices hidden in boxes and on bicycles.

On Friday a series of similar blasts hit the southern city of Bangalore.

The Ahmedabad explosions came in two waves - the first occurring over a 20-minute period from about 1830 (1300 GMT).

There was another series of blasts shortly after.

TV stations broadcast images of a bus with its side blown up, shattered windows and the roof half-destroyed.

Footage also showed the body of a man lying motionless on the ground next to the bus, covered in blood.

The BBC's Damian Grammaticas, in India, says the explosions appear to have been a planned and highly co-ordinated attack.

Some of the bombs in the second wave targeted the hospitals where the injured were being taken, he adds.

"We saw a blue bag near the trauma centre, and before we could react we saw it explode in a shine of blinding light, and some 40 people were hit by flying shrapnel," doctor Vipul Patil, at the Dhanwantari Hospital, told AFP news agency.

Ahmedabad is an ethnically diverse city which has suffered from political instability in the past.

Riots broke out there in 2002 between Hindus and Muslims.

Reports suggested many of Saturday's blasts were in the city's crowded old quarter - a religiously-mixed area.

Analysts believe the attack may be linked to the Bangalore bombs and could be designed to whip up trouble between religious communities.

Prime Minister Manmohan Singh has appealed for people to remain calm.

India has been hit by several waves of bombings in recent years. Targets have ranged from mosques and Hindu temples to trains and courthouses.

Yay for our wonderful neighbors

I hate jealous and zealous religious extremists/retards that go "OUR RELIGION IS THE CORRECT ONE! I'M GOING TO STICK A PIECE OF DYNAMITE UP MY ASS AND RUN INTO BUILDINGS AT RANDOM TO PROVE MY POINT!"

If you want to fight like a man and prove your point, pick up your hands and fight. This is probably the least terror-inducing and pussiest way to kill yourself and prove your worth to your religion/culture/home country.

[Jacobfox]

Seriously. I'm starting to wonder though. Is this Indian Mujahideen thing really a front for LeT or HuJI, or is it a local insurgency. All I know is that I'm not too concerned here, but it's certainly disconcerting nonetheless.

[LurkerPatrol]

It's just a front for HuJI and SIMI. I'm actually tired of India sitting around not being able to do anything because we're worried about our image with the rest of the world. We should just go into Pakistan and take out the government, they've done nothing for their people and they are the cause of all terrorist attacks in the world. Osama is probably at a Kebab shop somewhere in Pakistan and the Govt. is protecting him at all costs.

The people there deserve better and the rest of the world should be kept safe from these Jihad morons. Time to invade.

[Gman333-X-ferrari]

Originally Posted by LurkerPatrol

Yay for our wonderful neighbors

I hate jealous and zealous religious extremists/retards that go "OUR RELIGION IS THE CORRECT ONE! I'M GOING TO STICK A PIECE OF DYNAMITE UP MY ASS AND RUN INTO BUILDINGS AT RANDOM TO PROVE MY POINT!"

If you want to fight like a man and prove your point, pick up your hands and fight. This is probably the least terror-inducing and pussiest way to kill yourself and prove your worth to your religion/culture/home country.

Originally Posted by LurkerPatrol

It's just a front for HuJI and SIMI. I'm actually tired of India sitting around not being able to do anything because we're worried about our image with the rest of the world. We should just go into Pakistan and take out the government, they've done nothing for their people and they are the cause of all terrorist attacks in the world. Osama is probably at a Kebab shop somewhere in Pakistan and the Govt. is protecting him at all costs.

The people there deserve better and the rest of the world should be kept safe from these Jihad morons. Time to invade.

Fucking well said.



The Pakistani government is nothing but a commie terrorist organisation in itself. It should be their job to weed out the terrorists and actively get rid of them. However, India has to fight both the terrorists and Pakistan in Kashmir - with the terrorists and Pakistan almost working side by side. A couple of Agni-IIs should do the trick nicely.

[Zuhaib]

Originally Posted by LurkerPatrol

It's just a front for HuJI and SIMI. I'm actually tired of India sitting around not being able to do anything because we're worried about our image with the rest of the world. We should just go into Pakistan and take out the government, they've done nothing for their people and they are the cause of all terrorist attacks in the world. Osama is probably at a Kebab shop somewhere in Pakistan and the Govt. is protecting him at all costs.

The people there deserve better and the rest of the world should be kept safe from these Jihad morons. Time to invade.

I think the lack of knowledge on both sides is what keeps this finger pointing between the two countries still going on to his day. If you have not been keeping up with the news of late, Pakistan has come itself under attack by terrorist. They are daily bombings in Lahore and Islamabad and it has started to spill over to Karachi. (an example like this: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/07/wo...=1&oref=slogin ) Some are fueled by local politics but the vast majority are terrorist groups that wish to move from Afghanistan and make new homes in Pakistan and people upset with Pakistan recent ties with the United States.

Now it is a bit ironic that in the past Pakistan did support the same groups that now attack herself. Pakistan for a long time took the stance that the "The enemy of my enemy is my friend" and did not sit back to think that one day that friend my become your enemy. And Pakistan is not alone in doing this (look at the United States, and I would not be shocked if this theory did not come from the United States as Pakistan was a Cold War ally and India was heavily tied with the USSR). And even today Pakistan government still takes the stance that issues and problems occurring over its borders (be it India or Afghanistan) are not its problem. Pakistan is dealing with its own domestic issues, and, at times makes deals with it should not like the major treaty it signed with norther war lords.

India itself is not totally clean, India itself has home grown terrorist of all regions. You have the extremest Hindus, Sheiks and to top it off Muslims. India if anything is the great example of diversity on all levels, you have people from a lot of faiths and culture that can co-exist with each other, at the same time can hate each other.

[LurkerPatrol]

All the middle eastern countries seem to have problems with merely different sects of Islam. Big politically-based uprisings against one another, it's meaningless. Shiites and Sunis always at war for what? Why would you kill your own brother and sister?

India isn't a utopia, I agree with you Zuhaib. It has shown promising results with co-existence but no matter where you go you'll always have extremists and I suppose India is not exempt from that.

However, I still think Pakistan's government (formerly run by a militaristic dictator that forcefully took office) is to blame for terror attacks in India and for the battles at Kashmir. Terrorists groups are always moving in from Afghanistan to Pakistan and a lot of Jihadi forces are based in those 2 countries. It's the government's responsibility to keep these bastards out of the country, and they need to take care of their people. Musharraf did such a horrible job (if any job) nurturing and caring for his country and maintaining peace with India. We had started off on a good foot when he took over but slowly, 1 bombing after another, that good relationship was severed.

I was thinking about you when I posted this article Zuhaib. I don't mean any offense to Pakistani people, and I sincerely hope I haven't hurt your feelings or anything by my post. We've had our strife in the past (when the British at that time cut off India into too many pieces), but I still respect and am amicable with everyone, no matter what. It's the government and the politicians that don't do crap are what piss me off. Even India's political system is screwed up and everyone of us bitches at them each time we have a terrorist attack.

[Zuhaib]

Originally Posted by LurkerPatrol

All the middle eastern countries seem to have problems with merely different sects of Islam. Big politically-based uprisings against one another, it's meaningless. Shiites and Sunis always at war for what? Why would you kill your own brother and sister?

India isn't a utopia, I agree with you Zuhaib. It has shown promising results with co-existence but no matter where you go you'll always have extremists and I suppose India is not exempt from that.

However, I still think Pakistan's government (formerly run by a militaristic dictator that forcefully took office) is to blame for terror attacks in India and for the battles at Kashmir. Terrorists groups are always moving in from Afghanistan to Pakistan and a lot of Jihadi forces are based in those 2 countries. It's the government's responsibility to keep these bastards out of the country, and they need to take care of their people. Musharraf did such a horrible job (if any job) nurturing and caring for his country and maintaining peace with India. We had started off on a good foot when he took over but slowly, 1 bombing after another, that good relationship was severed.

I was thinking about you when I posted this article Zuhaib. I don't mean any offense to Pakistani people, and I sincerely hope I haven't hurt your feelings or anything by my post. We've had our strife in the past (when the British at that time cut off India into too many pieces), but I still respect and am amicable with everyone, no matter what. It's the government and the politicians that don't do crap are what piss me off. Even India's political system is screwed up and everyone of us bitches at them each time we have a terrorist attack.

First of all I would like to say i take no offense at what you said. Its not bad to have health debates =P

But again I think you miss the fact that the same people blowing up things in India are the same that now have set there sights on Pakistan and have started attacking the government. (see the nytimes link as an example) If anything, these Terrorist would love to see the day Musharraf is disposed off. His iron handed grip on Pakistan has done its best at preventing Pakistan falling in to the hands of terrorist control. Now dont get me wrong, he has over stepped his power in domestic issues and like those that get in power is having a hard time sharing it, he has done the best towards keeping the Moderate Pakistanis in control of the government. He is not doing the best job in going after the terrorist, but in truth his control in the NWFP and Balochistan is very limited. It does not help he signed a treaty with the Balochistan tribes giving them what amounts to full control over the area, but, before he did that Pakistan was looking at out right civil war with them.
And the NWFP, the norther part border of Pakistan, has always been out of control of the normal Pakistani government. In truth, all the states are a little wack. Before Musharraf each state had the right to enter in to foreign treaties on its OWN. The NWFP is worst, and it does not help that when the US invaded Afghanistan that you had millions of Afghans, some who shared thinking with the old government, flooded Pakistan. And they are just not in the NWFP or Balochistan. Outside of Karachi you can see there little towns they setup.
I can understand the frustration that many in India would have with Pakistan, and with its past history of using terrorism as an ally would make people quick to think Pakistan is using it again. But in todays day and age Pakistan is far from that as domestic issues right now are in the forefront of its issues.

When Musharraf took power he did make some positive moves towards peace with India. And here stateside and with many Moderate Pakistanis we where in a way happy he took power. He had a lot of moderate thoughts and agendas and wanted to re do Pakistan power structure on a more US Style(Strong President, with a Congress) vs the current Parliament style (President with no power, PM with all the power and Parliament). Now of course he also set talk that he would not stay in power long. Well things are changing and he is making unpopular moves with the moderate with the removal of judges and etc etc. But in terms of his moves towards the more Extreme Islamic elements in Pakistan, he has been very iron fisted and it is something that any other elected official could not. I am not going to lie but the poor are a lot more willing to support a anti-Indian/anti-West way of thinking and have no issue with extreme version of Islam. And its the poor that make up more of the country. More elected official would be able to stay in office if they had stormed the Red Mosque. The idea of storming a mosque to moderate Muslims even make them a bit upset. So while it might seem he cant control the terrorist in Pakistan, I cant think of anyone else doing a better job.

[Firecat]

Just a few observations. Indians and Pakistanis have many more similarities than differences. It's fascinating how India has managed to remain a democracy since they kicked out the British, yet Pakistan has seen each of its democratically elected leaders overthrown.

[jayhawk]

An observation from me, who is Western minded.

While I am wholly happy that India is emerging as a force in the world economy (what capitalist wouldn't be?), incidents like this will make Western corporations cringe when deciding if they want to invest their company assets there. That is a real downer, because I feel India can have a MAJOR influence when they become an economic powerhouse on countries like China and the Middle East.

[efoolution]

Originally Posted by LurkerPatrol

I'm actually tired of India sitting around not being able to do anything because we're worried about our image with the rest of the world. [...]

... I always thought it was the fear of a nuclear counterattack that kept India out of Pakistan ...

No offense meant personally, but looking forward to invading a country with serious a nuclear arsenal (as the tip of the Iceberg), isn´t much of a wiser thought than thinking to blow yourself up in order to kill your enemy ... or am I missing something here?

[chvvkumar]

Originally Posted by efoolution

... I always thought it was the fear of a nuclear counterattack that kept India out of Pakistan ...

No offense meant personally, but looking forward to invading a country with serious a nuclear arsenal (as the tip of the Iceberg), isn´t much of a wiser thought than thinking to blow yourself up in order to kill your enemy ... or am I missing something here?

India never invaded any country in her last 10,000 years of history. Not attacking pakistan is not because of the fear of nukes.

[efoolution]

Originally Posted by chvvkumar

India never invaded any country in her last 10,000 years of history.

Stupid german, little bit less stupid now.

[jayhawk]

Originally Posted by chvvkumar

India never invaded any country in her last 10,000 years of history. Not attacking pakistan is not because of the fear of nukes.

I'll give India that. They are a very civilized nation, no matter the caste or economic stature.

[Labcoatguy]

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/01/wo...1pstan.html?hp

Pakistani intelligence implicated in bombing of Indian embassy in Afghanistan, more Kashmir clashes. If Musharaff gets desperate enough about consolidating or maintaining his hold on power, he might attempt to whip up patriotic fervor behind his government by doing something militant and dangerous in response to any Indian move. In that case, I'm sure the US would not back Pakistan, but would China? Hopefully not, but it'd also give China a chance to flex its muscle in the area, something its military hasn't done in a while. Russia would then be stuck as to whether to back its top weapons buyer, China, or its historical ally, India. This is the kind of escalation that most people, I'd gather, don't want to happen, but unfortunately the potential path is clear.