Is being a woman a disablity?

BlaRo

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Holy shit, that's a dissertation.

All I got out of the beginning though is that a gentleman is a snob, a tattered anachronism of the "old guard". You still want to see those types of people around? Words change over time, as do their meanings, so it's no surprise that "gentleman" has evolved over centuries. He shouldn't kiss ass, that's a given, but he shouldn't walk around arrogantly thinking he's God's gift from the heavens. That may have worked to gain favor with Marie Antoinette, but in the 21st century you would deserve to be punched in the throat.

It's easy to say that doing things for sex is pathetic, but it's also human nature to lust after what you want, and currying favor is simply one way of demonstrating this. You can look down upon the pathetic bastards slovenly following an attractive girl around at a bar or party, offering her another drink so he can bed her for one wild night and treat her like a piece of property. But everybody knows they've been in such a situation before, they only interpret it differently (and hopefully less like the scumbag I described above). It's human nature, what did you expect? We're not exactly an intelligent species after all, what with our crippling foibles and petty jealousy and everything else that we blame on "nature". All this rambling about being a "gentleman" is just rambling.

Yeah, I use moisturizer. So what? I also believe that women should buy us drinks from time to time, because I'm tired of seeing the stupid "men are dumb, women are conquerors" feminist bullshit in advertising. This isn't "Downtown", we're not all slovenly brutes who don't know what the ass end of a rolling pin is and only know the way to the fridge for another Miller Lite while we watch "the game". There's nothing wrong with being multi-faceted and using a free bottle of Banana Republic moisturizer that my friend scored me from work while I open up the cylinder head to my vintage motorcycle after preparing stuffed chicken Valentino for a few sorority girls. Do we still need to conform to ancient stereotypes? Worse, do we need to pander to women because we denied them the vote until 1920? And has that become an excuse for radicals to play the "sexist" card every chance they get? Jesse Jackson doesn't exactly represent all black people, either.

Whatever. I'm procrastinating on an essay (on why the environmentalism movement is a load of shit) that was supposed to be due half an hour ago, so I'll stop here.
 

ViperVX

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Don't really agree with POV's above. Women don't fight for their rights/job/salary, appreciate good behavior less than men? What a bunch of bull. You guys are just a bit selfish IMO.
You think, the moment women got equal rights with men, they also receiverd quial abilities, which they ofc. didn't.
 
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HardwareBoB

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You're right about the fact that males in almost all species are the ones that go out to forage for food, but to answer your question completely you'll have to delve into species biology and examine the interactions between monkeys and other similar animals. Patterns exist between all carbon-based life forms, it's just that we have different ways of showing them.
actually, in humans, males hunt. Women forage for food and provide for the young while the males are out hunting. Women have an evolutionary imperative to keep house and produce offspring.

Don't really agree with POV's above. Women don't fight for their rights/job/salary, appreciate good behavior less than men? What a bunch of bull. You guys are just a bit selfish IMO.
Women are typically more considerate and selfless than men. This directly results in the described behaviour. Men are selfish fuckers who progress without considering others.
 
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toma_alimosh

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All I got out of the beginning though is that a gentleman is a snob, a tattered anachronism of the "old guard". You still want to see those types of people around? He shouldn't kiss ass, that's a given, but he shouldn't walk around arrogantly thinking he's God's gift from the heavens. That may have worked to gain favor with Marie Antoinette, but in the 21st century you would deserve to be punched in the throat.
No, you don't get it. Being a gentleman is not about being a snob, it's about holding face to whatever may come your way. It's about respecting your image and not letting others walk all over you just because society expects you to act in that fashion. It's about being a good man and not bowing your head to anyone even for the little things.

For a better example, see the movie "Leopold & Kate" ... it may not be the best movie out there and I was tricked by a girl I once dated into watching it, but it shows through the actions of Leopold what a gentleman actually is. He's not a snob, if anything, he's polite and well mannered, but he doesn't stay to be criticized and when asked to lie on national television, he promptly refuses, because he respects his image and that of those before him and will not lower down to lying for money. The movie also shows that he doesn't really go out of his way to open doors for the women around him or anything like that, but he does so for Kate, because he knows her and admires her. Also, he doesn't do it in a needy way. He does it out of respect. Also, when Kate's purse is snatched, he doesn't say: "oh, let him go, he may have a gun and he'll shoot us if we follow him in an alley, it's not worth it."; instead, he grabs a horse and goes after the bastard, which he later traps and confronts. I could go on but it should be enough. Just watch that movie and you'll get it, and sorry, it will probably be a torture, because it's not a very interesting film, but you can skip the uninteresting parts.

It's easy to say that doing things for sex is pathetic, but it's also human nature to lust after what you want, and currying favor is simply one way of demonstrating this. You can look down upon the pathetic bastards slovenly following an attractive girl around at a bar or party, offering her another drink so he can bed her for one wild night and treat her like a piece of property. But everybody knows they've been in such a situation before, they only interpret it differently (and hopefully less like the scumbag I described above). It's human nature, what did you expect? We're not exactly an intelligent species after all, what with our crippling foibles and petty jealousy and everything else that we blame on "nature". All this rambling about being a "gentleman" is just rambling.
Wow, thanks for calling me a rambling scumbag. I know that I don't think I'm "God's gift to this world and I'm certainly not a snob, but the way I interpretted the "chasing the woman around the bar" scene is not necessarily so far from the truth.

I know it may be a sad realization for many of us that we buy things for women and we expect them to give us their attentions in return and that it's all in vein, because that doesn't get us absolutely anywhere, but I'm not going to stand being put down because I tell things as they truly are. What I said about that bad habit of men may have struck a few chords to some people here, probably because they do it all the time, and you know what? I did it so that they would learn what they actually communicate to the opposite sex about themselves whenever they do this. If anything, I did it for their benefit and I stand by my words.

It is human nature to do it, yes. It is also human nature for men to be violent, dishonest and polygamous. But we don't all act on these traits, do we? Instead, we hold back on our polygamous nature and court one woman at a time. We also make all our business ventures without cheating by doing it in legal ways. And we hold back our anger rather than swing a punch at the very smallest irritating thing that one does. Sure, there are men among us that do still act on their animalistic nature, and you know what? Call them scumbags, not me. Because they surely deserve it.

And let me state for the record that I do not pick up girls in bars, nor do I go after them and offer them drinks. Those who want to pair themselves up with a horny girl who came to the bar alone expecting for someone to try and seduce her, be my guest. That's not the kind of girl I want to end up with and I'm surely surprised if any of you would actually want that for yourselves. If I have to choose between a whore and a girl I can truly respect, I choose the second one, because I don't allow my penis to do the thinking for me in these matters.

And you know what? I won't lie. I've been there before ... going out of my way to make a girl's day better, trying to be a "nice guy" and you know what? Somebody did for me what I tried to accompish here and told me how low and degrading to myself that habit was. And you know what? Ever since I stopped that, I'm getting more girls and more quality girls than I have before. And they're genuinely interested in me. Not in my pocket, because I don't have a big one, not in my favours, because even I think I may be doing too little of them, but rather they're interested in me. And best of all, they respect me.

Yeah, I use moisturizer. So what? I also believe that women should buy us drinks from time to time, because I'm tired of seeing the stupid "men are dumb, women are conquerors" feminist bullshit in advertising. This isn't "Downtown", we're not all slovenly brutes who don't know what the ass end of a rolling pin is and only know the way to the fridge for another Miller Lite while we watch "the game". There's nothing wrong with being multi-faceted and using a free bottle of Banana Republic moisturizer that my friend scored me from work while I open up the cylinder head to my vintage motorcycle after preparing stuffed chicken Valentino for a few sorority girls. Do we still need to conform to ancient stereotypes? Worse, do we need to pander to women because we denied them the vote until 1920? And has that become an excuse for radicals to play the "sexist" card every chance they get? Jesse Jackson doesn't exactly represent all black people, either.
I also use moisturizer and if you read what I said carefully, I'm just saying society in general puts men down for doing it. Not me. And I'm not opposed to women buying men drinks but I don't think men should be expecting that women do buy them drinks. There's a big difference between hating the feminist bullshit campaigns and expecting your girlfriend to pay for your consumption. You should be able to get it yourself at least to save face. And instead of looking your girlfriend in the eye and telling her you're "a little short today, do you mind?" you pay the tab because you don't depend on her to parade you around "downtown".

\I'm done for now
\\Oh, and I do demand an oppology for being called a scumbag. :mad:
 

BlaRo

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I also use moisturizer and if you read what I said carefully, I'm just saying society in general puts men down for doing it. Not me. And I'm not opposed to women buying men drinks but I don't think men should be expecting that women do buy them drinks. There's a big difference between hating the feminist bullshit campaigns and expecting your girlfriend to pay for your consumption. You should be able to get it yourself at least to save face. And instead of looking your girlfriend in the eye and telling her you're "a little short today, do you mind?" you pay the tab because you don't depend on her to parade you around "downtown".

\I'm done for now
\\Oh, and I do demand an oppology for being called a scumbag. :mad:
Yo, dude, I never called you a scumbag! Unless you're the type of dude that preys on drunk chicks, like the example I was creating, but that was a general, hypothetical, example of a stereotype (and unfortunately, like many people I see). Alright? I don't mean to antagonize you. :D

I also never cited YOU out for using moisturizer; if you noticed I only disagreed with you on your highly-specific, slightly outdated definition of a "gentleman". Maybe you should reread what I wrote before embarking on your novels.
 

toma_alimosh

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Women don't fight for their rights/job/salary, appreciate good behavior less than men? What a bunch of bull. You guys are just a bit selfish IMO.
You think, the moment women got equal rights with men, they also receiverd quial abilities, which they ofc. didn't.
I agree that women do fight for their rights/job/salary. I see examples of that every day. The only problem that I see is that they go about it the wrong way. I can't believe I've ever seen someone promoted by merit alone. Everyone who has made it to the top has cheated their way through at least once along the way, and that's the way it is.

And I think you're confusing "good behaviour" with "favours". Good behaviour towards girls means not insulting them, not being violent towards them or sexist against them. Favours on the other hand is holding someone's door open because their hands are occupied, offering your seat on the subway because they look tired, etc. It's the favours that we're dicussing here, not good behaviour. I think good behaviour is at least considered a requisite by most men today ... to at least respect the law, if anything.


Women are typically more considerate and selfless than men. This directly results in the described behaviour. Men are selfish fuckers who progress without considering others.
Please retract that last statement. It is degrading for all men. I'm not a selfish fucker who wants progress without considering others. But I'm also not one to pass up for promotion just because someone else of the opposite sex wants it. They can fight just as hard as me on this one. If they don't, they lose. And it's not because they're women. A democratic society is all about survival of the fittest, well, I think this applies here too. Women have beaten me to promotions before, and it's not because they're women and I'm a man, nor because they performed better than I did.

Yo, dude, I never called you a scumbag! Unless you're the type of dude that preys on drunk chicks, like the example I was creating, but that was a general, hypothetical, example of a stereotype (and unfortunately, like many people I see). Alright? I don't mean to antagonize you. :D

I also never cited YOU out for using moisturizer; if you noticed I only disagreed with you on your highly-specific, slightly outdated definition of a "gentleman". Maybe you should reread what I wrote before embarking on your novels.
My apologies, then. I thought you were discribing my definition of a gentleman as a scumbag, not the duche that preys on drunken women. And yes, my vision of what a gentleman is may be called outdated, but what women refer to when they say they want a gentleman or a "night in shining armor" I imagine is not far from my definition of a gentleman. So I'd rather accept that than the "needy wuss who goes out of his way to hold doors for girls" definition.
 

thedguy

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I'm on my way home at the moment on the train, and when I got on the train, I walked in, took a second to take my backpack off so I could sit in the one available seat. While I was doing that, obviously the woman behind me (who I couldn't see) had been eyeing off the seat, because as I sat down, she muttered "oh, the perfect gentleman".
Should have uttered back "You wanted equality" or "Shouldn't you be in kitchen?"

All that shit by me

Remember, I am an advocate of feminism and true equality. Start fighting for that and I will march right along side you.
Fucking +1 for (all) that :bow:
 
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HardwareBoB

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Please retract that last statement. It is degrading for all men. I'm not a selfish fucker who wants progress without considering others. But I'm also not one to pass up for promotion just because someone else of the opposite sex wants it. They can fight just as hard as me on this one. If they don't, they lose. And it's not because they're women. A democratic society is all about survival of the fittest, well, I think this applies here too. Women have beaten me to promotions before, and it's not because they're women and I'm a man, nor because they performed better than I did.
Men are genetically hardwired to be more selfish than women. That's what I said, (albeit a little more colourfully) and I'll stick to it.
 

Jay

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I'm on my way home at the moment on the train, and when I got on the train, I walked in, took a second to take my backpack off so I could sit in the one available seat. While I was doing that, obviously the woman behind me (who I couldn't see) had been eyeing off the seat, because as I sat down, she muttered "oh, the perfect gentleman".
She's probably 40ish, looks healthy, wearing a suit.
I'm male, 26, also in suit.
she had to spend a whole 10 minutes or so standing up watching her ipod touch before she got a seat. how terrible.
I frequently offer my seat to elderly, infirm, disabled or pregnant people, so I'll be damned if I give it up for some stupid sexist middle age bitch.
Well, different stroke for different folks. Had I been in that situation, I would have apologized profusely, stood up quickly and offered my seat.

But that is me. My parents instilled in me that no matter the situation, you will give up your seat to a woman, you will open a door, any door, for a woman, and most importantly, you will not sit down during mealtimes or social occasions until the woman is seated first. Period!

Maybe I am analog in a digital world, so to say. Maybe I am a fool for being gallant and a gentleman.
 

HardwareBoB

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Well, different stroke for different folks. Had I been in that situation, I would have apologized profusely, stood up quickly and offered my seat.

But that is me. My parents instilled in me that no matter the situation, you will give up your seat to a woman, you will open a door, any door, for a woman, and most importantly, you will not sit down during mealtimes or social occasions until the woman is seated first. Period!

Maybe I am analog in a digital world, so to say. Maybe I am a fool for being gallant and a gentleman.
I am similar, however it's not "no matter the sitation".
if a woman is rude to me, I see no reason to put myself out for her
If she had politely asked me if she could sit down, then I would have happily given her the seat.
 

BlaRo

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This is a good thread, I'll be following it closely seeing as I have to write a paper on it for tomorrow.
 

Blind_Io

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I think I speak for several of us when I say I would be interested to see that posted.
 

BlaRo

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John Steed = Le cool. :cool:

Me included. It would prove an interesting read. What course is this for?
Social Problems 102, 2-page reaction paper. I have to read 50 pages first, though. Believe me, the result will be thoroughly disappointing. :cry:
 

Twerp128

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Ambermorn, this may come as a surprise to you, and many here, but promotion in the workplace is not given to those who outperform their co-workers, and longevity with a company. Instead, promotions are given by the bosses to the closer friends they have in the company ... and sometimes even outside the company. Doesn't matter if you kiss ass, doesn't matter how well you perform in your job. The only thing that matters for promotion is how close a friend you are to the big boss.

Do you hang out with him, do you invite him to your parties, do you get him a present on his birthday? etc. This is because anyone would rather work more closely with a friend than with a stranger. So when you're stuck late at night doing inventory or counting up the numbers on thousands of receipts because you have no choice, who would you want to spend that time with? A friend or a complete stranger?

The guy you're talking about probably got promoted because he did that. He seriously befriended the boss (probably just so that he would receive the promotion, but that doesn't matter to the boss, really).
I'm sorry this is a load of shit. Your saying the only people that are promoted are ass kissers that are buddy-buddy with the boss. No. Every company I've worked at promotions are performance based, some out there are tenure based. I've worked with plenty of people that are friends with the boss but then don't get the promotion because they're too busy ass kissing and not working. You have to assume most legitimate managers were promoted because they know a thing or two about leadership and can identify who they're good workers are. I myself have been friends with most of my bosses, but in a professional way.

Oh, and everyone thinks they deserve a promotion because they are the best worker.
 

nist7

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When women start fighting for the right to register for the Selective Service (that means the draft for anyone without a penis) at the age of 18, then, and only then, will feminism once more have my support.
Hell yes!

:bow:
 

-Cpt. J.-

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I always assumed it was due to the incapacitation of the female before, during, and after pregnancy, combined with biological triggers in females to stay with developing offspring and in males to search for food. I have no particular reason as to why these triggers would develop, however. What are your ideas on the subject?



Uh, you yourself just said societies have been male-controlled for centuries. :huh:
It goes back to the fucking stone age. Men hunted and women took care of the camp...
There was no vanity back then, mankind did what it had to do to survive and it kinda stuck. Only after manknd discovered something called vanity, and we realized there's no creature on earth that can challenge us, women started to get the short stick.

And if there's a feminist reading his I beg you do not ask me "Is it fair that men hunt and women don't during the stone age?!" Women and men have had a different role in the society for a long time. This world has been built on the blood bled by men and it was nurtured by women. This is something you cannot change anymore and bitching about it... I lack the words to describe how fucking pathetic it is to complain about the fact that men ruled for "centuries".

I mean... our species did what it had to in order to survive and feminists think it is sexist...?? :| Welcome to the 21st century. I realize the society is changing and women can do many of the same things as men these days.
I'm done with this silly thread.
 
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