How trashed is this clutch?

InfernalVortex · March 12th, 2008, 05:19 PM

I was going to put this in my other thread, but this is a little different in content.

This clutch came with a transmission I bought. I was told I can buy a new clutch disk and get the pressure plate refinished, but then I read that 80 percent of the price of a new clutch is the clutch disk anyway... so I'm not sure what to do with this thing. I was told someone may want it... but I'm not sure I dont want it. I dont know how worn down it really is or how much these clutch disks costs. It's a Spec Clutches Stage 3 clutch. Costs about $500!

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y226/DirtyBird133/100_6329.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y226/DirtyBird133/100_6328.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y226/DirtyBird133/100_6326.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y226/DirtyBird133/100_6325.jpg

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y226/DirtyBird133/100_6323-1.jpg

I can look at the clutch pads and see how much they've worn down (near the center you can see the original height) and it's realy not that much... but I dont know... maybe that tiny .5 mm of wear is astronomical in clutch terms?

Punisher Bass · March 12th, 2008, 07:53 PM

I'm not an expert, but I'd replace it. If anything you could take it an autoparts store or a mechanic and they could tell you if it still has any life left in it.

Spectre · March 12th, 2008, 08:00 PM

That clutch is trashed. You're just about to get into the rivets on the clutch plate if you haven't already on a couple of them, and that will trash the pressure plate AND the flywheel. If memory serves, those clutch pucks should each be twice their current thickness.

You need to buy a new clutch set including the pressure plate and get your *flywheel* resurfaced or replaced (even though this clutch has never been on your car - always service the flywheel when replacing a clutch.)

Fortunately, decent clutch sets are cheap for Camaros. I found this out when I played with putting a Camaro T5 into my last XJ6.

InfernalVortex · March 12th, 2008, 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spectre

That clutch is trashed. You're just about to get into the rivets on the clutch plate if you haven't already on a couple of them, and that will trash the pressure plate AND the flywheel. If memory serves, those clutch pucks should each be twice their current thickness.

You need to buy a new clutch set including the pressure plate and get your *flywheel* resurfaced or replaced (even though this clutch has never been on your car - always service the flywheel when replacing a clutch.)

Fortunately, decent clutch sets are cheap for Camaros. I found this out when I played with putting a Camaro T5 into my last XJ6.

This isn't a T5 clutch. This is a T56 clutch, for an LT1 camaro. They're at least $250. images/smilies/sad.gif

I need to get a new flywheel to fit a T56 and a 2piece rear main seal bolt pattern, and it's pricy, so I guess it'd be a good idea not to trash a $300 flywheel.

Just found out the clutch disk is $170! Cool! THat's not too crazy expensive... So then what do I do about the ridges in the pressure plate? Ignore them or...?

Steve Levin · March 12th, 2008, 10:47 PM

You want to start with a smooth/flat pressure late. Not sure if that can be machined or if you have to replace it. Otherwise you'll get uneven wear on the clutch disks and it just goes downhill from there. This is one of those deals where if you skip on things, you get to do them again in a few months. images/smilies/smile.gif

Steve

jayhawk · March 12th, 2008, 11:18 PM

You might as well replace it; it looks 75% worn, and better to do it now than later, when it could be a bad time to do so.

Hidden_Hunter · March 13th, 2008, 01:46 AM

Yep, I'd say she's gone as well (or very close to failure)

C53A_4G63T · March 13th, 2008, 03:41 AM

It's a Spec. That's reason enough for me to throw it in the garbage. Plus it is haggard.

New one.

InfernalVortex · March 13th, 2008, 05:09 AM

Will I have any trouble autocrossing/drag racing with a cheap ($2-$300) stock replacement style clutch? I saw some cheaper clutches and they explicitly say "NOT FOR RACING"... what's the difference?

Spectre · March 13th, 2008, 07:20 PM

Replace the pressure plate and resurface the flywheel.

tigger · March 13th, 2008, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spectre

Replace the pressure plate and resurface the flywheel.

You'll be glad you did later.

Manimillion · March 13th, 2008, 10:42 PM

The best thing to do is take a caliper and measure the clutch material.

WellsieTRD · March 14th, 2008, 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Manimillion

The best thing to do is take a caliper and measure the clutch material.

Why? If its rubbing on the rivits and the friction material, which it clearly is, then its fair to say its rooted. You'd probably get away with leaving the flywheel alone but if your really worried about it get a light skim done. Skimming the flywheel too much may cause vibrations due to the flywheel being underweight

C53A_4G63T · March 15th, 2008, 06:41 PM

NO, resurface the flywheel at a minimum. Never replace the clutch and throw the flywheel back in.

If you rebuilt a motor with new internals, would you put the old bearings back in?

InfernalVortex · March 15th, 2008, 07:52 PM

READ WHAT I AM SAYING.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InfernalVortex

I need to get a new flywheel to fit a T56 and a 2piece rear main seal bolt pattern...

This flywheel I have WILL NOT FIT MY CRANKSHAFT.

So if I bought a new clutch disk, it would be a new flywheel, new clutch disk, and an old pressure plate.

Either way, I've pretty much decided that salvaging it would be a waste of time.

And to the guy bashing Spec clutches, from my research Spec makes some pretty good stuff, although I've heard stories... but there are stories about all of them.

C53A_4G63T · March 16th, 2008, 04:19 AM

My friend ran their "Stage 3" clutch in his Bluebird swapped Nissan NX2000. Nothing crazy, maybe 300ish wheel horse power. He went through three of their clutches in about six months. Each time it he sent it to Spec and everytime they said it was dude to premature clutch failure/manufacturing issue. After the third he told them to go to hell. Put an ACT in and has not had a problem in two years.

I don't know anyone who will run them. But thats just my personal experiance.

dodgy · March 16th, 2008, 01:52 PM

Clutch isn't that stuffed, stuffed will have dropped springs out of the retainers images/smilies/smile.gif

There SFA meat left on the clutch plate though, replace clutch plate and pressure plate... it's an effort vs price thing, the effort of replacing them both now vs doing it later isn't worth the risk

The pressure plate has an obvious lip on it, so I'd assume the flywheel does too, in which case a machine would be highly recommended

InfernalVortex · March 16th, 2008, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by C53A_4G63T

My friend ran their "Stage 3" clutch in his Bluebird swapped Nissan NX2000. Nothing crazy, maybe 300ish wheel horse power. He went through three of their clutches in about six months. Each time it he sent it to Spec and everytime they said it was dude to premature clutch failure/manufacturing issue. After the third he told them to go to hell. Put an ACT in and has not had a problem in two years.

I don't know anyone who will run them. But thats just my personal experiance.

I think it depends a lot on the application. People speak highly of centerforce, but I know for a fact their T56 clutches are garbage, but I'm under the impression that their T5 clutches are pretty nice.

So I think it just depends. The Spec clutches (especially the Stage 3) are relatively popular among the Camaro/Corvette T56 guys.

klutch · March 16th, 2008, 10:10 PM

I'd def recommend replacement. Spec is pretty good, the failure mentioned was likely due to drag or incorrect setup (3 times....lol). Take a look on ebay, quite often you'll find nearly new ones, since you Camaro lot are pretty indecisive about your setups...

C53A_4G63T · March 17th, 2008, 04:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by klutch

I'd def recommend replacement. Spec is pretty good, the failure mentioned was likely due to drag or incorrect setup (3 times....lol). Take a look on ebay, quite often you'll find nearly new ones, since you Camaro lot are pretty indecisive about your setups...

Negative. Set up or abuse was never an issue. The cars first set up was put together by a professinal well known shop. They are known for building high powered Nissans and Toyota's/Lotus's. Albeit bad management.

The last couple set ups me and my friends have done. We also know how to set up a fast car properly. So it was deffinatly an error on behalf of Spec. No matter what the application, I have yet to meet someone who has had a good experiance with them.

They may be good for stock replacement for a near stock car. But for higher powered modified vehicles, I find them no good.

March 12th, 2008, 05:19 PM	#1
InfernalVortex Joined: Oct 28th, 2007 Last Online: July 27th, 2008 Location: Macon, Georgia, USA Age: 23 Posts: 380 Car: 92 Camaro Rep Power: 8	How trashed is this clutch? I was going to put this in my other thread, but this is a little different in content. This clutch came with a transmission I bought. I was told I can buy a new clutch disk and get the pressure plate refinished, but then I read that 80 percent of the price of a new clutch is the clutch disk anyway... so I'm not sure what to do with this thing. I was told someone may want it... but I'm not sure I dont want it. I dont know how worn down it really is or how much these clutch disks costs. It's a Spec Clutches Stage 3 clutch. Costs about $500! I can look at the clutch pads and see how much they've worn down (near the center you can see the original height) and it's realy not that much... but I dont know... maybe that tiny .5 mm of wear is astronomical in clutch terms? __________________

March 12th, 2008, 07:53 PM	#2
Punisher Bass Resident Buick Ninja Joined: Feb 25th, 2007 Last Online: 02:55 AM Location: St Louis, MO Age: 24 Posts: 1,263 Car: 98 Buick Park Avenue Ultra Rep Power: 39	I'm not an expert, but I'd replace it. If anything you could take it an autoparts store or a mechanic and they could tell you if it still has any life left in it. __________________ Mighty Buick Of Destruction

March 12th, 2008, 08:00 PM	#3
Spectre Joined: Feb 1st, 2007 Last Online: 08:44 AM Location: Dallas, Texas USA Age: 31 Posts: 3,009 Car: 87 XJ6, 95 XJR, 90 WD21, 86 CB700SC Rep Power: 52	That clutch is trashed. You're just about to get into the rivets on the clutch plate if you haven't already on a couple of them, and that will trash the pressure plate AND the flywheel. If memory serves, those clutch pucks should each be twice their current thickness. You need to buy a new clutch set including the pressure plate and get your flywheel resurfaced or replaced (even though this clutch has never been on your car - always service the flywheel when replacing a clutch.) Fortunately, decent clutch sets are cheap for Camaros. I found this out when I played with putting a Camaro T5 into my last XJ6. __________________ 1986 Honda Nighthawk 700S (project, light restoration in progress) 1987 Jaguar XJ6 Series III Vanden Plas (modified) 1990 Nissan (WD21) Pathfinder SE 4x4 (little red offroad commuter box) 1995 Jaguar (X300) XJR (modified) My truck can swim the English Channel; what can yours do? It's just another day / Where people cling to light / To drive away the fear / That comes with every night Last edited by Spectre; March 12th, 2008 at 08:06 PM..

March 12th, 2008, 10:47 PM	#5
Steve Levin VIP Joined: Jun 7th, 2006 Last Online: 06:08 AM Location: Sunnyvale, California Posts: 755 Car: Spec Racer Ford! Rep Power: 22	You want to start with a smooth/flat pressure late. Not sure if that can be machined or if you have to replace it. Otherwise you'll get uneven wear on the clutch disks and it just goes downhill from there. This is one of those deals where if you skip on things, you get to do them again in a few months. Steve

March 12th, 2008, 11:18 PM	#6
jayhawk Cigar Smoking Man Joined: Dec 11th, 2005 Last Online: 02:27 AM Location: A-Town, Illinois. Age: 33 Posts: 4,998 Car: MY07 G11 WRX-TR WRB. Rep Power: 86	You might as well replace it; it looks 75% worn, and better to do it now than later, when it could be a bad time to do so. __________________ It is nice to have friends like you on this forum. ...A fox among the chickens... Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery None but ourselves can free our minds…

March 13th, 2008, 01:46 AM	#7
Hidden_Hunter D: Joined: Oct 7th, 2006 Last Online: 08:40 AM Location: Melbourne, Australia Age: 20 Posts: 4,336 Car: '08 Honda Accord Euro Rep Power: 46	Yep, I'd say she's gone as well (or very close to failure) __________________ My car is dark grey not black!

March 13th, 2008, 03:41 AM	#8
C53A_4G63T Not A Dude Joined: Jun 30th, 2005 Last Online: 04:41 AM Location: Farmington, Connecticut Age: 22 Posts: 514 Car: 99' Infiniti Q45t, 89 Mitsubishi Mirage Turbo Rep Power: 15	It's a Spec. That's reason enough for me to throw it in the garbage. Plus it is haggard. New one. __________________ 1989 Mitsu Mirage Turbo Hatch, 4G63T swap and more goodies to make it a low 12 sec car. Better to own a Volvo, than be owned by one. I work for Buick....... and it's not nearly as fun as it sounds.

March 13th, 2008, 05:09 AM	#9
InfernalVortex Joined: Oct 28th, 2007 Last Online: July 27th, 2008 Location: Macon, Georgia, USA Age: 23 Posts: 380 Car: 92 Camaro Rep Power: 8	Will I have any trouble autocrossing/drag racing with a cheap ($2-$300) stock replacement style clutch? I saw some cheaper clutches and they explicitly say "NOT FOR RACING"... what's the difference? __________________

March 13th, 2008, 07:20 PM	#10
Spectre Joined: Feb 1st, 2007 Last Online: 08:44 AM Location: Dallas, Texas USA Age: 31 Posts: 3,009 Car: 87 XJ6, 95 XJR, 90 WD21, 86 CB700SC Rep Power: 52	Replace the pressure plate and resurface the flywheel. __________________ 1986 Honda Nighthawk 700S (project, light restoration in progress) 1987 Jaguar XJ6 Series III Vanden Plas (modified) 1990 Nissan (WD21) Pathfinder SE 4x4 (little red offroad commuter box) 1995 Jaguar (X300) XJR (modified) My truck can swim the English Channel; what can yours do? It's just another day / Where people cling to light / To drive away the fear / That comes with every night

March 13th, 2008, 10:42 PM	#12
Manimillion Banned Joined: Jan 1st, 2008 Last Online: March 14th, 2008 Posts: 98 Rep Power: 0	The best thing to do is take a caliper and measure the clutch material.

March 15th, 2008, 06:41 PM	#14
C53A_4G63T Not A Dude Joined: Jun 30th, 2005 Last Online: 04:41 AM Location: Farmington, Connecticut Age: 22 Posts: 514 Car: 99' Infiniti Q45t, 89 Mitsubishi Mirage Turbo Rep Power: 15	NO, resurface the flywheel at a minimum. Never replace the clutch and throw the flywheel back in. If you rebuilt a motor with new internals, would you put the old bearings back in? __________________ 1989 Mitsu Mirage Turbo Hatch, 4G63T swap and more goodies to make it a low 12 sec car. Better to own a Volvo, than be owned by one. I work for Buick....... and it's not nearly as fun as it sounds.

March 16th, 2008, 04:19 AM	#16
C53A_4G63T Not A Dude Joined: Jun 30th, 2005 Last Online: 04:41 AM Location: Farmington, Connecticut Age: 22 Posts: 514 Car: 99' Infiniti Q45t, 89 Mitsubishi Mirage Turbo Rep Power: 15	My friend ran their "Stage 3" clutch in his Bluebird swapped Nissan NX2000. Nothing crazy, maybe 300ish wheel horse power. He went through three of their clutches in about six months. Each time it he sent it to Spec and everytime they said it was dude to premature clutch failure/manufacturing issue. After the third he told them to go to hell. Put an ACT in and has not had a problem in two years. I don't know anyone who will run them. But thats just my personal experiance. __________________ 1989 Mitsu Mirage Turbo Hatch, 4G63T swap and more goodies to make it a low 12 sec car. Better to own a Volvo, than be owned by one. I work for Buick....... and it's not nearly as fun as it sounds.

March 16th, 2008, 01:52 PM	#17
dodgy Joined: Nov 30th, 2007 Last Online: March 16th, 2008 Location: Sydney NSW Australia Age: 22 Posts: 27 Car: Toyota ST165 GT4 & ST162 Celica SX Rep Power: 5	Clutch isn't that stuffed, stuffed will have dropped springs out of the retainers There SFA meat left on the clutch plate though, replace clutch plate and pressure plate... it's an effort vs price thing, the effort of replacing them both now vs doing it later isn't worth the risk The pressure plate has an obvious lip on it, so I'd assume the flywheel does too, in which case a machine would be highly recommended

March 16th, 2008, 10:10 PM	#19
klutch Courteous urinator Joined: Jan 6th, 2006 Last Online: Yesterday Location: Vancouver, BC Posts: 1,696 Car: Whatever's in the press fleet. Rep Power: 27	I'd def recommend replacement. Spec is pretty good, the failure mentioned was likely due to drag or incorrect setup (3 times....lol). Take a look on ebay, quite often you'll find nearly new ones, since you Camaro lot are pretty indecisive about your setups... __________________

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