You own a business, what would you do?

You own a business, what would you do?

  • Let the law judge accordingly.

    Votes: 25 34.7%

  • Make him pay off his crimes with menial labor.

    Votes: 47 65.3%
  • Total voters
    72
Shawn said:
Will a teenager with no previous records really get any significant jail time that they'll actually end up serving for this crime?

Thing is, this is no petty crime. It's $4,500s worth and Jay even said the kid had repeatedly inquired about how much the nice wheels and rims cost. Plus, it's not like he saw four tires to the side and grabbed them in a spur of the moment thing... he brought tools and a friend along and took tires off a car and left it on cinder blocks.

This is some pretty serious shit if you ask me. Hmm, so maybe he would end up in jail. But I still don't think he'd actually spend any time in jail, just get scared real good going to court and whatnot.
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To answer your first question, it's quite unlikely if this kid is as good as jay says. I was in the exact same scenario at the same age, ended up being charged with theft under $5000 went to court and all that. I had a nice judge who thankfully decided not to make an example out of me. In the end I had to pay for the stolen goods (oddly enough I didn't have to return them though) and do 50 hours of community service.

Replying to your third paragraph, I once missed a court date and had to spend from about 8am to 8 pm in lockup, it was terrible, some of the people you meet in there are pretty messed up. Oh ya I got scared real real real real good.

Edit : should I add i voted do the dealership work and not go to court, he made a mistake and i guarantee its the last time he will do anything like this.
 
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The the owner did the right thing. Everybody wins this way: the kid learns his lesson, the shop owner gets back what belonged to him and some extra compensation for his time and trouble, nobody's tax dollars are wasted on some jailperv playing bumdarts with the kid.

That said, the owner needs make this kid work long, hard hours.

I've long been rather confused and frustrated by the penal system. Guy commits crime, guy goes to jail where room and board are paid for by my tax dollars? How does that make sense? I'm not saying that jail is tea and crumpets, I'm sure it's terrible, but it could be handled a lot better fiscally.

The punishment needs to fit the crime and compensate the victims. Eg.: you steal and total my car? You work hard labour and a chunk of every paycheque is deducted to pay for my new car until it's completely paid off. Things like that.
 
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He should go to jail. You can't break the law and expect to get off easy.
 
VR6 said:
To answer your first question, it's quite unlikely if this kid is as good as jay says. I was in the exact same scenario at the same age, ended up being charged with theft under $5000 went to court and all that. I had a nice judge who thankfully decided not to make an example out of me. In the end I had to pay for the stolen goods (oddly enough I didn't have to return them though) and do 50 hours of community service.

Replying to your third paragraph, I once missed a court date and had to spend from about 8am to 8 pm in lockup, it was terrible, some of the people you meet in there are pretty messed up. Oh ya I got scared real real real real good.

Edit : should I add i voted do the dealership work and not go to court, he made a mistake and i guarantee its the last time he will do anything like this.
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I assume going to court and/or jail probably straightened you out. This guy is getting off free, and it doesn't sound like there will be a record of his crime. So if he does it again, that would be considered his first offense and he may get off again. So if he doesn't face a judge or jail, why would he change?
 
VR6 said:
he made a mistake and i guarantee its the last time he will do anything like this.
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Yeah because prison is full of 1 time offenders :lol:

Steal the equivalent of a small used car and your punishment is you have to do a job a lot of Americans would kill for right now. Sounds like the stereotypical spoiled kid from the suburbs turned thief, my high school had about 5 of them and none of them "learned their lesson" last I heard they got busted for stealing engines so they could have 2 fast 2 furious street racing civics.
 
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Seasonone said:
Yeah because prison is full of 1 time offenders :lol:

Steal the equivalent of a small used car and your punishment is you have to do a job a lot of Americans would kill for right now. Sounds like the stereotypical spoiled kid from the suburbs turned thief, my high school had about 5 of them and none of them "learned their lesson" last I heard they got busted for stealing engines so they could have 2 fast 2 furious street racing civics.
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This kid from what I have read is a nice kid and made this one mistake. Prison isn't full of kids that have a mom that would actually call the police about new things appearing in the garage. Kid has a good family and they'll straighten him out more than any prison would, trust me I know. This kid sounds like a good kid who just lost his judgment for a second. And i'm sure if he ever does anything like this again his past will be brought up by someone.

Firecat said:
I assume going to court and/or jail probably straightened you out. This guy is getting off free, and it doesn't sound like there will be a record of his crime. So if he does it again, that would be considered his first offense and he may get off again. So if he doesn't face a judge or jail, why would he change?
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Indeed it did. He's not getting off easy, he had to work off 4500 dollars worth of goods, thats a massive punishment and he'll realize its not worth even attempting again. Like i said above I guarantee his parents are ripping him a new one, he'll learn.
 
How can you guarantee anything when we know as little about the situation as we do? :blink:

You don't know whats going on inside this guy's head... nobody does but himself, but you can't guarantee he'll never break the law again based on what we know and never having met him.
 
Well I'd make him pay off his crime, if you could be reasonably certain that he wouldn't nick anything else. If you rang the cops round here the kid would probably go to court get just a fine, which would, if not paid be substituted with community service. (which usually only gets half done) Better to have the work done for you I suppose.
 
If it were a misdemeanor, fine. A felony, though? That's a tough choice.

If it was a case of "I really wanted these rims, but they were too expensive, so I hatched the brilliant idea to steal them"... that's just stupidity, and stupidity can be fixed in less harsh ways than having a felony on your record at 18. Hard labor... and I mean like all machines and surfaces must be spotless, you don't get to do anything even remotely cool, you work for minimum wage, and maybe making him wear a shirt that says "I STOLE SOME RIMS AND NOW I'M PAYING FOR THEM" or something humiliating of that nature while he works... and making him realize that the alternative is much worse, sounds sufficient to me in this situation.

However, if your opinion says it was a case of "I was finding out how much the rims were so I could steal them and sell them", that's malice, and he needs to be put in prison as hard as possible.
 
Based on jay's description of events and the kid in question, I agree with the actions of the dealership owner. The kid made a mistake - a stupid, big one, but chances are he's going to learn more from working off his act than he would be spending time in jail.
 
Agreed dogbert, I didn't really think about him asking the cost of the rims, that is malicious behaviour. Problem is he probably still wouldn't end up in prison.
 
ediesbra said:
Agreed dogbert, I didn't really think about him asking the cost of the rims, that is malicious behaviour. Problem is he probably still wouldn't end up in prison.
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That's precisely why I'd personally probably call the police on him. The law usually accommodates first time criminals by letting them off easy.

I don't think making him work at your business or mow your lawn for a month will teach him anything. He'll just try and steal again... either he'll succeed the second time around, or he'll have to work it off again. There's nothing scary about forced labour, just unpleasantness. In my experience you don't really ever learn anything unless you really suffer because of your actions.
 
I still don't see how stealing these rims was a "mistake"...This was not a petty crime. He saw something he wanted and he took it. To me, a mistake implies a misunderstanding or accident and this was neither.
 
I would have pressed charges.

I can understand this working for a kid that steals a candy bar or something trivial like that. Even if he had just stolen wheels that were lying around in the open, I could understand.

But this kid came in the middle of the night and jacked up a car and took the wheels off. He's a spoiled brat that thinks he can do whatever he wants. He already has a 350z, want some wheels, lets take them from the dealership, they won't miss them.

Now that you let him get off with a slap on the wrist, he'll think he can pull this kind of shit again and keep getting away with it.

I would have pressed charges and had the judicial system deal with him. He probably wouldn't get a felony charge anyway and he might get scared shitless spending a night in jail. That sort of thing might actually turn him around. Picking up some trash just reinforces his mindset that he can do whatever he wants and get away with it.
 
VR6 said:
This kid from what I have read is a nice kid and made this one mistake. Prison isn't full of kids that have a mom that would actually call the police about new things appearing in the garage. Kid has a good family and they'll straighten him out more than any prison would, trust me I know. This kid sounds like a good kid who just lost his judgment for a second. And i'm sure if he ever does anything like this again his past will be brought up by someone
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Between my high school and the high school down the road I can think of 10 kids who were considered "nice" that at some point have been involved in some sorta of theft with cars. The only way they "learned their lesson" was when they either went to jail for a long period of time or grew out of their 2 fast 2 furious street racing phase.

I don't see how you can even attempt to call it a "loss of judgment for a second" he came in asking how much the wheels were, realized he couldn't afford them, got a jack and a plan, came back and took the wheels. he didn't walk by and happen to notice an intake sitting their, he made a plan to take them.

And who is going to bring his past up if he does it again? Nobody will because it didn't go to the court system. As far as the state is considered the kid never did anything wrong.
 
I'm not voting, because i wasn't a witness to the events as they unfolded, which i think should dictate the actions taken in response. I think the dealership owner's actions were more than lenient, however I don't think jail time/ involving police would exactly turn someone straight. It could however, breed spite. I personally may have taken a multi-pronged approach to this "issue". The mother calling up the dealer and talking shows concern and caring, so I dont necessarily believe in a heartless punishment.

I would probably talk to the parents, and work with them on setting up a 1year labor contract. Put the boy on the payroll at state minimum for every hour he works while the dealership is open. However, he would have to come in EVERYDAY with exception to school, appointments, and family outings. He would clean every inch of the lot, wash, wax, and vacum every interior to a state of cleanliness not unlike preparing for a carshow. if there's snow in the lot he's getting up before school to shovel it....BY HAND. his car would become "the tester" for new customers (get dealer insurance on it so it's not leaving liability on him, but having strangers driving his car all the time should be a real kick in the pants) Once he has worked double of the value of the rims off, he has the option of getting the pair he stole/exact replacement to keep, or can choose any pair with similar pricing. Missed work days will incur a call to his parents. is he sick? or is he skipping? trying to ditch work will result in a call to the cops and his actions reported. at the end of the year, his parents will get a check for his pay minus the cost of the rims/tires and maintenance on his "tester" for them to invest in his continued education.

Just giving him a job to pay off the rims i feel won't teach the value of earning it, and frankly, turning himself into the cops may be the "easy" way out, but it should teach the value of the trust he's lost with people.
 
How do you build a better criminal? Put him into the justice system.

One mistake, he'd be working in the shop for a while (I would also be reviewing where stuff was being left coz if he managed to steal it, someone else would too). And if he was half decent and I had the $ a part time job offered so he could save up and buy them. If I didn't have the $, I could at least offer a reference to another employer. Reinforce with kid that no recorded criminal charges improves his opportunities of getting a job.

If he was absolutely crap, find him some mentoring in either the example workplace or elsewhere to give him the opportunity to improve.
 
epp_b said:
Minimum wage? Ha! He should be working for free.
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Oh no no no, he won't be getting any of that money, but the value of his work will be minimum wage (regardless of whatever he's doing).
 
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