Toyota Supra 2019

gaasc

Desperately looking for a title
DONOR
Joined
Apr 26, 2008
Messages
8,182
Location
Honduras
Car(s)
3 of them
What you do is buy the real Toyota Supra, better known to you and me as the Lexus RC350
 

prizrak

Forum Addict
Joined
Apr 2, 2007
Messages
20,539
Location
No, sleep, till, BROOKLYN
Car(s)
11 Xterra Pro-4x, 12 'stang GT
That's basically what I was thinking myself, if it's going to cost this much and be a "premium" sports car just call the damn thing a Lexus and get it over with. Another nail in it's coffin is the fact that the "400Z" is going to come with more power in the lowest trim and not likely to cost much more than the current Z. So really what is the market for this?
 

argatoga

Can't Start His Wank
Joined
Oct 4, 2005
Messages
17,984
Location
Seattle
Car(s)
'13 Moto Guzzi V7, '08 Pontiac Solstice GXP
prizrak;n3550303 said:
That's basically what I was thinking myself, if it's going to cost this much and be a "premium" sports car just call the damn thing a Lexus and get it over with. Another nail in it's coffin is the fact that the "400Z" is going to come with more power in the lowest trim and not likely to cost much more than the current Z. So really what is the market for this?
Fast and Furious fans? I'm sure they are already prepping the next film for this. In addition to those fans, those who loved the original back in the day now have the 60k to drop on a more comfortable reincarnation.

As for it being a BMW, I'm not surprised by this. The sports car market (sans iconic muscle/pony cars) is too small to make one alone. This is why we have the BRZ, Spider 124, and now this.
 
Last edited:

prizrak

Forum Addict
Joined
Apr 2, 2007
Messages
20,539
Location
No, sleep, till, BROOKLYN
Car(s)
11 Xterra Pro-4x, 12 'stang GT
That's basically what I was saying, they are banking on the name alone rather than anything specific to the car.

Aside from BRZ Subaru still did the WRX/STi all on their own. Nissan's Z, Honda's NSX, Ze Germans all make sports cars all on their own so a partnership sports car is more of an aberration than the norm. Though all in all that's not my problem, my problem is that it's a Toyota, without Toyota reliability for BMW money. Won't even bring performance into this. I really don't see a compelling reason for the Supra over say an M2 (if we are comparing like for like) aside from being "bro I got a Supra"
 

argatoga

Can't Start His Wank
Joined
Oct 4, 2005
Messages
17,984
Location
Seattle
Car(s)
'13 Moto Guzzi V7, '08 Pontiac Solstice GXP
prizrak;n3550347 said:
That's basically what I was saying, they are banking on the name alone rather than anything specific to the car.

Aside from BRZ Subaru still did the WRX/STi all on their own. Nissan's Z, Honda's NSX, Ze Germans all make sports cars all on their own so a partnership sports car is more of an aberration than the norm. Though all in all that's not my problem, my problem is that it's a Toyota, without Toyota reliability for BMW money. Won't even bring performance into this. I really don't see a compelling reason for the Supra over say an M2 (if we are comparing like for like) aside from being "bro I got a Supra"
The WRX and STi are based off the Impreza platform (which itself is shared by their other cars) so the development costs aren't as great as building a bespoke sports car platform themselves. The Z platform hasn't been updated since the Bush administration, and the NSX is a low production halo car built without a concern for earning its development costs back.

I don't know the specifics, but I am guessing BMW brought in Toyota to offset the costs for their next sports car. Toyota saw a relatively cheap way to profit from the mid life crisis "bro I got a Supra" crowd, and here we are.

Personally, the more sports cars the better. The SUV/CUV invasion has pushed too many of them out.
 
Last edited:

prizrak

Forum Addict
Joined
Apr 2, 2007
Messages
20,539
Location
No, sleep, till, BROOKLYN
Car(s)
11 Xterra Pro-4x, 12 'stang GT
Z platform is nothing but the FM platform that has been used and used and used, they are still making it's Infiniti bro with some updates because luxury is what everyone wants now. And yet we are still getting a new Z, with a Nismo model being basically a baby GT-R. There was no need for Toyota to make anything bespoke, they have RWD Lexi so they could have easily leveraged it, throw some different body panels on an RC350, give it a manual and put a Supra badge on it. Price it at around 40K (same as old supra in the 90s btw) and there you go.

EDIT: I think having more *affordable* sports car is better, having a bunch of expensive ones that can only be bought as toys is really not going to help with CUV/SUV invasion.
 
Last edited:

gaasc

Desperately looking for a title
DONOR
Joined
Apr 26, 2008
Messages
8,182
Location
Honduras
Car(s)
3 of them
Nevermind the CUV/SUV invasion. Leveraging existing platforms means (as Nissan is proving) that you can have a whole range of good sedans/CUV's which drive well and can still be luxurious and comfortable. Why Ford hasn't reached this conclusion to make some cheap sedans/CUV's from the mustang is beyond me.
 

Blind_Io

"Be The Match" Registered
DONOR
Joined
Apr 5, 2006
Messages
21,685
Location
Utah, USA
Car(s)
06 Nissan XTerra Off Road, 00 VFR800, 07 ST1300
Well, with Ford killing off sedans entirely, it's kind of a moot point.
 

prizrak

Forum Addict
Joined
Apr 2, 2007
Messages
20,539
Location
No, sleep, till, BROOKLYN
Car(s)
11 Xterra Pro-4x, 12 'stang GT
We actually had this conversation on the forums and in my case in person with some people. Specifically why would they not use Mustang platform for Lincoln. I guess with killing off sedans completely it makes more sense now.
 

CraigB

Ich bin ein Kartoffel
DONOR
Joined
Feb 14, 2007
Messages
12,668
Location
SWMO
Car(s)
Mustang SVO - Nissan Frontier Pro-4X & Altima
Remind me again, this is just a BMW engine, right? Not quite like the BRZ/GT86/XQY engine where it was Subaru's engine, but Toyota provided the direct fuel injection.
 

Redliner

Will bore you to death with butterfly facts
DONOR
Joined
May 19, 2005
Messages
22,504
Location
Hookers, deadly mosquitoes, pimps and drug dealers
Car(s)
2013 Palio Sporting
Remind me again, this is just a BMW engine, right? Not quite like the BRZ/GT86/XQY engine where it was Subaru's engine, but Toyota provided the direct fuel injection.
The official story is that Toyota tore down the engine (much like in the video) and also measured and tested components and tolerances to see if they were up to their standards before accepting to use the BMW engine.
Also, as far as I know, the tune is different then the one BMW uses, but then again, that is the official story, so take it with a grain of salt.
 

prizrak

Forum Addict
Joined
Apr 2, 2007
Messages
20,539
Location
No, sleep, till, BROOKLYN
Car(s)
11 Xterra Pro-4x, 12 'stang GT
Me too.
I think it looks better and can be had with a manual.
No idea about driving dynamics, though.
I have a hard time imagining that the M2 is in any way dynamically worse than a Supra. Also even if we only compare auto to auto the DCT in the M2 would make for a much sportier experience as compared to a slushbox from the Z4.
 

Mitchi

Sierras für alle!
DONOR
Joined
Dec 10, 2012
Messages
5,363
Location
Lüneburg
Apparently, M2 Competition seems to be quite some steps over a Supra. Even normal M2 might be.

As much as I actually rather like the new Supra, for me it appears to be "just" an M240i with a body kit ...
 

Spectre

The Deported
Joined
Feb 1, 2007
Messages
36,690
Location
Dallas, Texas
Car(s)
00 4Runner | 02 919 | 87 XJ6 | 86 CB700SC
There are probably some Yamaha engineers (Yamaha is who Toyota has been outsourcing some engine design out to for a long time now) headdesking at this moment over the engine choice there...

Someone call me when the new alleged "Supra" can do this.

Historical review:
 

Redliner

Will bore you to death with butterfly facts
DONOR
Joined
May 19, 2005
Messages
22,504
Location
Hookers, deadly mosquitoes, pimps and drug dealers
Car(s)
2013 Palio Sporting
There are probably some Yamaha engineers (Yamaha is who Toyota has been outsourcing some engine design out to for a long time now) headdesking at this moment over the engine choice there...

Someone call me when the new alleged "Supra" can do this.

Historical review:
I don't doubt they will be making 1500hp soon, but that means so little.
Yeah, great, you can make a lot of power. That is ONE part of the equation.
 

Spectre

The Deported
Joined
Feb 1, 2007
Messages
36,690
Location
Dallas, Texas
Car(s)
00 4Runner | 02 919 | 87 XJ6 | 86 CB700SC
I don't doubt they will be making 1500hp soon, but that means so little.
Yeah, great, you can make a lot of power. That is ONE part of the equation.
Yes, but look at the 1000hp Supra in the second vid. Even the presenter has to agree that it's perfectly tractable, could be a commuter just fine, etc. Supras with stupendous horsepower that have the rest of the equation balanced are by no means unusual - most of them aren't used as pure drag cars but highway roll-on queens and are more often than not actually used on the street.

I have severe doubts that the M2 based Supra is going to be anywhere near equal to the MkIV in this respect.
 
Top