2008 Pontiac G8 *Cough* commodore* cough* lol

Dsemaj

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Now we can hope that the G8 GXP will look like the pictures we have, and have the motor from the 500hp supercharged Monaro (VX500?).

Otherwise this car will be a tough sell against the 425hp Dodge Charger, especially since the manual transmission will not be a big seller (it's not like you need many gears when you have that much torque).

Steve
The VXR500's engine is just a LS2, which is in the HSV GTO with a supercharger slapped on.. nothing special about the engine. It was only done by a certain network of dealers in the UK (Greens or something) with the approval of Vauxhall and the supercharger was from an Australian Aftermarket company.. So whatever helps you sleep at night ;)

If i'm not mistaken, 425HP Dodge Charger = SRT version = More money over the G8.

The US probably wont get the HSV ~420HP version, since I doubt HSV would have the capacity.
 

Steve Levin

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If i'm not mistaken, 425HP Dodge Charger = SRT version = More money over the G8.
Only about $3,000. Call it $40/month. For some people it'll matter...but probably not for the people in the $35,000+ car market.

Oh, and for that extra money you also get a track day thrown in for free (using Chrysler's cars) -- I did mine at Laguna Seca.

Steve
 

kaBOOMn

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The VXR500's engine is just a LS2, which is in the HSV GTO with a supercharger slapped on.. nothing special about the engine. It was only done by a certain network of dealers in the UK (Greens or something) with the approval of Vauxhall and the supercharger was from an Australian Aftermarket company.. So whatever helps you sleep at night ;)

If i'm not mistaken, 425HP Dodge Charger = SRT version = More money over the G8.

The US probably wont get the HSV ~420HP version, since I doubt HSV would have the capacity.
CAPA, yeah I saw one of their motors in a normal VT.....oh lala :D :D (And its very hard to get me excited by a V8 thats not Italian....)
 

Hidden_Hunter

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Charger is a different sort of market I would of said to the G8


I'm curious though Americans, is there a stigma that it will be built well because its built in aus or that it will just be built like all other GM cars.
 

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Pontiac isn't in the business of adding fake scoops to cars anymore. The GTO's hood scoops were functional, so I'm betting these are too.


And by functional, I mean they actually allow are into the engine. :)
On the WS6 firebird the top scoops could have been functional but were blocked off. BTW this is what someone called "overdesigned" on page 1, I thought it had curves in all the right places.



I'm not a fan of the undoubtedly fake hood scoops on the G8. On all the LSx engines the MAF and air intake are positioned to take air from the front.
 

Steve Levin

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Charger is a different sort of market I would of said to the G8

I'm curious though Americans, is there a stigma that it will be built well because its built in aus or that it will just be built like all other GM cars.
I doubt most people knew -- including most owners of the past GTO -- that it's Australian. :) But I don't think that would represent a downside, regardless.

As far as the Charger and the G8 -- I would fully expect them to go head-to-head. At least until Ford builds the Interceptor. :)

Steve
 

thedguy

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I doubt most people knew -- including most owners of the past GTO -- that it's Australian. :) But I don't think that would represent a downside, regardless.
Steve
You might be surprised on that. Every single magazine article that talked about it had to point out it was aussie built and engineered.

Then again, a lot of people that have never heard of it think it's just a stretched FWD cavalier.

Hidden_Hunter said:
I'm curious though Americans, is there a stigma that it will be built well because its built in aus or that it will just be built like all other GM cars.
I don't think there is much of a stigma about them yet. The GTO didn't sell well enough for anyone to get a legitimate opinion on them. Perhaps the G8 will gain that stigma and cause Ford to lower the quality of the FPV stuff and send them to the US.
 

Deanodriver

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The VXR500's engine is just a LS2, which is in the HSV GTO with a supercharger slapped on.. nothing special about the engine. It was only done by a certain network of dealers in the UK (Greens or something) with the approval of Vauxhall and the supercharger was from an Australian Aftermarket company.. So whatever helps you sleep at night ;)

If i'm not mistaken, 425HP Dodge Charger = SRT version = More money over the G8.

The US probably wont get the HSV ~420HP version, since I doubt HSV would have the capacity.
I reckon it'd be more likely to see the Z06 engine in a super-hot VE, rather than a supercharged LS2. :)
 

HSV GTS

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I dont know why they didnt put the Z06 engine in the GTS, cause if they had it would have directly competed with the BMW M5 (and beaten it in every Conceivable way, except interior quality) like every other flagship HSV.
 

Dsemaj

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It was probably too much of a cost at the time, maybe? Or a Z06 powered HSV might have been too expensive to market, as they might have thought no one would want to buy a $100k+ HSV, no matter what kind of power it had.
 

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I'm curious though Americans, is there a stigma that it will be built well because its built in aus or that it will just be built like all other GM cars.
Most people don't know, but those that do actually see it as a <slight> improvement over the usual domestic GM fare -- in a way the same halo Saturn is getting by bringing over Opels. The press and enthusiasts here were excited about the quality/fit/finish of the interior, and the independent rear suspension.

Over here the interiors are usually very cheap plastic (muscle cars have traditionally been bitten badly by this), and detroit loves to put solid rear axles in these kinds of cars to keep it cheap. The new Mustang still has a solid rear axle and they nixed the IRS for the Cobra/Shelby cars. Chrysler laments the cost in the Challenger/Charger but goes ahead; same with GM and the upcoming Camaro. But they continue to whine about costs and how it will hurt them against the Mustang.

I think what hurt the last GTO is the following:
- People don't think Pontiac for musclecars anymore. Most of their stuff is ugly underpowered FWD cars.
- Using the GTO name was a mistake. That name was a legend. Don't give a car that name lightly.
- If they were going to use the GTO name, they either needed to go retro or at least give the new car enough visual cues to liken it with the old GTO.
- Having lost the Firebird, I think people were looking for more of a sleek coupe/sports car bodystyle.
 

Deanodriver

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I think what hurt the last GTO is the following:
- People don't think Pontiac for musclecars anymore. Most of their stuff is ugly underpowered FWD cars.
- Using the GTO name was a mistake. That name was a legend. Don't give a car that name lightly.
- If they were going to use the GTO name, they either needed to go retro or at least give the new car enough visual cues to liken it with the old GTO.
- Having lost the Firebird, I think people were looking for more of a sleek coupe/sports car bodystyle.
I thought (from a non-American perspective), that people the muscle car was considered to be designed with sharper lines and more creases, and the new GTO was viewed as too soft (design wise) and too flowing to be a muscle car, that it was more a sports coupe.

I wonder if it would have gained a better reputation (and hence sales) with a different name?

However, you've got to consider that the GTO badge probably meant a higher asking price, and the car was already dirt cheap compared to the Monaro (the base GTO in the US was ~3/4 of the price of the base Aussie Monaro, and we only got the 5.7, the 6.0L was only for the HSV GTO (from late 04), which started at ~30% more than the Monaro did).

The Monaro has held its value very well here compared to its Commodore sister, though. I just jumped on carsales, and the earliest CV8 Monaros (from 2001-2002), were still selling for over $30,000. The equivalent Commodore (VX SS) was under $20,000 (although the Commodore was cheaper new).
 

jetsetter

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I thought (from a non-American perspective), that people the muscle car was considered to be designed with sharper lines and more creases, and the new GTO was viewed as too soft (design wise) and too flowing to be a muscle car, that it was more a sports coupe.
That was the main problem.
 

tigger

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I thought (from a non-American perspective), that people the muscle car was considered to be designed with sharper lines and more creases, and the new GTO was viewed as too soft (design wise) and too flowing to be a muscle car, that it was more a sports coupe.
Definitely. That is one reason I don't particularly care for the 4th generation Camaro too, it doesn't look very agressive to me. I also don't see anything wrong with an Australian Pontiac. Lol, you could argue the cars you guys down there have been getting for the last decade or two where more american than what we where getting in... America.

Also, is HSV an in-house program like the GXP cars? Or is it something more like SLP?
 

Hidden_Hunter

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HSV's relationship with holden is wierd, it's official but not owned by them (Tom Wilkenshaw owns it I beleive)
 

NecroJoe

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I thought (from a non-American perspective), that people the muscle car was considered to be designed with sharper lines and more creases, and the new GTO was viewed as too soft (design wise) and too flowing to be a muscle car, that it was more a sports coupe.
No, it looked almost no different from a Dodge Avenger from the 90's. (which was essentially, a 2-door Dodge Stratus.
 

Deanodriver

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Also, is HSV an in-house program like the GXP cars? Or is it something more like SLP?
I guess it's kinda like how AMG is to Mercedes-Benz, except it's not owned by Holden (although they're available at pretty much all Holden dealerships).

There's only been two HSVs that aren't Commodore/Commodore Ute/Adventra based, one being the Astra VXR, the other the Astra SV1800 (which was essentially a rebadged late 80's Nissan Pulsar with a bodykit, same 1.8L engine as the normal cars).

I'm not certain why HSV isn't owned by Holden, racing perhaps? (doubt it, though)
 

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There's only been two HSVs that aren't Commodore/Commodore Ute/Adventra based, one being the Astra VXR, the other the Astra SV1800 (which was essentially a rebadged late 80's Nissan Pulsar with a bodykit, same 1.8L engine as the normal cars).
Don't forget the Jackaroo.
 
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