The Trump Presidency - how I stopped worrying and learned to love the Hair

LeVeL

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Says an anonymous man on the internet who, in this very thread, revealed that he doesn't understand income tax brackets and stock prices. And who, in another nearby thread put his ignorance about economics on full display. Your having any such degrees from an accredited institution is a laughable thought.
Either rebut anything I've said or pipe down and go back to coloring.
 

prizrak

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How about the myth that anyone can become rich if they work hard enough?
Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos, Oprah, Steve Jobs, Sergei Brinn and Larry Page, Mark Zuckerberg, whoever is behind Instagram (dunno their names), people behind Waze (same for names), Elon Musk, Mark Shuttleworth (he is behind Ubuntu Linux), Dr. Fucking Dre and Jeffrey Lovine.

Notice that none* of these people are entertainers of any kind, none were born into wealth and all made their money by creating a desirable product/service.

*Dre became a billionaire after selling his headphones to Apple, so he kind of lives in both worlds.

That of course doesn't mean EVERYONE can become wealthy with hard work but it is not impossible. Of course only a small percentage of people will end up b/millionaires, it's natural that in any given "population" there will be a relatively small number of people at the top, it's true for engineering, it's true for science, it's true for art, etc...

EDIT:
https://www.disnat.com/en/learning/trading-basics/stock-basics/what-causes-stock-prices-to-change
investment firm said:
At the most fundamental level, supply and demand in the market determine stock price.

Theoretically earnings are what affect investors' valuation of a company, but there are other indicators that investors use to predict stock price. Remember, it is investors' sentiments, attitudes, and expectations that ultimately affect stock prices.

There are many theories that try to explain the way stock prices move the way they do. Unfortunately, there is no one theory that can explain everything.
 

LeVeL

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Of course only a small percentage of people will end up b/millionaires...
I disagree. Something like 20% of Americans retire as millionaires. In fact, if you put away $100 a month into an I decided fund for 40 years, historical average returns would net you a million by retirement. Then you figure in all the people who have paid off their mortgages by the time they retire.
 

prizrak

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I disagree. Something like 20% of Americans retire as millionaires. In fact, if you put away $100 a month into an I decided fund for 40 years, historical average returns would net you a million by retirement. Then you figure in all the people who have paid off their mortgages by the time they retire.
That’s a relatively small percentage ;)
 

Mr. Nice

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I disagree. Something like 20% of Americans retire as millionaires. In fact, if you put away $100 a month into an I decided fund for 40 years, historical average returns would net you a million by retirement. Then you figure in all the people who have paid off their mortgages by the time they retire.
More Levtardedness. An I decided fund? Do you mean index fund? The historical average rate of market return is often considered to be 10%. You won't get 10% for various reasons, not least of which are the fees that your investment firm will charge you. Let's say, for this argument, that you're not paying any fees. You will still end up with less than $600,000 when investing $100 a month over 40 years. That's pretty good, but it's not 1 million. When you subtract a small amount for fees (I pay .04% on one of my index funds) and some more for both market gyrations and the fact that we are likely in a mature market, you will see that number fall further.

With all that said, I still recommend to anyone reading this that they find a good index fund that tracks the broader stock market (total US or total world markets) and invest towards retirement.
 
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Dr_Grip

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Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos, Oprah, Steve Jobs, Sergei Brinn and Larry Page, Mark Zuckerberg, whoever is behind Instagram (dunno their names), people behind Waze (same for names), Elon Musk, Mark Shuttleworth (he is behind Ubuntu Linux), Dr. Fucking Dre and Jeffrey Lovine.

Notice that none* of these people are entertainers of any kind, none were born into wealth and all made their money by creating a desirable product/service.

*Dre became a billionaire after selling his headphones to Apple, so he kind of lives in both worlds.
The fact that you include Shuttleworth, who has no connection to the USA at all, but is a very proud South African who, like Jeremy Clarkson, doges taxes by living on the Isle of Man, shows that you are grasping at straws. But apart from that....

Let's start with Oprah and Dre, who even if they made the biggest chunk their money elsewhere, started their careers and built their brands (as well as starting capital for their ventures) in entertainment, as a Talk show host and NWA member, respectively.

The rest of your list, even including people who made their fortune when Bush Sr. was still in office, shows the decline of the American Dream.

Old version: "From rags to riches"
New Version: "From upper-middle class parents who can pay your way through Ivy League college to riches"

The only "real" rags to riches story you could come up with is Jeffrey Iovine, who from a working class background worked his way through the engineering ranks at Interscope (entertainment again) to become the brain behind Dre's headphones. Looking back to the 50s to 80s there were dozens of stories like this (Iacocca, DeLorean, Soros, to just name three from the top of my head). Now you are so hard-pressed to name one you don't even get the name right. And that's because one person a pattern does not make.
 

LeVeL

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More Levtardedness. An I decided fund? Do you mean index fund? The historical average rate of market return is often considered to be 10%. You won't get 10% for various reasons, not least of which are the fees that your investment firm will charge you. Let's say, for this argument, that you're not paying any fees. You will still end up with less than $600,000 when investing $100 a month over 40 years. That's pretty good, but it's not 1 million. When you subtract a small amount for fees (I pay .04% on one of my index funds) and some more for both market gyrations and the fact that we are likely in a mature market, you will see that number fall further.

With all that said, I still recommend to anyone reading this that they find a good index fund that tracks the broader stock market (total US or total world markets) and invest towards retirement.
The average return for the S&P has been 12%, not 10%. We can argue all day about whether or not someone investing today will end up with the 12% but the math shows that such a return would net you the $1mil I was talking about.
 

prizrak

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The fact that you include Shuttleworth, who has no connection to the USA at all,
I included him mostly because I like Ubuntu, you are wrong about no connection to the US, he made his money where Thawte was acquired by Verisign. you can even be African and benefit from our market!
The rest of your list, even including people who made their fortune when Bush Sr. was still in office, shows the decline of the American Dream.

Old version: "From rags to riches"
New Version: "From upper-middle class parents who can pay your way through Ivy League college to riches"
Bezos was born to a single mother....
Looking back to the 50s to 80s there were dozens of stories like this (Iacocca, DeLorean, Soros, to just name three from the top of my head). Now you are so hard-pressed to name one you don't even get the name right. And that's because one person a pattern does not make.
You named a whole three people, that’s not much of a pattern... Also show me where I got the name
wrong...
The fallacy here is that you (and I really) are only talking about famous rich people that we both know, there are way more people who are in the 1% or even .1% we never even heard of.
There are even plenty of blue collar millionaires who started of as “man with a van” but we will never hear of those.
 

Mr. Nice

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The average return for the S&P has been 12%, not 10%. We can argue all day about whether or not someone investing today will end up with the 12% but the math shows that such a return would net you the $1mil I was talking about.
I will agree that 12% puts you in the ballpark, however, the average return on the S&P isn't even as high as the 10% that I stated.

https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/042415/what-average-annual-return-sp-500.asp

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/06/18/the-sp-500-has-already-met-its-average-return-for-a-full-year.html
 

prizrak

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bi said:
1 Out of Every 6 Retirees in America Is a Millionaire

Average wealth for American retirees is $752,000 — which has more than doubled since 1989, the report found. Likewise, the rate of retired millionaires has more than doubled in the last 30 years. Fewer people are retiring in poverty and relying on minimum wage than ever before. The report says "the percentage of retirees living on the minimum wage or less dropped in half over the past 30 years."
http://www.businessinsider.com/how-to-retire-a-millionaire-2018-5
 
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GRtak

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https://www.npr.org/2019/10/08/768200323/trump-administration-blocks-ambassadors-testimony-a-key-witness-in-ukraine-scand

Trump Administration Blocks Ambassador's Testimony, A Key Witness in Ukraine Scandal

The Trump administration has blocked Gordon Sondland, President Trump's ambassador to the European Union, from testifying before Congress Tuesday.


Sondland has been a key figure in the widening Ukraine scandal involving the president, members of his Cabinet and high-ranking diplomats.

"Early this morning, the U.S. Department of State directed Ambassador Gordon Sondland not to appear today for his scheduled transcribed interview before the U.S. House of Representatives Joint Committee," the law firm representing Sondland said in a statement. "Ambassador Sondland had previously agreed to appear voluntarily today, without the need for a subpoena, in order to answer the Committee's questions on an expedited basis. As the sitting U.S. Ambassador to the EU and employee of the State Department, Ambassador Sondland is required to follow the Department's direction."

The statement described Sondland as "profoundly disappointed" and noted that he traveled from Brussels to Washington for the testimony and to prepare.


"Ambassador Sondland believes strongly that he acted at all times in the best interests of the United States, and he stands ready to answer the Committee's questions fully and truthfully," the statement notes. "Ambassador Sondland hopes that the issues raised by the State Department that preclude his testimony will be resolved promptly. He stands ready to testify on short notice, whenever he is permitted to appear."


Shortly after the announcement that Sondland would not testify President Trump himself weighed in. He noted that he would "love" for Sondland to testify, it would be "before a totally compromised kangaroo court."


He also highlighted one of the text messages Sondland sent, part of the package of texts that are at the center of the controversy surrounding the Ukraine scandal.

House Intelligence Committee Chairman Adam Schiff spoke to reporters Tuesday morning and said he considers the blocking of Sondland's testimony and the release of documents Democrats are seeking to be "additional strong evidence of obstruction of the constitutional functions of Congress."


He added, "We will consider this act today ... to be further acts of obstruction of a co-equal branch of government."
 

Blind_Io

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For a guy who claims everything he does is perfect, he sure has a lot to hide.
 

marcos_eirik

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For a guy who claims everything he does is perfect, he sure has a lot to hide.
Yes, blocking a key witness from testifying. The great hallmark of a man who has nothing to hide. Such innocent. Very witchhunt. wow.

Also, betraying allies:
 
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