The Islamic State of Sweden

[Roman]

I suggest moving this to "Political discussions".

I have a bad feeling this is about to go sour.

[Cruzz563]

*takes heed to Roman's werds*

Moving

[justin syder]

///M, i was born here in the states. So was my father.

Im not against immigration but lax policies like the one Sweden has and Canada has can only lead to negative results.

[Firecat]

Originally Posted by bihus

If we see it closely and prejudice free, all major wars happened because of religion.

Not in the past hundred years

[bihus]

Originally Posted by Firecat

Not in the past hundred years

Well, IIRC correctly, WWI started after the assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand of Austria, driven by religious beliefs. The Israeli-Palestinian conflict is religion driven. But I agree it was a broad statement. I can't generalize.

[tloekke]

While we're at the subject, this happened not so long ago here. Basically, some muslim author has published a book in urdu were he slanders norwegian lifestyle.

http://www.aftenposten.no/english/lo...cle1021435.ece
The positive thing in this is that other muslims was the ones to condemn this the most.

[///M]

Originally Posted by justin syder

///M, i was born here in the states. So was my father.

Im not against immigration but lax policies like the one Sweden has and Canada has can only lead to negative results.

Regardless, you still aren't originally American. America had one of the most open immigration policies in the beginning of the 20th century, and that was one of the main reason it's as strong as it is today. Did that lead to negative stuff? Probably did, but overall the result was the strongest country in the world.

[JoeBlo1]

There really aren't many problems with immigration in Canada. Heck, I'm an immigrant and I'm treated fine. I can understand the illegal immigration issue in the U.S. because most of the illegals are from Mexico. Canada entices immigrants from a wide range of backgrounds to settle in our country.

[Firecat]

Originally Posted by bihus

Well, IIRC correctly, WWI started after the assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand of Austria, driven by religious beliefs. The Israeli-Palestinian conflict is religion driven. But I agree it was a broad statement. I can't generalize.

I think religion, racism, or nationalism is what motivates the population in wars or conflicts. However...power, land, and wealth are what motivates the leaders

[bihus]

Originally Posted by Firecat

I think religion, racism, or nationalism is what motivates the population in wars or conflicts. However...power, land, and wealth are what motivates the leaders

Damn right. Unfortunately...

[bobber69]

This is so terrible, they are doing it do Denmark too... I am actually thinking seriously of leaving the country - I'm planning to get an education which I can you some place else than Denmark!
Oh and here's a fact , the country in which you are most likely to be killed at the time being - is Sweden!!!

[snars]

Hmm....doesn't anyone care about the fact that this report came from Fox News? Just look at it: about 90% of the information is fed to you by the voice-over, whereas the other 10% consists short, chaotic footage and equally short 'interviews'.

Also, one thing that drew my attention was the part where the policeman is telling about bad neighbourhoods and the camera zooms in on his steering wheel to clearly show the Chevrolet logo. Coincedence? Well if you ask me, that shot mainly serves to make the average Joe think 'hey, these guys drive American trucks, just like us! They must be the the good guys'. Like it or not, that's how branding works and I think it's at least suspicious when you see something like that in a news report.

I'm not saying Sweden doesn't have some sort of problem with immigrants, but I simply refuse to form my opinion based on Fox News.

[justin syder]

I'm not saying Sweden doesn't have some sort of problem with immigrants, but I simply refuse to form my opinion based on Fox News.

So Sweden doesnt have that much of a problem if Fox News reports on it but you admit there is a problem. Sounds like a contradiction. What was so biased in the report?

As far as the chev logo, that is really picky and meaningless. You sound like a conspiracy theorist.

Look in this very thread with pics of American cars. http://forum.finalgear.com/viewtopic...808&highlight=

American cars are sold worldwide so that proves your "Joe think 'hey, these guys drive American trucks, just like us!" theory is wrong and just plain ridiculous. If it was meant to be shot like that then what does that prove? Other countries have American cares, wow what a schock.

Hmm....doesn't anyone care about the fact that this report came from Fox News? Just look at it: about 90% of the information is fed to you by the voice-over, whereas the other 10% consists short, chaotic footage and equally short 'interviews'.

News stories have to be quick and not take too long. They have to get alot of info out and will have short interviews. It allows you to have more stories in your news show. The voice over is how the stories are done over here, a reporter reports something while images are shown. Im surpirsed this is new to you.

So in the end if you accuse Fox News of being one-sided it would be hypocritical to do so, why? Well you yourself would reject any news story by them even if it was very truthful all because it came from Fox News.

[lurker532]

Snars said he didn't see much more than a Fox reporter saying this is the way things are. Frankly, he's right.

Here's an example:
Voice over: Civil servants say the city is swamped.
Reporter: You have 1000 pupils in a Swedish school.
Anonymous Swedish Guy: yeah
Reporter: How many are Swedes?
Anonymous Swedish Guy: 2

The implication is that the education system is swamped. Unfortunately if you remove the voice over you don't have enough information to arrive at this conclusion. All you have is an annonymous Swede telling you that there is a school in Malmo where only two students are not immigrants.

Does this anonymous Swede think this is a problem? The reporter implies that he does, but we don't know. Why didn't the reporter ask him?

Snars doesn't trust a specific news source (in this case Fox News) to give him all the information he needs to make an informed opinon. How is this hypocritical?

[justin syder]

Snars doesn't trust a specific news source (in this case Fox News) to give him all the information he needs to make an informed opinon. How is this hypocritical?

I could understand if you thought this was a fake story with a conservative angle being anti-immigration but it does exist. The only fault the story has is being short and not too much evidence but Im sure Swedish papers or news stories will go into it in detail as it is about their country. How much detail can you fit in a 1:56 news story? Thats why it jumps around from scene to scene and is cramed with different things. Its only meant to bring awarness to the viewer of the problem, not go into detail about why, how, where. You couldnt do that in 1:56.

You may not like the way it was reported because it wasnt in depth but we can't dispute that it is a problem in Sweden. The story wasn't long enough or informative enough to proof it but gave you enough to know the basic idea.

[lurker532]

I don't think the story is completely false, I just wonder if facts are being distorted (e.g. one single event being seen as a massive epidemic). I think we both agree that following up on the story through other sources is a good idea.

I found a Swedish site with news in english called the Local. A search on immigration yielded some interesting stories (http://www.thelocal.se/newsSearch.ph...ch=immigration).

Immigration (or more precisely integration) does appear to be an issue. However, it isn't portrayed in quite the same sensationalist light. I'm surprised we haven't gotten a respone from someone in Sweden.

Don't the Swedes like Top/Fifth Gear? If not they have a much larger problem than immigration!

[justin syder]

Im sure someone living in those neigborhoods or knows those neighborhoods well could confirm it.

Also, i understand the story could seem one sided, I didnt check other sources cuz im not too interested in the story, but what would Fox have to gain or try to impose by sensationalizing it?

[bobber69]

Also, i understand the story could seem one sided, I didnt check other sources cuz im not too interested in the story, but what would Fox have to gain or try to impose by sensationalizing it?

Yeah the story is one sided, because they are coming and oppressing the Swedes.
There will always be two sides to every story, but the matter of the fact is, that they are coming to Sweden and partly ruining it, and they doesn't want to behave like Scandinavians do. If they wanna behave like they are doing, they could have stayed back home.
It's a huge problem as I see it, and for that matter, everyone I talk to about this kind of problem.

The story is true, I live 40 KM from Malmö.

I like this comment though:

Don't the Swedes like Top/Fifth Gear? If not they have a much larger problem than immigration!

A little cheer up

[justin syder]

Yeah the story is one sided, because they are coming and oppressing the Swedes.
There will always be two sides to every story, but the matter of the fact is, that they are coming to Sweden and partly ruining it, and they doesn't want to behave like Scandinavians do. If they wanna behave like they are doing, they could have stayed back home.
It's a huge problem as I see it, and for that matter, everyone I talk to about this kind of problem.

Wait hold on...You seem to contradict yourself. You say the story is one sided but then reinforce the view that the story has, the immigrants are creating a problem. How is the story sensational or bad if you seem to reinforce what it stated?

[Roland]

OK, i've been off the forums for a while and saw this now (been having a shit load of finals)

Anyways, first of all i must say that everything this news clip said aboud Rosengård is true. It has been written about in swedish media quite a lot and those who think FOX is BSing can just search on articles on www.aftonbladet.se, www.expressen.se, www.dn.se, or www.svd.se, the two last ones are better but i dont think it matters much cause most of u dont know swedish.

However i must say that these facts that are presented does not apply on all of Sweden in the same scale, just Rosengård (a part of thr city Malmö) and some other isolated areas aswell. In Sweden all in all there are about 10 % imigrants, which includes imigrants form all nordic countries and europe as well. So not all are muslimes.

Then it is always good to look at all american news with critical eyes because it IS biosed. This apllies not just FOX but CNN, CBS et c as well. It is also imporant to look at both "sides" of the news aswell so u can form your own opinion and just dont follow biosed news. (all news are biosed by the way). In this case it can be difficult because Sweden might not be the most popular among subjects in US news.

Now back to the actual subject. Is Sweden too liberal agains imigrants. NO, absolutely not. A country can not be to liberal in that area IMO. A corner stone of capitalism is free flow of money and labour, it doesn't work without it. Juxtapositioning diffrent kinds of thougts and methodes will eventually lead to a adaptioning of the best one or a combination. Without immigrants this wouldn't be possible.

The problem is that these immigrants come to this society with hopes of a better future and a new life and all they encounter is a bunch of swedes with a shit load of predjudice about forigners who shove them together instead of trying to itegrate the to our society. The one thing that helps integration the most, a job, is denied to them. Why u might ask. Well just because we have a so fucked up society that has been shaped by socialist for the better part of 70 years. The unions here in sweden are so powerfoul that they have almost put minimum wages on everything so there are even a lot of swedes going without jobs. And lets be honost who would u employ out of 4 ppl if three talked perfect swedish and the last one just new a few words if the wage would be the same. Then we have the issue that u have to be certified to do almost anything in this socity. An education from abroad might not mean shit.

Instead of a job which would lead to both better language skills and better itegration they get a shit load of money from the government (from us taxpayers) and basically they just get to live in their areas were everybody talks the same laguage etc. They they have kids which are born in the same areas and what are they??? Are they forigners or swedes??? They naturally grow up with a insecurity and hatret of swedes and the result is what u can see in Rosengård.

Of course u get pissed on the swedes, i would too. There are very few of the immigrats who actually are able to get into the swedish society just because we are to ENCLOSED rather than LIBERAL.

The problem isn't helped by that the Police have got less funding by the years either...

There u have it, short and sweet