Random Thoughts (Political Edition)

[Wizegui]

They've never succeeded. At anything.
If you mean, secede.... that haven't succeeded at that, either.

The last time they tried was with a big referendum in 1995... it all boiled down to a yes/no vote. The rest of Canada (myself included) had a far more positive viewpoint of keeping our French culture back then, and we trucked in boatloads of Non-Quebeckers into the province to vote "No", and the Nos had it... 51 to 49 percent. The fallout was spectacular. The Parti Quebecois (provincial party always trying to get Quebec to separate) leader, Jacques Parizeau, got drunk, and made a speech blaming all the "foreigners" for the reason they lost. He wasn't talking about the non-Quebec Canadians, by the way. He was referring to legitimate immigrants (mostly from the Middle East, and north Africa) whom his party didn't consider to be "equal" to Quebeckers.... and his party subsequently flamed out.

It makes my blood boil when the far left Francophone students complain about the latest tuition hike. It makes me angry that they are complaining even when they have the lowest tuition in the entire country?! Don't they realize that all these subsudies are provided by the federal government (ie the taxpayers?). If you demand cheap tuition now, won't you just end up paying for more of it when you become a tax payer! To put things into perspective, the average Canadian full-time student is estimated to pay around $5,366 a year for their tuition while they are proposing to raise the tuition for Quebec students from $2,168 to $3,793 between 2012 and 2017. What makes them think that they are "entitled" to more subsidies that the rest of the country?

It is estimated that we spend around $1,843,000,000 annually on French-language services that are really only used by a small percentage of the population and on a province that essentially hates the rest of the country.

source: http://news.nationalpost.com/2010/12/11/the-bilingualism-debate-graphic-—-money-spent/

 

[jasonof2000]

They've never succeeded. At anything.
If you mean, secede.... that haven't succeeded at that, either.

The last time they tried was with a big referendum in 1995... it all boiled down to a yes/no vote. The rest of Canada (myself included) had a far more positive viewpoint of keeping our French culture back then, and we trucked in boatloads of Non-Quebeckers into the province to vote "No", and the Nos had it... 51 to 49 percent. The fallout was spectacular. The Parti Quebecois (provincial party always trying to get Quebec to separate) leader, Jacques Parizeau, got drunk, and made a speech blaming all the "foreigners" for the reason they lost. He wasn't talking about the non-Quebec Canadians, by the way. He was referring to legitimate immigrants (mostly from the Middle East, and north Africa) whom his party didn't consider to be "equal" to Quebeckers.... and his party subsequently flamed out.

From what my Canadian friends told me a large chunk of Quebec wanted to stay put no matter what the cities wanted and that the main party behind the vote started saying something along the lines of Canada could be split up but Quebec can't.

 

[GRtak]

Are you saying it's all over French arrogance?

I'm blaming auto-correct on the succeed/secede mixup.

You can blame it on whatever you want, but we are still going to make fun of you for it.

 

[Cobol74]

They've never succeeded. At anything.
If you mean, secede.... that haven't succeeded at that, either.

The last time they tried was with a big referendum in 1995... it all boiled down to a yes/no vote. The rest of Canada (myself included) had a far more positive viewpoint of keeping our French culture back then, and we trucked in boatloads of Non-Quebeckers into the province to vote "No", and the Nos had it... 51 to 49 percent. The fallout was spectacular. The Parti Quebecois (provincial party always trying to get Quebec to separate) leader, Jacques Parizeau, got drunk, and made a speech blaming all the "foreigners" for the reason they lost. He wasn't talking about the non-Quebec Canadians, by the way. He was referring to legitimate immigrants (mostly from the Middle East, and north Africa) whom his party didn't consider to be "equal" to Quebeckers.... and his party subsequently flamed out.

If I were Canadian I'd have been tempted just to say byeeee. Let them govern themselves as they seem to want to. You would not have to learn French in your schools then, you could learn Spanish instead and then you would be able to talk to most of South and Central America instead of a few grumpy French people.

Still all the Canadians I know actually do not want the country to break up so have bent over backwards to facilitate Quebec's place in the constitution. Next time they have a vote I suggest there is a vote in the rest of Canada to see if they can stay in.

 

[CraigB]

Random Thoughts (Political Edition)

You can blame it on whatever you want, but we are still going to make fun of you for it.

That's fine, it's still my year to take blame.

 

[GRtak]

That's fine, it's still my year to take blame.

Did I miss a memo???

 

[nomix]

If I were Canadian I'd have been tempted just to say byeeee.

Then again, if you had your way, the entire British contribution to the EU would be spent on building the world's biggest outboard motor to move Great Britain mid-Atlantic.

 

[CraigB]

Random Thoughts (Political Edition)

Did I miss a memo???

Since it's important to place blame it's easier and saves time just to assign blame to one person, usually me.

Edit: So this means I'm to blame for the US housing bubble, sub-prime lending, the Greek bailout, fleas, the decline of western civilization, even Hitler. Which is a bit odd since I wasn't born then, but that's ok, I can take it....

 

[Cobol74]

Then again, if you had your way, the entire British contribution to the EU would be spent on building the world's biggest outboard motor to move Great Britain mid-Atlantic.

Yes, yes I would, I know who my friends really are and one thing is for sure they are not EU politicians.

I see Norway is staying well away - don't you guys want to keep other counties populations in the style to which they have become accustomed? You know give all that oil revenue away. ...

 

[nomix]

Yes, yes I would, I know who my friends really are and one thing is for sure they are not EU politicians.

I see Norway is staying well away - don't you guys want to keep other counties populations in the style to which they have become accustomed? You know give all that oil revenue away. ...

We're still moving closer and closer to Europe, members of the EU or not. As far as EU policy is concerned, we're even better at implementing it than the Germans. The difference between me and you is that you get to vote for MEPs, we don't.

Norway's relationship to the EU is a strange and complicated one. We would probably be a member nation like Sweden, Denmark and Finland if we hadn't hosted the winter Olympics in '94. Because they assured us of how awsome we were as a nation. Add that to a strong farming and fishing lobby and a populace that's traditionally a little skeptic to other people, and you've got a slight majority for 'no' in the referendum.

I haven't been able to decide what I think about the EU. I see advantages. Such as keeping the peace for half a decade, having the potential of strengthening Europe in the face of growing competition from mega-states like China, India and Brazil, when the United States and China stands side by side in terms of power, the world will be parted between them.

Unless there's an alternative. An alternative collaborative of nations that can balance the power of China and America. If East-Asia gets their own union, and they might one day, Europe and American might have to consider a closer friendship.

I'm not pro-EU because I like every element of the European Union. I don't like the bureaucracy in Brussel, I'm not crazy about special interest heavily favored to the French and the Germans, and I think there's a lot of regulatory intrusion that can be done away with. But I'm not anti-EU either. Because I see the point of the EU.

Why don't I want the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland to secede from the European Union? Because it would be the nail in the coffin. Not because it would wreck the Union itself, the European Union can get along nicely without the United Kingdom, but because it sends a very strong message.

There are backbench tories, 1922-people, who look on the UK leaving the EU and the Euro failing with glee. Schadenfreude. They're sniggering, in their green chesterfield drawing room chairs, their Eton school ties and their glasses of brandy and their hatred of the French. They all have a little bit of sir Humphry Appelby in them. And I love sir Humphry. As a character.

What I have a problem with is the notion that the UK would be better served outside the EU, and that it wouldn't matter. The Daily Mail ethos, if you please. I read the Daily Mail. I actually read it. I read Beetle Bailey too. And I love Donald Duck.

But when I see some of the sentiments that dominate the debate on the EU, I feel a cold chill down my back. And it's not the back injury I've been struggling with for the last week.

 

[Cobol74]

Er no the biggest difference is we are paying 6 Billion per annum to a bunch of Politicians who hate us to make loads of laws only us and the Germans and a few others actually implement. There was one golden moment when the Germans in particular could have helped us and choose not to - killed any doubt in my mind really. Then when some large countries broke their own currency rules for no penalty that confirmed it.

Would your fishermen like all their fish 'given' away and have quotas imposed upon them, probably the biggest reason why Iceland has not joined, they would so love a Scottish Trawler fishing in their waters :lol: ? This keeping the peace stuff well next European war we won't be starting it that is for sure (Well unless the Americans ask us to :lol: ).

Well all I am asking for is the chance to vote on the treaty changes - I do not think a one would have passed here.

My end view of the EU is arrived at in a different way to most of the Ukip party. I remember the arguments about joining - big market for our manufactures - along come China. Would not cost a lot because we would get so much regional development - pigs have flown, not. The 6 as was then grew faster than we had since the war so join and we will. Well er nope.

Some people thought our industry would be forced to modernise and we would catch an efficiency like influenza from the Germans - er nope that has not happened.

 

[nomix]

Er no the biggest difference is we are paying 6 Billion per annum to a bunch of Politicians who hate us to make loads of laws only us and the Germans and a few others actually implement. There was one golden moment when the Germans in particular could have helped us and choose not to - killed any doubt in my mind really. Then when some large countries broke their own currency rules for no penalty that confirmed it.

We're not getting the vote, but we're still paying half what you're paying per capita. The EU is about splitting the bill. How much are the Germans paying? How much are the French paying? I'm asking because I don't know.

As for the currency stuff, it's hard to penalize nations. They tend to be a little sovreign. Much like monarchs, in fact.

Would your fishermen like all their fish 'given' away and have quotas imposed upon them, probably the biggest reason why Iceland has not joined, they would so love a Scottish Trawler fishing in their waters :lol: ? This keeping the peace stuff well next European war we won't be starting it that is for sure (Well unless the Americans ask us to :lol: ).

No, they didn't. Which I did touch on in my last post. The next war in Europe will probably be in the Balkans. National socialism and fascism aside, if you were to say "the next war will either be in the Balkans or have its roots there", you would be correct whenver that was to be stated between 1880 and 2012.

The thing is that the EU is stabilizing Europe. You know when you've got a bad back, and you take some ibuprofen? It's not like you're getting a morphine injection (I want one!), but it's better than nothing. When it comes to international security, my opinion tend to go in the direction of looking for what works, not what's perfect. And you know what? For now, the EU is working. Get rid of Greece, sure, that won't make that big a difference, but other than that, the EU is holding Europe together.

Well all I am asking for is the chance to vote on the treaty changes - I do not think a one would have passed here.

My end view of the EU is arrived at in a different way to most of the Ukip party. I remember the arguments about joining - big market for our manufactures - along come China. Would not cost a lot because we would get so much regional development - pigs have flown, not. The 6 as was then grew faster than we had since the war so join and we will. Well er nope.

Some people thought our industry would be forced to modernise and we would catch an efficiency like influenza from the Germans - er nope that has not happened.

In truth, you joined to late. Herbert Morrison said 'no' because the unions wouldn't live with it. And then de Gaulle stuck his big nose into Harold MacMillans dream for a united Europe.

MacMillan, Heath, they both experienced the results of a disunited Europe. So did Wilson, who while being outwardly negative, really supported Europe. They had a vision for Europe, a vision for a new peace that wasn't possible in 1919.

The only union between Germany and France in 1926 was, as far as I know, the league of nations. And they still didn't like each other. Think about the signifigance of France and Germany joining in a union about strategic resources seven years after WW2.

I can't get past that.

 

[narf]

 

[GRtak]

Since it's important to place blame it's easier and saves time just to assign blame to one person, usually me.

Edit: So this means I'm to blame for the US housing bubble, sub-prime lending, the Greek bailout, fleas, the decline of western civilization, even Hitler. Which is a bit odd since I wasn't born then, but that's ok, I can take it....

Damn, I thought you were a halfway decent guy despite your fondness for ugly Mustangs.

 

[Cobol74]

Well we can all play that game.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/8036097.stm#start


"Splitting the bill

The rebate is equivalent to 66% of the UK's net contribution in the previous year and is paid for by the other 26 member states as a roughly equal proportion of their economy.
However, four major net contributors to the EU budget - Germany, the Netherlands, Sweden and Austria - successfully negotiated a clause that means they pay only a quarter of what would otherwise be their share."


"Even taking into account the rebate, the UK is one of the largest net contributors to the EU budget. Had it not been for the rebate, its net contribution would have been even bigger than Germany's in 2007."


/Edit. Well CAP reformed - tick. Oh no it has not been. ? shit.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-18438727

 

[nomix]

Two generations ago, Great Britian laid down the best generation for Europe. It would be a bloody shame to waste it.

 

[British_Rover]

Pregnant out of wedlock similar to rape?

Well from a father's position yes it is according to Republican senate candidate Tom Smith from PA.



I don't know even what how I mean good fucking god. The far right has eaten their own horseshit for so long that they do not know when to shut up. Sure you can believe that if you want to. You can believe most anything you want of course but do not fucking say it in front of an open mic. Or at least do not say it if you plan to get reelected.



http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/27/tom-smith-rape_n_1834234.html


There is audio of this here... http://www.politicspa.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/Smith-dicusses-abortion-and-rape.mp3

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/p..._rape_victims__says_GOP_Senate_candidate.html

Local paper

 

[nomix]

The thing is, they're to used to getting away with crazier and crazier ideas, more extreme ideas each year. They dangle their feet, inserting medically unessessery ultra sound probes into the vaginas of pregnant women.

Then rape victims. Then it's pseudo science. Soon, it seems quite logical that one should get away with comparing sex outside marriage with rape.

Obama can't suggest 90s republican policy without being labled the most left wing socialist to ever sit in the white house, but the GOP candidates and elected officials expect to get away with more and more extreme stuff each and every day. And they're let off even without a warning. Dems need to go to war against the extreme right wing of the GOP.

You know what? Secretely, most republicans probably agree with that.

How crazy is this? This guy's been a democrat since the 70s. He's moved to the GOP, started to talk about rape in a certain way. It's like Mussolini going from being a marxist-leninist to creating the Fascist party.

 

[GRtak]

Republicans are always saying far more than they should in public.

http://indiancountrytodaymedianetwo...ted-custer-by-meeting-american-indians-130958

RNC Official Says NM Governor Disrespected Custer by Meeting American Indians

WASHINGTON ? Pat Rogers, a Republican National Committee (RNC) leader, is facing calls for his dismissal after telling the staff of Gov. Susana Martinez, R-N.M., that because she agreed to meet with American Indians, she disrespected the memory of Col. George Armstrong Custer.

Custer is infamous for being a U.S. Army commander in the mid-1800s who killed many American Indians during what are historically known as the Indian Wars. He was killed at the Battle of the Little Bighorn in 1876.

Rogers is a GOP lobbyist and partner with the Modrall law firm of Albuquerque, New Mexico. A recent member of the RNC Executive Committee, he is also an RNC National Committeeman for his state. He is currently in Tampa, Florida preparing for the upcoming Republican National Convention.

Rogers was appointed to the GOP executive committee by former RNC Chairman Michael Steele, who faced his own Indian-themed controversy after using the phrase ?honest injun? in 2010.

Rogers made the Custer-friendly statement in an e-mail obtained by Independent Source PAC and publicized by ProgressNow New Mexico, a liberal advocacy organization that is urging his exit from the RNC. Organizers with the group say his writing was a ?tactless and bigoted statement.?

?The state is going to hell,? Rogers wrote in part of the e-mail. ?Col. [Allen] Weh would not have dishonored Col. Custer in this manner.? Weh was a Republican candidate for governor of New Mexico in 2010 who ran against Martinez.

The e-mail was sent following a meeting in June between Martinez and the state?s tribes, according to ProgressNow. It was directed to senior members of the governor?s administration. The governor?s office has not responded to requests for comment.

?George Armstrong Custer may be regarded as a kind of military hero by Pat Rogers, but to the Native peoples of America Custer represents the bellicose imperialism that was responsible for the systematic slaughter of American Indians throughout this continent,? according to an e-mail being circulated by ProgressNow.

?Such a blatantly racist statement against our Native people is offensive from anyone, but to come from a national GOP leader and lobbyist for some of our country?s largest corporations is indefensible,? said Pat Davis, executive director of ProgressNow New Mexico, in a statement.

?These e-mails show the contempt and disrespect New Mexico?s Republican leadership has for our Native people. Unless they drop Pat Rogers immediately, we can rightly assume that those organizations he speaks for, including the RNC, Modrall Sperling and his lobbying clients, feel the same way.?

?Well, there?s an entirely different angle to this,? added Chris Stearns, a Navajo lawyer and chairman of the Seattle Human Rights Commission. ?I think you could argue that when Gov. Martinez met with Pat Rogers, she disrespected the memory of intelligent people everywhere.?

ProgressNow New Mexico has posted an online tool that allows people to e-mail RNC leaders and the corporate CEOs of Rogers? law firm and lobbying clients to call for his firing.

Rogers was forced to resign in July from the board of a state group, the New Mexico Foundation for Open Government, after his role in a separate e-mail scandal was investigated. He had been criticized for using personal e-mail accounts to contact state government officials attempting to influence their decision-making?a practice that carries questions under state law.

The RNC and Rogers have not responded to requests for comment, although they have previously taken umbrage with ProgressNow New Mexico for its activism.

The email is at the link.

 

[SpitfireMK461]

People actually consider Custer a hero? I thought that went out of style decades ago.