Muslims vs Pope

[D-Fence]

Don´t know if you got the news........many muslims, especially in Turkey, start a hate war on the pope, because of sth he said! He tried to make clear that violence and religion don´t go together

In his speech at the University of Regensburg, Benedict quoted criticism of Islam and the Prophet Mohammed by 14th century Byzantine Emperor Manuel II Palaeologus, who wrote that everything Mohammed brought was evil and inhuman, "such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached".

Benedict repeatedly quoted Manuel's argument that spreading the faith through violence is unreasonable, adding: "Violence is incompatible with the nature of God and the nature of the soul."


In many Islamic countries, he is only quoted with:

"Everything Mohammed brought was evil and inhuman"

and now? A church was blown up.......yippie yeah.

This really starts pissing me off big style.......

What do you think?

[swek]

Muslims reacting oversensitive. Who would have thought? It's getting boring lately.

[YF19pilot]

I do agree that spreading religion through violence is quite wrong. However, it is my view that many Islamic countries are where the catholic church was in their views during the Middle Ages. War for God, conquest for the Lord. I like to think that most societies have grown up since then, and I thought that most of Turkey had grown up enough to not be total pricks about things. Then again, I suppose if the one person that is considered the most holy living being in the world today by your enemies said something that could be manipulated/misused, and basically you heard "Your religion is evil", you'd be a bit upset. However, blowing things up isn't the way to go about getting your point across, imho.


I think there are some smart people in the Islamic world today. It's unfortuante that many of them seem to be working against making the world a better place...

[jayhawk]

"How DARE you say we are violent! Lets go blow up a church!"


Dee dee dee!

[FATMOUSE]

Originally Posted by jayhawk

"How DARE you say we are violent! Lets go blow up a church!"


Dee dee dee!

I'm probably going to heck for this, but

[Firecat]

I think Muslims have every right to be upset. Based on reading the text of the speech, the Pope seems to be in agreement with this. At least that's how it comes across....

Nevertheless, there shouldn't be any violent reactions to this. Not only is it unnecessary, but it merely goes towards proving the point of the quote.

[///M]

Dealing with muslims, what do you expect? They're going to riot, blow up shit, burn shit, no surprises.

Regarding the pope, that asshat has no right to point fingers. The way I see it, he's in the same boat. The Catholic Church is one of the most oldest, most corrupt organisations in the world, that has the blood of millions on its hands, whether they be Jews or other Christians. Not to mention how nicely they treated scientists and free thinkers.

The pope dissing Mo' is another case of ...

[Mischief007]

Humans being humans. Can't learn to get along but can somehow piss off people very easily. Instead of easing violence, both religions are part of the problem.

Again, instead of learning to live with each other in peace, we have to do stupid shit like this. $#$@#$#...why can't we get along peacefully?? I think all religions should be promoting that instead of putting blame on others or pointing fingers or getting their egos involved.

[zenkidori]

There's a problem with the argument that the Catholic church is just as bad. Sure in the past there were many atrocities committed in the name of the church, but radical Ismalics seem to be the only people doing crazy shit in the "name of god" in modern times.

Muslims who agree with this bullshit and violence are only inviting oppression. What, are people just going to be nice after X amount of people get killed? It's called backlash, and if things keep progressing the way they are, I won't be the least bit surprised if opposing organizations form and blow up Mosques or some countries run the faith out entirely.

does that make it right? no, but that's probably what will happen. They'll keep blowing shit up and claiming they're oppressed and conspired against untill they actually are. self fulfilling prophecy.

[Blind_Io]

Muslims vs Pope, tonight on Pay Per View!

I'm calling my bookie.

[jetsetter]

Originally Posted by Blind_Io

Muslims vs Pope, tonight on Pay Per View!

I'm calling my bookie.

Let's get ready to rumble!!!!!!!!!!

[mojo_786]

I wouldn't call pope asshat or anything insulting. But think about it... at a point like this where half of the muslims dont really know what theyre doing (blowing up themselves in the name of god, following whatever some of the "Islamic" leaders say, etc) Pope had to make a comment like this.

I wouldnt mind as much if a random person said it.. yah id get pissed or watever. But wen ur in a position like the Pope, when so many people look up to u, etc. You have alot of responsibilites. Whatever you say, it'll have a different impact on a person. You have to be more than awake, more than conscious of what your saying.

And yeah, if more comments like this is take place, worse things will end up happening.

Question: I was listening to a representative (Pope representative or someone) he said that whatever the pope said was out of the holy scripture... it wasnt his (the pope's) personal view. So my question is regarding the holy scripture, it wasnt written by someone when Jesus (pbuh) was alive. it must have been after. And if it was after Muhammad (pbuh) than im guessing it wasnt Holy. I mean if its one of the previous Pope's who wrote it in the 14th century or watever its just scription. Um... the question is WHAT makes that scripture so holy? who wrote it and regarding what?

if i can get a brief summary it'll be great... thanks

[Burningwick]

Originally Posted by mojo_786

Question: I was listening to a representative (Pope representative or someone) he said that whatever the pope said was out of the holy scripture... it wasnt his (the pope's) personal view. So my question is regarding the holy scripture, it wasnt written by someone when Jesus (pbuh) was alive. it must have been after. And if it was after Muhammad (pbuh) than im guessing it wasnt Holy. I mean if its one of the previous Pope's who wrote it in the 14th century or watever its just scription. Um... the question is WHAT makes that scripture so holy? who wrote it and regarding what?

if i can get a brief summary it'll be great... thanks

That is a very long answer unfortunately. The books of the Bible that have been canonized (declared as Holy Scripture) underwent scrutiny as to authorship, authenticity, date, inspiration, etc a during a number of major council meetings that occurred back in 300-500 AD. Almost all the books were written in the first century after Jesus' death. There has always been debate as to the books that were left out and about a few that were included. Many just accept the decisions made by the councils as divinely inspired. Others study them all and make their own decisions. That is a very, very short answer.

As for what the Pope's representative said about that quote being from Holy Scripture; I have no idea what he means. There is most certainly nothing like that in the traditional Bible. And, you're right, the timing of events for something like that to be included in the Bible is quite dubious. The quote actually came from a Byzantine emporer. I would question whether the representative meant it like it came out. However, I'm not Catholic so I could be missing something involving Sainthood or similar.

[Burningwick]

Originally Posted by Mischief007

Humans being humans. Can't learn to get along but can somehow piss off people very easily. Instead of easing violence, both religions are part of the problem.

Again, instead of learning to live with each other in peace, we have to do stupid shit like this. $#$@#$#...why can't we get along peacefully?? I think all religions should be promoting that instead of putting blame on others or pointing fingers or getting their egos involved.

The sad thing is that these religions that are warring against each other, all have love and acceptance at the core of their religion. I believe that the ones who are promoting the violence are the ones who have strayed the furthest from the foundations of their religions.

[West]

Originally Posted by jayhawk

"How DARE you say we are violent! Lets go blow up a church!"


Dee dee dee!

Reminds me of this:

[zenkidori]

LOL. nice.

[jeffy777]

Originally Posted by Burningwick

The sad thing is that these religions that are warring against each other, all have love and acceptance at the core of their religion. I believe that the ones who are promoting the violence are the ones who have strayed the furthest from the foundations of their religions.

Very true indeed.

[///M]

Originally Posted by zenkidori

There's a problem with the argument that the Catholic church is just as bad. Sure in the past there were many atrocities committed in the name of the church, but radical Ismalics seem to be the only people doing crazy shit in the "name of god" in modern times.

So because the Catholic church isn't slaughtering non believers, forcing conversions (still do it in the third world), silencing scientists, and generally being nasty today, that means all is forgiven? Agreed on the fact that the problem today is Islam. That doesn't mean that one can't draw a comparison between what's happening today and what happened before. Rather, one should look at how the Catholic church, and any religious institution at that, handles governace, and make the conclusion that religion and government should never mix. We should learn a lesson from how fucked up the Catholic church made Europe, and try to stop the Islamofascists from doing the same today.

[jeffy777]

Originally Posted by ///M

Rather, one should look at how the Catholic church, and any religious institution at that, handles governace, and make the conclusion that religion and government should never mix.

It's evident that in religion discussions, you're often too general, and generalizing produces inaccurate statements, such as the one I quoted. The church I personally belong to is a worldwide church and all it asks from the government is religious freedom; nothing more, nothing less (i.e. U.S. Constitution: First Amendment). Not all religions are equal in their quests for power, government influence, etc.

But yes, you are right. We should certainly learn a lesson from the dark pages of Catholic history. As a Protestant, I wholeheartedly agree with that notion.

However, Zenki makes a good point about what's going on in the here and now with radical Muslims.

EDIT:

The Pope is sorry:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/5351988.stm

[osabros]

Originally Posted by swek

Muslims reacting oversensitive. Who would have thought? It's getting boring lately.

my thoughts exactly.
in the future even mentioning the name of muhammad will probably kill you...