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    Volvos too Swedish?

    Don't like the sound of this......

    http://www.independent.co.uk/life-st...r-8585127.html

    Li Shufu critical of Volvo design
    http://www.goteborgdaily.se/li-shufu...f-volvo-design

    Geely grapples with the Volvo gears
    http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/bdb705c6-a...44feabdc0.html
    Team Black Jack

    __________________________

    So, that's all good.

    #2
    Not a fan of Volvos, but this news worries me.
    Originally posted by tigger
    The Lord spoke, "Let there be angry V8s, whistling turbos and big ass cams." And it was good.

    Comment


      #3
      The chinese owner have forgottent one thing... Volvo have a Scandinavian look because... it is a Scandinavian company. People buy Volvo because of that.
      "Hummers were designed by americans who have the esthetic ability of a giraffe." - Jeremy Clarkson

      Comment


        #4
        Oh no, not again.
        Click image for larger version

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        "Power corrupts. Lack of power corrupts absolutely."
        -Redliner, ironically



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          #5
          So predictable. More and more design and management will now be relocating to China in the very near future. And pretty soon, Volvo will end up just being a badge job.
          Last edited by Spectre; April 24th, 2013, 4:52 AM.

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            #6


            i'm just saying.

            <Ice> Oh, you're the kiddy anime guy.
            "The problems of the world cannot possibly be solved by skeptics or cynics whose horizons are limited by the obvious realities. We need men who can dream of things that never were."
            John F. Kennedy

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              #7
              I don't imply that this chinese dude has any clue what he's talking about, but...

              Originally posted by sicnarf_1978 View Post
              People buy Volvo because of that.
              Do they? And if yes, are those few people enough? Seeing that in 2012 for example Volvo sold less cars than BMW just SUVs on the global market, I am not sure those numbers justify it. If Volvo is fine with being what is effectively a nieche-brand, ok. If its profitable, even better. But if thats a no to both, they might consider actually listening to the chinese dude.

              Comment


                #8
                Aside from Li Shufu saying that years ago (old news) he also suggested putting Volvo badges on mopeds in a meeting with AB Volvo. The people at Volvo Group was not impressed. As long as Shufu keeps to the owner role and leaves management to competent people all will be well.

                Reflection on being "too swedish":
                Unswedish (osvensk) is a positive word in Sweden, but only applicable in the trivial areas of life. We love Zlatan Ibrahimovic for being so unswedish, typically unswedish parties are great (over the top grandeur, maybe some samba etc). But if you apply unswedish to the rational parts of life then it's always a negative word. "Typically unswedish food hygiene" is not a good thing. Unswedish healthcare or tax morale or rule of law is always negative.

                Danish has same roots and thus the same word, odansk (undanish), but unlike in Sweden it is always a negative word. If you're odansk, you're basically the biggest tosser on the planet. Same as telling an american he's unamerican, he'll wave a flag in your face and turn into U-S-A, U-S-A in an instant.

                Sweden is a socially engineered country where politicians and society planners have acted based on rationality and measurable studies, so we know that we are the best in the world when it comes to all things rational. Swedish authorities have pushed things at the people, and the people have accepted since they know it is based on rational thought and for our best. At the same time we're embarrassed by our lack of spontaneity and generally stiff behavior. That's why unswedish can be both positive and negative at the same time.
                Last edited by AiR; April 24th, 2013, 8:51 AM.

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                  #9
                  Originally posted by Spectre View Post
                  So predictable. More and more design and management will now be relocating to China in the very near future. And pretty soon, Volvo will end up just being a badge job.
                  Bullshit.

                  and

                  and

                  So, this is exclusively about interior design, and he has a point. Volvo can't compete with the Germans regarding luxury interiors at the moment and they obviously want to succeed in the growing chinese market. All comments make sense and they don't mean that they will build cheap chinese Volvos and SUVs.

                  Comment


                    #10


                    "Men with guts attack those corners!" - Keiichi Tsuchiya
                    2006 Acura TL and 1999 Mazda Miata

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                      #11
                      Originally posted by AiR View Post
                      Danish has same roots and thus the same word, odansk (undanish), but unlike in Sweden it is always a negative word. If you're odansk, you're basically the biggest tosser on the planet. Same as telling an american he's unamerican, he'll wave a flag in your face and turn into U-S-A, U-S-A in an instant.
                      I'm sorry but


                      (it's called udansk btw, and is hardly ever used in daily talking...)

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by sicnarf_1978 View Post
                        The chinese owner have forgottent one thing... Volvo have a Scandinavian look because... it is a Scandinavian company. People buy Volvo because of that.
                        Scandinavian

                        beautiful language - milk&water - baseball vs. football - best god in show

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                          #13
                          Originally posted by Spectre View Post
                          So predictable. More and more design and management will now be relocating to China in the very near future. And pretty soon, Volvo will end up just being a badge job.
                          Typical negative nancy specter. You can build cars for the Chinese market without screwing them up for the rest of the world. The Chinese idea of Luxury and the Swedish idea of luxury are obviously different. Just like the German and American versions of Luxury are different. Better modular manufacturing techniques will make it easier to make those kind of changes. Volvo is also going to expand production in China which will make Volvos just for China.

                          In fact that is pretty much what the full quote says.

                          You can make interior changes just for the Chinese market to make them happy. You can make suspension and wheel changes to make them happy. Those are easy fixes across build lines for different markets and is something manufacturers already do to some extent.

                          Watch this Video.

                          http://www.economist.com/blogs/schum...y-car-industry

                          I can't imagine that a Black on red interior choice is terribly popular in most markets outside of China. That being said there is new Cranberry leather interior on the C70 that looks pretty good with the Ember Black exterior paint.

                          Volvo already makes long wheel base S80s just for the Chinese market just like Audi makes long wheel base A6s and BMW does the same with the 3 and 5 series. You have a surplus of cheap labor in China. Not as cheap as it was a few years ago but still relatively cheap. A mid-level executive can afford to pay someone to drive them around. They can't afford the traditional chauffeur driven 7-series/S-Class/A8 though. Those cars are much more expensive in China because of currency exchange and because those top end models are typically imported and not built in China. This is changing slowly as more top end vehicles are made in China and as the Renminbi has been allowed to appreciate slightly in recent years. What is mid-level Chinese executive to do? He can't be driven around in a regular 3 series not enough room back there.

                          Ahh but the market has an answer. Special LWB versions of those less expensive vehicles that are already being built in China. I expect Volvo to continue this trend with more LWB versions of regular vehicles. Maybe a LWB XC60 would work well?

                          I also fully expect Volvo to come out with a larger sedan above the S80 as frankly the S80 is a little small in its current size. A larger sedan would please the Chinese market and allow the regular S80 to grow some. I think both of those cars could work in the US and Australian markets too as they both appreciate larger vehicles.

                          Originally posted by thomas View Post
                          I don't imply that this chinese dude has any clue what he's talking about, but...


                          Do they? And if yes, are those few people enough? Seeing that in 2012 for example Volvo sold less cars than BMW just SUVs on the global market, I am not sure those numbers justify it. If Volvo is fine with being what is effectively a nieche-brand, ok. If its profitable, even better. But if thats a no to both, they might consider actually listening to the chinese dude.
                          Some people coming in to buy Volvos don't even know they are a Swedish company. Some people think that Ford moved all production to America when they bought the company. Some people think they are German. In order for Volvo to sell more cars in the US they need to have more aggressive financing and lease options and in order to do that they need to leverage more volume. The higher volume will let them spread the cost of those lease incentives around.

                          Hmh its a circle crap.

                          Enter China. Huge immature market for luxury cars as long as they are targeted the right way. Much higher profit margins in China then the US or Europe too. All that volume can help drive down costs to expand sales in the US.

                          Originally posted by Interrobang View Post
                          Scandinavian
                          You have it exactly right. Sometimes people who have no idea that Volvo is Swedish come and look at them because they prefer the more simple minimalist design at least in the interiors. I have gotten generally positive feedback on the sexier bit more complex current S60 and XC60 exterior design. The thing is that simple Scandinavian design is, at least as I understand it, not necessarily the ideal luxury interior in China. You can make changes to the interior to appeal to different Chinese tastes without making those same changes to cars sold in other markets. At least to an extent.
                          Blog now updated with more facts and graphs. Snarkiness included for no additional charge.
                          The Volvo V60 is coming to the US of A


                          Second book is out "The Knight's Ill Thought Bargain" at amazon for Kinde or paperback.

                          and at Barnes and Noble for Nook.

                          Don't know what it is? Go watch the trailer.

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                            #14
                            Ummm...are they insane?

                            I've read multiple reviews of new Volvos. People may criticize their chassis, or steering, or transmission...but I don't recall reading negative reviews about the interior design. (some were unhappy with the C30 dash looking a little old...well, it looked good back in 2006-2007).
                            "It's the difference between watching great sex and having good sex." - Labcoatguy on the difference between an automatic and a manual gearbox.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by _HighVoltage_ View Post
                              Ummm...are they insane?
                              I love how knee-jerk everyone's reactions have been (aside from British_Rover), despite not having read what he actually said.

                              Originally posted by _HighVoltage_ View Post
                              I've read multiple reviews of new Volvos.

                              People may criticize their chassis, or steering, or transmission...but I don't recall reading negative reviews about the interior design. (some were unhappy with the C30 dash looking a little old...well, it looked good back in 2006-2007).
                              How many of those reviews were in Chinese? He was specifically and explicitly talking about just the Chinese market.
                              "It's not long enough to use in bed." -rickhamilton620

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                                #16
                                The main thing with China, they seem to care more about rear legroom and gadgets. Neither of these are really Volvo strong points. Volvo isn't following the path of say Audi, who are now making specific models with rear legroom for China.
                                2006 Volkswagen Passat 3.6 VR6. Das Auto

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                                  #17
                                  I think they did have a long wheelbase S80 at one point.

                                  chaos386, so are you saying that they will design whole new interiors for the Chinese market, while the rest of the world will still get the regular "Swedish" interior? I somehow doubt that.
                                  "It's the difference between watching great sex and having good sex." - Labcoatguy on the difference between an automatic and a manual gearbox.

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by Vette Boss View Post
                                    The main thing with China, they seem to care more about rear legroom and gadgets. Neither of these are really Volvo strong points. Volvo isn't following the path of say Audi, who are now making specific models with rear legroom for China.
                                    Everyone is making long wheel base models of standard sized cars in China.

                                    Well all the Euro brands anyway. The big Buicks are already cheap enough and with enough rear legroom to not need a special model.

                                    http://www.motorauthority.com/news/1...-line-in-china

                                    The reason for this is because labor is so cheap in the Chinese market. You can pay someone five dollars a day to drive you around but you can't buy a S-Class or 7 series for less then 100,000 USD. Those models are not built in China so tariffs and the currency exchange kills you. The least expensive S-Class in China is over 150,000 USD and the most expensive is almost 500,000 USD.

                                    http://www.mercedes-benz.com.cn/cont...ue_prices.html

                                    Some middle management Chinese Executive or bureaucrat cannot afford that upfront cost but they can afford say 50,000 to 80,000 USD for a long wheelbase S80, A4, 3 series or 5 series. The S80L starts around 60,000 in China and finishes around 107,000 USD.

                                    http://www.volvocars.com/zh-cn/sales...figurator.aspx

                                    You know what I learned that is interesting by looking that up? You know doing research and not just having a knee jerk reaction. Volvo's Chinese website is completely in Chinese Characters. It is set up just like the US website so I could navigate it by memory but there is no western characters at all except for the word Volvo and model names. The Mercedes website is pretty much entirely in English. Now maybe there is a Chinese character site that I can't get to from the US or someway to turn it on but I couldn't figure it out. There are Chinese characters at the bottom of the page but they do not turn on the Chinese site at least not in Firefox, Chrome or the newest IE. Seems fairly shortsighted of Mercedes not to have their Chinese site in Chinese.
                                    Blog now updated with more facts and graphs. Snarkiness included for no additional charge.
                                    The Volvo V60 is coming to the US of A


                                    Second book is out "The Knight's Ill Thought Bargain" at amazon for Kinde or paperback.

                                    and at Barnes and Noble for Nook.

                                    Don't know what it is? Go watch the trailer.

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by _HighVoltage_ View Post
                                      I think they did have a long wheelbase S80 at one point.

                                      chaos386, so are you saying that they will design whole new interiors for the Chinese market, while the rest of the world will still get the regular "Swedish" interior? I somehow doubt that.
                                      The Chinese car market tends to favor more conservative styling overall. That's suspected to be one reason why Ford's bringing back the Escort nameplate with a pretty conservatively styled notchback sedan.

                                      If the interiors could be more conservative in terms of material color or type like British_Rover said, then I can see how it can be done. We're all aware, after all, of how a simple color change can transform an interior's ambiance: ex: a gray interior looking dull compared to a black w/ brushed metal trimmed pieces interior looking "sporty."
                                      "The way I see it a car enthusiast is somebody who is enthusiastic and interested about the motor car in all its various shapes and forms from supercars to East German 2-strokes made of cardboard. Everyone else is merely a car elitist IMO." ~ Captain 70's

                                      Get out of my way! I have photocopiers to sell! ~ Perc

                                      "A computer is a Lite-Brite for bad fucking ideas."

                                      FinalGear's Dash-Stroking Whore

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                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by _HighVoltage_ View Post
                                        chaos386, so are you saying that they will design whole new interiors for the Chinese market, while the rest of the world will still get the regular "Swedish" interior?
                                        Not "throw out the entire thing and make a new one from scratch", no. Tweaked ones in terms of colors and materials, though? Definitely. China is the world's single largest car market, so they'd be fools not to design for it.
                                        "It's not long enough to use in bed." -rickhamilton620

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