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    The Israel / Palestine mire (again)

    Filthy rabid animals. I need more ammo, me thinks...
    "Men with guts attack those corners!" - Keiichi Tsuchiya
    2006 Acura TL and 1999 Mazda Miata

    #2
    Originally posted by LeVeL View Post
    Filthy rabid animals. I need more ammo, me thinks...
    Israel could start trying for peace with them again instead of pushing them further and further to desperation. Trapping people in Gaza with no hope of leaving and illegally setting up settlements for instance isn't calming things down, but encouraging this violence. The best way to make people less violent is to increase their quality of living. There will still be unjustified violence, but it will be greatly reduced as humans in general seek stability.
    bogative ?

    "Any car which holds together for a whole race is too heavy." - Colin Chapman
    "If you think about it breast implants aren't much different than braces. Their main purpose is to improve one's appearance, at least that's how it was in my case." - KaJun
    "So the [suspension's] spring seats fail every 2 years, so what? They cost less than $250 to fix. And if a person can't afford that every two years, than maybe he shouldn't own a car at all." - _HighVoltage_ on Volvos.

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      #3
      Didn't we try to explain that to him already in the past?
      “If Liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear" (George Orwell)

      Comment


        #4
        You're both delusional if you think you can make peace with violent savages whose motto has always been to kill all Jews, including ones that don't live in Israel.
        "Men with guts attack those corners!" - Keiichi Tsuchiya
        2006 Acura TL and 1999 Mazda Miata

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by LeVeL View Post
          You're both delusional if you think you can make peace with violent savages whose motto has always been to kill all Jews, including ones that don't live in Israel.
          You honestly think all Palestinians want to kill all Jews?

          - - - Updated - - -

          The issue with Palestine is not global. It began with the rise of Arab nationalism during the last years of the Ottoman Empire. The Palestinians thought they would have their own nation. The influx of Jews from Europe as a result of European anti-Jewish sentiment as well as a resurgence in Zionism hindered their dream of a nation encompassing the region. The Palestinians would not agree to a two state system (in hindsight a bad decision) and tried to remove Israelis from the region (a delusional decision considering that Israel had both the U.S. and U.S.S.R. on its side).

          Since then Israel has grown much stronger (with mostly U.S. support) and has been trying to expand into the territories occupied within Palestinian areas. This has thrown fuel on the fire and many Palestinians fear they will loose their homes. Desperation breeds violent actions.
          bogative ?

          "Any car which holds together for a whole race is too heavy." - Colin Chapman
          "If you think about it breast implants aren't much different than braces. Their main purpose is to improve one's appearance, at least that's how it was in my case." - KaJun
          "So the [suspension's] spring seats fail every 2 years, so what? They cost less than $250 to fix. And if a person can't afford that every two years, than maybe he shouldn't own a car at all." - _HighVoltage_ on Volvos.

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by argatoga View Post
            You honestly think all Palestinians want to kill all Jews?
            IT'S IN THEIR OFFICIAL CHARTER!


            Originally posted by argatoga View Post
            The issue with Palestine is not global. It began with the rise of Arab nationalism during the last years of the Ottoman Empire. The Palestinians thought they would have their own nation. The influx of Jews from Europe as a result of European anti-Jewish sentiment as well as a resurgence in Zionism hindered their dream of a nation encompassing the region. The Palestinians would not agree to a two state system (in hindsight a bad decision) and tried to remove Israelis from the region (a delusional decision considering that Israel had both the U.S. and U.S.S.R. on its side).
            You seem to forget that in the 1940s that land was NOT under Palestinian control at all. It was part of the British empire and, as you mentioned, when the Palestinians were offered their own state alongside a Jewish state, they turned it down. Since then they've been continuously attacking Israel.
            "Men with guts attack those corners!" - Keiichi Tsuchiya
            2006 Acura TL and 1999 Mazda Miata

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by argatoga View Post
              You honestly think all Palestinians want to kill all Jews?
              Originally posted by LeVeL View Post
              IT'S IN THEIR OFFICIAL CHARTER!
              Someone please start an Israel v Palestine thread so the rest of us don't have to read this crap for the eleventy billionth time!

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by LeVeL View Post
                IT'S IN THEIR OFFICIAL CHARTER!
                When have they shown that agency? Would you provide a link to the group and charter?

                Originally posted by calvinhobbes View Post
                Someone please start an Israel v Palestine thread so the rest of us don't have to read this crap for the eleventy billionth time!
                Agreed. I'm having deja vu here.
                bogative ?

                "Any car which holds together for a whole race is too heavy." - Colin Chapman
                "If you think about it breast implants aren't much different than braces. Their main purpose is to improve one's appearance, at least that's how it was in my case." - KaJun
                "So the [suspension's] spring seats fail every 2 years, so what? They cost less than $250 to fix. And if a person can't afford that every two years, than maybe he shouldn't own a car at all." - _HighVoltage_ on Volvos.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by argatoga View Post
                  When have they shown that agency? Would you provide a link to the group and charter?
                  Not that we've been over this before

                  Article 7 of the Hamas charter:
                  'The Day of Judgment will not come about until Moslems fight Jews and kill them. Then, the Jews will hide behind rocks and trees, and the rocks and trees will cry out: 'O Moslem, there is a Jew hiding behind me, come and kill him.'
                  Do I need to remind you that Hamas is widely regarded as a terrorist organization and that they won in a democratic election in Palestine? As in, the Palestinians voted for and elected a terrorist organization that is officially hell-bent on eradicating all Jews. How is that unclear?


                  edit: I'll just throw this in here once again for clarity:
                  Last edited by LeVeL; December 28th, 2014, 8:30 PM.
                  "Men with guts attack those corners!" - Keiichi Tsuchiya
                  2006 Acura TL and 1999 Mazda Miata

                  Comment


                    #10
                    You do realise that just because a piece of paper created by some politician states X, doesn't mean all inhabitants agree with it, right? People often have no idea what they're voting for.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Hamas does not represent all Palestines any more than all Americans are by Republicans.
                      "I don't care who does the electing, so long as I get to do the nominating" -Boss Tweed

                      "No man's life, liberty or happiness are safe while Congress is in session,"- Mark Twain

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                        #12
                        Originally posted by ahpadt View Post
                        You do realise that just because a piece of paper created by some politician states X, doesn't mean all inhabitants agree with it, right? People often have no idea what they're voting for.
                        You do realize that the "politician" who stated X on that piece of paper is the elected official who would be the one to speak on behalf of his people in any formal discussions, right? As in, Israel would have to discuss any sort of deal with Hamas-the-Jew-hating-terrorists, not the peaceful Palestinians.


                        edit: Obama represents Americans... at least on an official level and his administration is the one that participates in international relations.
                        "Men with guts attack those corners!" - Keiichi Tsuchiya
                        2006 Acura TL and 1999 Mazda Miata

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by LeVeL View Post
                          You do realize that the "politician" who stated X on that piece of paper is the elected official who would be the one to speak on behalf of his people in any formal discussions, right? As in, Israel would have to discuss any sort of deal with Hamas-the-Jew-hating-terrorists, not the peaceful Palestinians.


                          edit: Obama represents Americans... at least on an official level and his administration is the one that participates in international relations.
                          You give me the impression that all Palestinians fully support their political leaders, which implies that you must also fully support Obama, which you don't. Conclusion: never mix politics and religion.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Enough Palestinians voted for Hamas to be elected. Does that mean that all of them support the terrorists? Of course not. But many, many do.
                            "Men with guts attack those corners!" - Keiichi Tsuchiya
                            2006 Acura TL and 1999 Mazda Miata

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by argatoga View Post
                              You honestly think all Palestinians want to kill all Jews?
                              Originally posted by LeVeL View Post
                              IT'S IN THEIR OFFICIAL CHARTER!
                              Originally posted by LeVeL View Post
                              Enough Palestinians voted for Hamas to be elected. Does that mean that all of them support the terrorists? Of course not. But many, many do.

                              Does not compute.
                              "I don't care who does the electing, so long as I get to do the nominating" -Boss Tweed

                              "No man's life, liberty or happiness are safe while Congress is in session,"- Mark Twain

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Originally posted by LeVeL View Post
                                Filthy rabid animals. I need more ammo, me thinks...
                                Originally posted by LeVeL View Post
                                Enough Palestinians voted for Hamas to be elected. Does that mean that all of them support the terrorists? Of course not. But many, many do.
                                Originally posted by GRtak View Post
                                Does not compute.
                                either

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                                  #17
                                  There are two simple possible solutions to that conflict:
                                  1) Remove all Jews OR
                                  2) Remove all Muslims

                                  There is literally no other way as both side believe that it is THEIR land by birthright. Maybe not 100% of both sides believe it but enough of a majority that a peaceful solution is simply impossible.
                                  ScarFace88 - "So you're a dildo?"

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    At its core, this isn't a religious conflict. Jews & Muslims live peacefully around the world, and in some cases within Israel. This conflict is between the hardliners that want power and land. The same things most conflicts are fought over. They use religion to motivate people behind their cause.

                                    A viable Palestinian state would end this conflict. I've said it before. It's that simple. Why Israel, the United States, and a few other countries continue to deny them their statehood is unjust.

                                    Would it end every single attack on Israelis (or vice-versa?). Of course not, but the vast majority indeed.

                                    I don't get why if a foreign or outside party kills someone, it's somehow worse than when a person is killed by one of their own? An American shoots up a school, nothing happens. If the person is from another country and deemed it's deemed a "terrorist act" we are ready to go to war and people demand blood for blood.

                                    If we want global peace, we need to change that mentality. That doesn't mean you do nothing when attacked, but a response must be measured. For instance, We would have been better off taking a police action against those responsible for 9/11 instead of launching a full scale war.

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by Firecat View Post
                                      At its core, this isn't a religious conflict. Jews & Muslims live peacefully around the world, and in some cases within Israel. This conflict is between the hardliners that want power and land. The same things most conflicts are fought over. They use religion to motivate people behind their cause.
                                      Exactly. It is Palestinian nationalism versus Israeli Zionism.
                                      bogative ?

                                      "Any car which holds together for a whole race is too heavy." - Colin Chapman
                                      "If you think about it breast implants aren't much different than braces. Their main purpose is to improve one's appearance, at least that's how it was in my case." - KaJun
                                      "So the [suspension's] spring seats fail every 2 years, so what? They cost less than $250 to fix. And if a person can't afford that every two years, than maybe he shouldn't own a car at all." - _HighVoltage_ on Volvos.

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by argatoga View Post
                                        Exactly. It is Palestinian nationalism versus Israeli Zionism.
                                        You are both smoking something that I wish you would share. The entire idea of Zionism is religious to begin with, why do you think Jews set up their own state where they did as opposed to just buying up a bunch of islands somewhere (plenty are for sale) and declaring them their own country? It's the same thing from the other side, Muslims believe it's their holy land and having "infidels" on it doesn't sit well with them.
                                        ScarFace88 - "So you're a dildo?"

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