Welcome to America. Now go away.

Cobol74

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I find this a little odd, of course if you are American it will not affect you but everyone else should read if they are thinking of travelling to the USA.

How far would you go for a trip to Walt Disney World? You would need to fly to Florida, of course. But from New Year's Day, the many thousands of British travellers who need visas to visit America will also face a trip to London or Belfast.
How far would you go for a trip to Walt Disney World? You would need to fly to Florida, of course. But from New Year's Day, the many thousands of British travellers who need visas to visit America will also face a trip to London or Belfast.
Starting in 2003, the US Embassy is insisting that applicants for American visas will face an interview, either at the Embassy in Grosvenor Square or the Consulate-General in Belfast. And anyone who has failed to live their entire life on the straight and narrow, but who decides to take a chance on qualifying under the "visa waiver program", is taking an increasing risk of being found out for some past misdemeanour.
A fortnight ago I wrote about a close encounter with the inner workings of the Immigration and Naturalization Service on a trip to Chicago, when I learned I share a name with a wanted criminal. Plenty of readers got in touch to report their own experiences ? a significant proportion involving deportation. Anecdotal evidence suggests that US immigration officials are getting tougher on people who they do not regard as meeting the criteria for admission. Now the Americans are insisting they see potentially doubtful cases to assess their suitability for a visa.
For the vast majority of the five million or so British holidaymakers and business travellers who go to America each year, nothing has changed: you will continue to fill in a form on the plane, and most people will qualify for a 90-day stay. But around 130,000 travellers from the UK each year need visas. That figure includes students on exchange schemes or work programmes, people with overseas passports who are resident in Britain ? and, crucially, anyone who has ever been arrested, anywhere in the world, regardless of whether or not they were convicted of any offence.
Many travellers know to their cost that, in some parts of the world, the police will as happily arrest a foreigner for some imagined transgression as give them the time of day. Indeed, in one or two countries this legal process is seen as an essential part of an officer's remuneration package. Once a "fine" is paid, for which a receipt is rarely given, the "offence" is forgotten. Or is it? Anyone who flies across the Atlantic with a skeleton in their luggage, figuratively speaking, is taking a chance that the US security services have not dug too deep into criminal databases around the world.
The arrival card for people travelling on the visa waiver program asks specifically about crimes involving "moral turpitude" (believed to be a reference to prostitution or pimping) or a "controlled substance" (drugs). But the rules have now been toughened to insist on visas for "people who have been arrested, even if the arrest did not result in a criminal conviction".
Should Euan Blair, the prime minister's eldest son, decide to leave his flat(s) for a trip to America, from 1 January he will be obliged to undergo an interview because of the caution he received two years ago for under-age drinking. Even if your conviction has long been regarded as "spent" under British law your youthful indiscretion may return to haunt you. To apply for a visa, you must spend ?67 ? and a day in London or Belfast. If the official decides they don't want your sort in America, you get no refund.
It might seem extraordinary that British travellers, who are so important for American tourism, are being made to feel so unwelcome. Are we not supposed to have a "special relationship" with the US, not least because of our government's slavish devotion to the White House? But since September 11, the Americans have felt understandably vulnerable. The hijackers involved in the attacks on that date had been legally admitted to the US, a fact that causes great anguish to the authorities.
Naturally, they have no wish to make such mistakes again. That is why they want every visa applicant to have a face-to-face interview.
A few exceptions to the rule that insists on personal attendance: the under-18s, over-60s, and, curiously, entertainers and journalists, can still apply by post. Everyone else who needs a visa and prefers not to make a special trip should apply by post to the US Embassy by New Year's Eve, to avoid the need to turn up in person.
The best source of information about whether you will need a visa is the Embassy's website: www.usembassy.org.uk; or, if you don't mind paying ?1.30 per minute, you could call the premium-rate number, 09055 44 45 46.
* Plenty of travellers fly via America to another country. But the concept of a transit lounge is almost unknown in the US. Anyone flying to Canada, the Caribbean or Latin America via an American airport is likely to have to clear US immigration and customs before the connecting flight. The fact that you plan to stay for two hours rather than three months makes not a jot of difference. A scheme known as TWOV ? Transit Without Visa ? can enable some to dodge officialdom, but the privilege may cost ?100.
The bureaucracy reminds me of the time I turned up at El Salvador's border with Honduras with a Cuban stamp in my passport, which made me persona non grata. I was offered the choice between paying several hundred dollars for a military escort through Honduras to Nicaragua, or heading back to San Salvador. I chose the latter, but in case anyone from the US Embassy is reading: I was not technically arrested.
A recent deportee from America advises anyone who finds themselves in the distressing position of being put on the next plane home explicity to withdraw their application for entry; if not, your passport may be stamped "refused admission" ? guaranteed to interest all immigration officials.
"YOUR SEAT-BELT is fastened like this and unfastened like this ? and those shifty-looking guys in the ill-fitting suits in business class are today's heavily-armed sky marshals."
The prospect of armed guards on UK aircraft is yet another misguided reaction to the terrible events of September 11. The reason those attacks succeeded so horrifically was because aviation had no previous experience of suicidal hijackers. The passengers of the last aircraft to crash on that day ? United flight 93 ? found out, through mobile phone calls, about the terrorists' motives. So they attacked and overpowered the hijackers, causing the aircraft to crash in a field in Pennsylvania rather than becoming the fourth guided missile to strike on that day. Now that passengers know the horrific sequence of events, they would be certain to take collective action, without the aid of armed sky marshals.
The transport secretary's announcement is yet more of bad news for Britain's airlines: they must give up saleable seats for the gunmen and women and will lose business from people who have no wish to fly on any aircraft where there is a gun on board, even if it is in the possession (at take-off at least) of someone on the side of good. Foreign airlines will be delighted, and even on domestic flights to and from London you can avoid the danger, thanks to the Belgian carrier VLM (serving Manchester) and the Irish airline Ryanair (Prestwick, Newquay and City of Derry).

http://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/welcome-to-america-now-go-away-747083.html

What do you all think?
 
I know fine well that I'm of questionable moral turpitude.

edit - on topic though, I always thought the US Visa Waiver Note From Parent was pretty awesome (although not so awesome as the EU's open borders for inter-EU flights). Seems that there's a whole chunk of exceptions for it, though.

I guess what it comes down to in the end is the discretion of the immigration official. It'd really suck to be denied entry to your holiday just because your name happens to be the same as a criminal's and you come up against Mr Jobsworth at immigration.
 
The article is 6 years old. Given the length of time that passed, has it had a negative impact on tourism?

And all countries impose restrictions on people that have records, just yesterday Martha Stewart was denied entry into Britain.
 
I don't think it's had much impact on foreign tourism at all. Back in 2006 we took a family trip to Orlando and it seemed most of the other people in our hotel were Britons. I thought that was pretty cool. Not to mention there were a lot of different nationalities in the theme parks when we went to those.
 
The article is 6 years old. Given the length of time that passed, has it had a negative impact on tourism?

And all countries impose restrictions on people that have records, just yesterday Martha Stewart was denied entry into Britain.

What gets me is, they aren't just targeting those with records, its anyone who's ever been arrested. I don't think they should be able to ask about arrests, just convictions.
 
And all countries impose restrictions on people that have records, just yesterday Martha Stewart was denied entry into Britain.

This particular example is a bad thing how exactly? :p
 
Why on earth would you come to America to visit Walt Disney world? I have absolutely no desire to visit that place nor any other theme park. If I'm going to a foreign country I don't want to go to a fake gimicky place like Walt Disney world.
 
They have some nice attractions, lots of fun for the family. And it brings in billions of dollars, so there must be something there.
 
[...]If I'm going to a foreign country I don't want to go to a fake gimicky place like Walt Disney world.
Disney World is considerd as something purely american, something that represents amercia. Like tourists don?t have half a year when they come here so they try to see the essentials. If you visit the USA, the essentials are (more or less) Manhattan, LosAngeles, the grand canyon and Disney World (not that those would be MY choices - that?s what I think is the general publics view). I know it?s sad and you probably feel mispresented by these things, but so do I when People visit Germany and later tell you what they saw as "Germany" ... that?s just how it is, France isn?t Paris, Italy isn?t the Vatican City (in multiple ways :D), Germany not Bavaria and Disney World is not America ... those are just parts.

I would actually visit Disney World if I was in America as a tourist ... I would not want to miss the chance to see this madness :mrgreen:
 
I can understand someone who comes to America and wants to see all the sights that it is known for, Disney World being one of them much like a tourist in England would want to see Big Ben or Stone Henge or in Italy the Vatican (guilty :)). I just never thought of Disney World as a "sight" of any sorts, I guess that is because I live here and don't visit here. Althought, it seems that here in the US, Disney World is everyones Mecca when they have children. They are of the thought that "We have to take little Susy to Disney World before she gets too old, it is something she should experience," I never understood that. When I was a kid, I went around with my parents seeing old Civil War battlefields, of course I grew up in a rather Spartan existance.

Anyway, sorry for derailing the thread. Back to the topic.
 
Disney World is considerd as something purely american, something that represents amercia.

That's weird; before Bush became president he'd only left the US twice - and one of those trips was to Disney World, Florida...

Although I agree. These superhuge theme parks are an American "thing". One I love and glad they export. One day I hope to go over there, to do some of the 'big' ones, like Cedar Point.
 
That's weird; before Bush became president he'd only left the US twice - and one of those trips was to Disney World, Florida...

Although I agree. These superhuge theme parks are an American "thing". One I love and glad they export. One day I hope to go over there, to do some of the 'big' ones, like Cedar Point.

It's funny to hear that someone from France would look forward to going to the US to go to Cedar Point. I live an hour and a half way from CP and have been there several times. It just never struck me as a popular location for people visiting the country. Disney World and the surrounding theme parks were significantly more impressive, but that may be because I've only been there once.
 
It's funny to hear that someone from France would look forward to going to the US to go to Cedar Point. I live an hour and a half way from CP and have been there several times. It just never struck me as a popular location for people visiting the country. Disney World and the surrounding theme parks were significantly more impressive, but that may be because I've only been there once.

I don't doubt that for most people Disney World is more impressive. Thing is, I've been to EuroDisney (Disneyland Paris), and it was great fun, but I get the feeling that Florida Disney World would be more of the same - Mickey, smiles and rides - but on a bigger, grander scale. Especially since in a lot of cases the rides are the same (and shared) between parks - look at the Twilight Zone Tower of Terror, or the Action, Stunt, Motors show that used to be a Paris original but is moving to the US.

On the other hand, exploring different theme parks - especially ones by different chains - is a fresh start, a different look at them. I'm also a bit of a thrillseeker so I like the idea of somewhere like Cedar Point*, with loads of rollercoasters. You don't get many decent theme parks in the UK - Alton Towers and that's it - or France (Eurodisney or Parc Asterix).

Also, I'm not from France, I just live there. I also studied Disneyland Paris at university, it's actually really interesting. About how when it first opened the French shunned it, as 'American cultural imperialism', but then EuroDisney adapted to suit French tastes - serving alcohol, more 'localised' stuff (Jules Verne), and allowing employees to have moustaches.

*Also there's no other reason to come to Ohio :p
 
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I can report from Germany that the number of tourists from Arabian countries around the Persian Gulf has dramatically increased here - especially in Southern Germany (Munich/Bavaria). So much in fact, that some hotels specialized in serving Arabian customers.

They now come here instead of travelling to the USA, because they feel unwelcome there. They are fed up with being automatically treated like a suspect, just because they happen to have black hair, black eyes and perhaps a moustache.

I imagine it's the same in other European countries. So the loss of the tourism industry in the USA is the gain for tourism over here. So please Mr. Bin Laden: Let the next bombing in the USA be done by Asian muslims, then there will be golden times for the European tourism industry :mrgreen:

Sorry for my sarcasm but it's hard to deal seriously with the growing U.S. paranoia about dangers that basically are the result of stupid politics in the past.

I got a call from a customer the other day who said his credit card was refused in L.A., because he did not have a U.S. residence. I don't know what he wanted to buy to get that refusal but the ironic thing is that the card he used, was an American Express Card :D

P.S.: Most murders in America are still done by Americans - just as an afterthought.
 
They now come here instead of travelling to the USA, because they feel unwelcome there. They are fed up with being automatically treated like a suspect, just because they happen to have black hair, black eyes and perhaps a moustache.

I'd bet that a lot of these European countries have greater problems with racism & prejudice than the United States. And I think that issue of feeling unwelcome is exaggerated, it probably has more to do with paranoia than reality (not that it doesn't exist).

Travel to the USA has become harder though, and there has been a tightening of restrictions.
 
I'd bet that a lot of these European countries have greater problems with racism & prejudice than the United States.

You'd lose that bet for the most parts.
 
Racism really isn't much of an issue in the United States, which is why organized sport here doesn't need anti-racism campaigns.
 
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