What is the big deal with Alfas on TG?

[Ironlord]

Originally Posted by teeb

They didn't say "You should own an Alfa and it should be your only car brand, ever". They said that you can't be a true petrolhead until you own an Alfa.

I wonder where I fall in their "petrolhead" category? I had a 1988 Lancia Y10 and when its brakes finally failed catastrophically... I bought another one. A 1990 GTie, second time round. And the engine blew up on that.

Eagle-eyed car anoraks will soon leap to the point that the Y10 was an Autobianchi in its native Italy, but it's still Italian and I know damn well what the Italian ownership experience is like!

In fact, there's been quite a few Italian cars in the family:
My dad had two fiats (1971 128, 1978 131); my mum also had two Fiats (both Unos, 1989 & 1993, both base models...!), I had the two Y10s mentioned above, my brother had a 1992 Uno, and my cousin has a 1999 Fiat Bravo that he commutes 80-odd miles a day in.

But nobody beats my uncle for Italian car ownership. He's had an Alfa Giulietta (1984), three Lancias (late 70s Beta, 1994 Integrale, 1993 Thema) and... a clapped-out Fiat Tempra estate when his Audi was nicked. That's him that's a qualified petrolhead at least. And I was once considering an Alfa of some sorts... though given that it was a 145 it might not have been the wisest choice...

[Ironlord]

Originally Posted by Ottobon

All I'll say is that even if Alfas were reliable they would still be legends, it has nothing to do with how crap their build can be and that emotional rollercoaster that comes with it.

There was, of course, one Alfa that could, and should, have been brilliant to look at, brilliant to drive and been brilliantly reliable. For they decided to team up with the Japanese. It was the perfect marriage; Italian style with Japanese build quality. Surely nothing could go wrong...



Oh, cock!

[Hercules286]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-pu...ationalization

Also, parroting.

[tone76]

Italian cars are like Italian women: absolutely stunning, incredibly passionate and some feature the most alluring curves known to Man. But they sometimes don't age terribly well, and when they break down or get angry your life will be a total misery. That said, when everything is all patched up - usually at great expense, you'll go back to having some of the wildest times of your life ... for a while ... then the cycle will start all over again ...

I've always had a thing for Italians ...

[BlaRo]

Originally Posted by katwalk

D:
Lets go over the meaning of "quirky"
I think it's more of "the car is alive and playing tricks on me" sort of things, ie: the radio constantly spiting out the ipod adapter but takes it after 3 tries, turning the radio off and on randomly, having the right break light go out only some of the time, even after getting it looked at and fixed. Looking for something you put in the car and not finding it, but looking in the same place later and it's there.
That is a sense of humor in the car, falling apart and killing you is not.

also german cars having no personalities is bullcrap because all of those examples are from my little VW
She's such a prankster

I think that's more because your VW Beetle was built in Mexico by people who aren't bothered with "soul" and "passion" than anything else.

[MadCat360]

Originally Posted by Nereid

At times, it also their flaws which give them some of their character. You see, a car like a BMW or Mercedes alienates you from the car itself with perfect build quality and practicality. Alfas, with their little flaws and niggles, feel human. Every human being has their flaws, and so do Alfas. Of course, there is more to than that, there's just something about Alfas which make them feel less clinical than their German counterparts.

A winner. This one's not just repeating lines from the show. This one understands.

I find the best and simplest way of explaining is that you want to be able to put your thumb on what exactly a car would do at any given situation. If you can say "my car would do y, given x" then it has character.

For instance, my ideal car would feel like, at any moment, it would pull your shirt over your head and goose your navel. I'd gladly give up some fancy electronic stability control or somesuch nonsense for that feeling of character which makes driving fun.

But just because German cars (in general) are more clinical, doesn't mean they don't have character. I've maintained for many years that the Germans actually have a very good sense of humor and that they've been playing a huge joke on us all along. I mean, who builds the most perfect, clean and precise car in the world and then bolts a 900 lb-ft of torque motor on it? That's like showing up to a political summit with an immaculate suit but with shoes 24 sizes too big.

[NooDle]

Alfas are still something special.
It's like you know beforehand that they will go wrong, yet you buy them anyway.

Because all of the time you spend waiting for it to get fixed is all forgotten for that one time where you have an open road,on a sunny day, and the chance to see why the car is that good.

A colleaugue of mine has a 159 which he loves to death. The ride is great, ample power for a dieselslushbox repmobile, handling is nice, and they even managed to make it sound sporty.

However, the front spoiler is way too low, you clip it on almost every bump, unless you drive 1kph. The turbo blew itself up after 5000 kms. The float thingy in the fuel tank decided to die, so you think the car is always half full of fuel, until you run out on the motorway and lose power brakes, power steering, etc. The passenger side mirror cap thingy spontaneously fell off (and took 6 weeks to get fixed because they kept ordering the wrong color or the wrong type of mirror). And now, lastly, the brakes stopped working all of a sudden.

Yet you put up with these things because of the way it looks, inside and out. I was with him on a customer visit when we parked next to a super nice BMW 535d with ALL the toys, and the driver got out, walked around our Alfa, and said to us : Thats a DAMN nice car you have there. He even wanted to sit inside to see the interior. (this coming from a man that spent 50k€+ on a "boring BMW" when he could have had an Alfa with a similar specced version for 30k€)

It's moments like that that make you feel happy you have an Alfa. Realising that it's a company car, and you don't have to pay everytime it goes wrong, that helps too.

[alfaholic]

For the money, Alfas are easily the best looking cars on the road IMO. Couple that with a fantastic engine note and reasonable performance against other marques is enough for me. The reliability issues don't really apply anymore but the perception in the market is still there so I got a great deal second hand

I really don't understand the comment about the interiors being crap, they look just as good inside with no nasty cheap plastic.

All that said I think the TG stance of Alfas being for 'true petrolheads' is more applicable to the 80's and 90's cars - RWD, probably more fun but also breaking down a lot.

[littletones]

I'm probably the only person on earth that thinks this, but I don't think alfa's are all that pretty. Actually, I find most of them to be ugly. (yes, even the 8c)

[racingfan1]

Originally Posted by littletones

I'm probably the only person on earth that thinks this, but I don't think alfa's are all that pretty. Actually, I find most of them to be ugly. (yes, even the 8c)

Please tell me I didn't see that.

[BlaRo]

Originally Posted by NooDle

Alfas are still something special.
It's like you know beforehand that they will go wrong, yet you buy them anyway.

Because all of the time you spend waiting for it to get fixed is all forgotten for that one time where you have an open road,on a sunny day, and the chance to see why the car is that good.

Yet you put up with these things because of the way it looks, inside and out. I was with him on a customer visit when we parked next to a super nice BMW 535d with ALL the toys, and the driver got out, walked around our Alfa, and said to us : Thats a DAMN nice car you have there. He even wanted to sit inside to see the interior. (this coming from a man that spent 50k€+ on a "boring BMW" when he could have had an Alfa with a similar specced version for 30k€)

It's moments like that that make you feel happy you have an Alfa. Realising that it's a company car, and you don't have to pay everytime it goes wrong, that helps too.

There's a difference between savoring that special weekend drive and putting up with the mechanical maladies needed to enjoy it...and deluding yourself into thinking that putting up with exploding turbos and crap like that somehow adds "character" to an unreliable car that you need to fix for that special weekend drive.

[littletones]

Originally Posted by racingfan1

Please tell me I didn't see that.

Oh but you did. The 8C does look good at any angle where I can't see the front. For some reason their trademark grill reminds me of a sad teething baby.

I do like the look of the 159 and brera, but I think its because of the pretty headlights.

[NooDle]

Originally Posted by BlaRo

There's a difference between savoring that special weekend drive and putting up with the mechanical maladies needed to enjoy it...and deluding yourself into thinking that putting up with exploding turbos and crap like that somehow adds "character" to an unreliable car that you need to fix for that special weekend drive.

Well it IS a company car so it gets driven hard on a daily basis. it's not like it's some special car saved for special occasions.

The added bonus of that is that you don't have to pay everytime it breaks down.

BTW I have a new episode of Alfa unreliability : we went to the carwash yesterday and it washed it so thouroughly that the side indicator repeaters came off and scratched the side of the car! Also, some water came through the sunroof and on my head.

Yay for Alfas

[NooDle]

Originally Posted by littletones

Oh but you did. The 8C does look good at any angle where I can't see the front. For some reason their trademark grill reminds me of a sad teething baby.

Strangely my wife seems to agree with you. She says the 8C is ugly.
I'm considering a divorce now

[Vector]

Thank you for all that took my question seriously and actually gave me insightful replies to try and help me understand.

To the rest, well, sod off .

And an addendum: Jeremy's latest review of the 8C exemplifies all my frustrations with their Alfa pandering. As he was going over the flaws, I kept thinking here comes the "but! It has an Alfa badge on the front and therefore the car is epic."

Maybe I'm just getting too old for Jeremy's hyperbole and controversial style, but I really find it hard to take anything the man says seriously anymore. Everything he says and likes is contrary, and I think he does it on purpose.

[BlaRo]

Originally Posted by NooDle

The added bonus of that is that you don't have to pay everytime it breaks down.

Well that's good. By all means, take advantage of your company's stupidity in using Alfas as company cars and having to pay for them when they break down. Do they even make a profit anymore?

[argatoga]

Originally Posted by Vector

Thank you for all that took my question seriously and actually gave me insightful replies to try and help me understand.

To the rest, well, sod off .

And an addendum: Jeremy's latest review of the 8C exemplifies all my frustrations with their Alfa pandering. As he was going over the flaws, I kept thinking here comes the "but! It has an Alfa badge on the front and therefore the car is epic."

Maybe I'm just getting too old for Jeremy's hyperbole and controversial style, but I really find it hard to take anything the man says seriously anymore. Everything he says and likes is contrary, and I think he does it on purpose.

I usually don't put a lot of credit on his reviews especially concerning Astons, but in his defense he did say it was horrible car to drive.

[klankymen]

Originally Posted by NooDle

Strangely my wife seems to agree with you. She says the 8C is ugly.
I'm considering a divorce now

HAHAHAHA that made me laugh!

But I must say, the grill doesn't quiiiite to it for me. But still, even with that flaw, I'm hard-pressed to find a car more beautiful.

Originally Posted by argatoga

I usually don't put a lot of credit on his reviews especially concerning Astons, but in his defense he did say it was horrible car to drive.

And yet I still want one

[AiR]

If you ask Google images for "brera" this comes up as #2 hit (alfa-romeo-brera.jpg)



Even the computers at google have it figured out.

[StirlingMoss]

I really don't understand why Alfas depreciate so much. Clarkson said once that 159 depreciates more than 40% in the first year. In Brazil a 1994 Alfa 164 3.0 V6 costs half the price of a 1990 BMW 3 series.