The Left Slowly Sinks Britain

[Cobol74]

Well they are back - I wonder what the UK Government gave Iran? The Government are not letting on.

[nomix]

That's an interesting question.

They sure did something. On one side, they can't say they negotiated about the relase of POWs, that would mean that Britain was de facto in war with Iran or that the boat was in Iranian waters. They won't make those admissions.

On the other hand, if they have negotiated about the relase, and the government won't recognize a status as 'POWs', then they can't admit the negotiations, since that would be admitting that they negotiated with blackmailers.

Tricky question.

[RUU-CHAMA]

I don't think the British Government gave them anything. I believe that Iran was either hoping for a skirmish so it could have go reason to say "See how they violated our territories and now they attack us. Now we have a good reason for our nuclear program." Another theory is that they wanted to see how England would react over this crisis, if England would not get tough to save their own people then is shows Iran and the Middle East that they can do nearly anything and all they will get in return is a strongly worded letter from the U.N.

[Cobol74]

Tony Blair is as tough as semolina.

For non Brits as a point of information :

http://www.allied-mills.co.uk/products/semolina.asp

[nomix]

Hey, at least it's nice to see that his Tonyness didn't take orders from his boss this time, and the fact that they resolved this without making sure someone died.

I find some happiness in that, to be honest.

[zenkidori]

Originally Posted by Firecat

And the behavior of the soldiers while in Iran. Confessing, apologizing, shaking hands and thanking Ahmedinejad....when it doesn't appear that they were tortured into doing so. Thoughts on that?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6537901.stm

[Firecat]

If that's the worst the Iranians could do, i'm actually kinda disappointed. A guard kept flicking the guys neck? C'mon.

[Firecat]

I also want to mention that I'm a little skeptical about what they have to say, considering that some are selling their stories. I feel it may lead to some exaggerations. To make it that more interesting.

[nomix]

Yup.

Just think of how much you exaggerated the first times you punched someone while boozing, how many you punched when you told the story.

This is a lot bigger.

[tigger]

Originally Posted by Firecat

I've been thinking about this a lot. What exactly are the rules of engagement? (in both cases, Iraqi or Iranian waters). If it was an American ship, what would the outcome have been?

And the behavior of the soldiers while in Iran. Confessing, apologizing, shaking hands and thanking Ahmedinejad....when it doesn't appear that they were tortured into doing so. Thoughts on that?

Great questions. Unfortunately I haven't had the opportunity to completely read up on this whole situation yet, so i've got little to offer other than good old speculation.

As for rules of engagement i'm sure that if Britain had fired upon the Iranians open warfare would have resulted. The British where undoubtedly given orders not to fire upon Iranian coast gaurd or whatever, they're already trying to step out of the middle east and they wouldn't want another war on thier hands. Ahmedinejad knows this and exploited it.

If it had been an American ship? Interesting question. I don't think that the Iranians would have got close enough to an American ship to do much of anything. Not after Al Qaeda attacked that destroyer. Every US serviceman i've talked to said they would have rather disobeyed orders and risked a dishonorable discharge than allow themselves to be captured. Granted, most of those guys where Marines, and they are out of thier minds. No, I think if it had been an American ship those Iranians would have been blown out of the water "accidentally, in a training exercise, mistaken for buoy (sp?) targets..." if you know what I mean.

Finally I do believe that all the confessions and crap where coerced, you British are just too damned polite to have resisted . I think the whole thing is a propaganda push by the Iranian government to attempt to solidify themselves as the leading nation of the middle east. Hell, this is great stuff for Ahmedinejad to use. He "captured" a bunch of people from what is historically the greatest western Navy and got them to pat him on the back on TV. He was testing Britain, and I think they failed. Granted Bush gave his normal, "Cut that shit out or else" speech about it too, something they've heard a million times now.