10 Cars That Damaged GM's Reputation (With videos at link)

[Spectre]

I was (WAS) a staunch GM driver. My fathers first car was a 1957 Chevrolet 210, then after that it was nothing but Pontiac. And he grew up in a Ford family.
But now parents are interested in buying a Legacy Outback wagon, since they have experienced my Impreza and are amazed at how my cheap little car is so much better put together than a GM product. As am I!
Can you believe that the fit and finish of the interior is better than my father's loaded Bonneville? Or that it is quieter? I essentially own a base model Impreza with WRX motor shoved in, since I have a TR model. So everything inside is from a $16,000 PZEV econobox.

And it took you *how* long to realize this? Some of us figured this out 20 years ago....

There are now two entire generations of people in the United States that have *never* bought a GM product because of poor quality, poor customer service, and poor design.

Economic analysts are stating that what really is killing GM is GMAC and the UAW deals, but if you keep treating your customers like fools, even a fool will know when to walk away.

Actually GMAC isn't hurting GM any more. They got spun off, remember? The UAW is the major problem now; GM management can do everything right, the engineers can do everything right... and the UAW will promptly screw it up.

I have Richard Porter's book Crap Cars, and he perhaps said it best:

"God bless General Motors and its amazing ability to shuttle wildly between technology that was either stubbornly old-fashioned or inadvisably advanced."

Yeah, and the problem, like several in this thread have said, is that GM didn't complete the technology before implementing it. Their engineers had great ideas and GM's short-sighted accounts (and executives) successfully neutered them one after another. That leaves GM looking like the idiots, no matter that they pushed the technology first. People want cars that work.

Even more amazing is when GM's idiotic Not-Invented-Here psychosis kicks in. A great example of this was when Bosch perfected multiport electronic fuel injection in the form of L-Jetronic. Everyone *but* GM licensed it; GM decided they knew better and would NEVER license any tech from anyone else. GM dumped millions if not billions into making their reverse engineered Jetronic system, called the R-Type Fuel Injection System... which didn't work. GM tried it on the Cadillac Eldorado of 76 and 77, IIRC, and it was a total disaster. They pretty much gave up on it at that point and went to cheap lameass throttle body injection. It would be 1985 before GM would try another multiport injection scheme; they'd bite the bullet and license the Bosch tech... years and millions of dollars late.

 

[rom1n]

There are a lot of Hummers in UAE too. Its such a stupid car.

 

[thedguy]

Actually GMAC isn't hurting GM any more. They got spun off, remember? The UAW is the major problem now; GM management can do everything right, the engineers can do everything right... and the UAW will promptly screw it up.

Except the other parts of it are still fucking up. The Aveo is a COMPLETE waste of money, it costs more than a better optioned Cobalt (which gets better mileage) and has less space.

They stuck with ugly ass designs, still haven't got much for fuel efficient cars and are poised to unload how many new, heavy, big engined, not fuel efficient vehicles by 2010? What are they going to make in the next 3 years that will be a better product to people not into fast cars? What good ideas have management had lately? Offer the American people the chance to give us a shit load of money NOT to buy the crap they haven't been buying!

"Brilliant!"

At least Ford is offering $50 to anyone who test drives a Ford and the Fusion is HUGELY improved inside and out (looks a lot better in person than in pics).

 

[Karoug]

About the H2, that thing is not good off road. There was a Top Gear episode where they put an Escalade an H2 and a Land Rover against each other and the only one that was actually able to get up the mountain (that wasn't even that difficult) was the Rover. Also what is the point of paying a premium on an H2 if its nothing but a Tahoe with a different body on it?

OT: That wasn't a TG ep. That was Clarksons DVD "the good, the bad the ugly".

 

[prizrak]

:lol: Seriously. The Escalade tried to drive up a cliff face and got stuck. And the H2 was parked, for some unexplained reason.

Probably snapped its tie rods I have a very hard time believing that an H2 would be a good off road vehicle. It is a very heavy truck and was always made to be more bling than anything else.

OT: That wasn't a TG ep. That was Clarksons DVD "the good, the bad the ugly".

Thanks I couldn't remember 100%

 

[Blind_Io]

Going strictly on functionality, the Hummer H2 is a capable machine. It's very good off-road, it rides reasonably well on-road, it's plenty powerful enough, can tow a lot, and will hold a few people and a lot of their stuff.

What?

Um, no. The H2 sucks offroad, the inside is way too cramped for the size vehicle it is and the spare tire (mounted inside unless you pay for the optional tire-swing) takes up half the cargo space. It's arguably the worst-designed SUV... in the world.

 

[_HighVoltage_]

The Aveo is a COMPLETE waste of money, it costs more than a better optioned Cobalt (which gets better mileage) and has less space.

That's just bad marketing I think. The Aveo as a car is not that bad, and on the contrary - I think it gets better gas mileage than the Cobalt. GM should reconsider the price of the Aveo though, and also reconsider its target market - it may work well in the big city areas, but advertising it in states like West Virginia is simply pointless.

 

[thedguy]

That's just bad marketing I think. The Aveo as a car is not that bad, and on the contrary - I think it gets better gas mileage than the Cobalt. GM should reconsider the price of the Aveo though, and also reconsider its target market - it may work well in the big city areas, but advertising it in states like West Virginia is simply pointless.

I was at the LA autoshow and my friend happened to notice that about the aveo and both of us gave a https://pic.armedcats.net/t/th/thedguy/2008/11/28/wtf.gif. The only thing they did good with the Aveo is improve the interior quality (above the Cobalt even). Still doesn't solve the problem that it's butt ugly.

 

[nouseferaname90]

I have to agree with the aveo comment. I personally cant seem to look at it without laughing. Instead of importing the Daewoo, they should have put a little work on a homebrew for the American market. Now would be a good time to start, but not a good time to introduce one as gas is dirt cheap.

Truth be told, I sort of liked the concept of the EV-1. Personally, I think it served as the inspiration of the idea for the tesla...but i highly doubt it was.

this is the best explanation that I have found for its demise:

Actually, if the General had left the EV1 on the road, they'd be legally bound to provide parts and service for the cars. They'd also be legally liable for any flaws in manufacturing that led to deaths (a la Pinto fires.) It makes very little business sense to leave such a large risk for themselves by letting a few loud complainers keep their cars. How often do you see de-badged and out-of-service UPS trucks for sale? You don't, and for the exact same reason. UPS would have to provide parts and legal responsibility for them. So instead, they're crushed once they're past their lifetime. The noisy environmentalists turned this into some giant sin when really it was GM keeping a vehicle from embarassing them if it had contained any potentially dangerous flaws that had been overlooked.

 

[Twerp128]

The H2 is capable off-road, it just is. Sure things break, but any one who has ever been off roading knows lots of things break. The problem is people that go off-roading don't buy a luxury SUV to do it in.

H1 is definitely cooler though.

 

[Spectre]

That's just bad marketing I think. The Aveo as a car is not that bad, and on the contrary - I think it gets better gas mileage than the Cobalt. GM should reconsider the price of the Aveo though, and also reconsider its target market - it may work well in the big city areas, but advertising it in states like West Virginia is simply pointless.

Base Aveo: 27/34
Cobalt XFE: 25/37
Source: www.fueleconomy.gov.

The H2 is capable off-road, it just is. Sure things break, but any one who has ever been off roading knows lots of things break. The problem is people that go off-roading don't buy a luxury SUV to do it in.

H1 is definitely cooler though.

As someone who's had to help push/tow dead H2s off trails that even badly maintained stock old Jeeps, Nissans and Land Rovers were successfully able to navigate, I must disagree.

 

[_HighVoltage_]

Spectre, I don't know if I should trust those figures. I've said it before in another thread - most taxis in Bulgaria are base model Chevrolet Aveo (1.6 I believe) and I've spoken with some taxi drivers and they claimed they were getting around 40MPG city driving.
I don't believe the US model will be much different (except for the automatic transmission)

 

[Spectre]

That was the stick Aveo I was quoting. And yes, while you can get more out of a car than the EPA says it can get, the purpose of the EPA test is to have a standard meterstick that you can measure all cars against equally to get a relative idea of their capabilities. And in the end, the Cobalt has better highway mileage.

 

[thedguy]

Spectre, I don't know if I should trust those figures. I've said it before in another thread - most taxis in Bulgaria are base model Chevrolet Aveo (1.6 I believe) and I've spoken with some taxi drivers and they claimed they were getting around 40MPG city driving.
I don't believe the US model will be much different (except for the automatic transmission)

Imperial or American MPG? Imperial means 40mpg is equal to 35 in American.

 

[Wizegui]

Isn't it more like 32 MPG since US MPG is around 80% of the Imperial MPG figure. I've always had a grudge against optimistic Euro MPG figures.

 

[thedguy]

Isn't it more like 32 MPG since US MPG is around 80% of the Imperial MPG figure. I've always had a grudge against optimistic Euro MPG figures.

I just know 39mpg imperial is = 35mpg us give or take .00000003 or something insignificant for this discussion.

 

[nouseferaname90]

Even if the aveocrapmobile has better mileage than the cobalt, its still a piece of crap car. I havnt seen more than 10 on the road since it came out way back when.

 

[_HighVoltage_]

No, I was talking in US Gallons, I already made the conversion. 40 US MPG.

 

[tigger]

Even if the aveocrapmobile has better mileage than the cobalt, its still a piece of crap car. I havnt seen more than 10 on the road since it came out way back when.

I remember local dealerships giving one out free with the purchase of an SUV. :lol:

 

[bartboy9891]

I just know 39mpg imperial is = 35mpg us give or take .00000003 or something insignificant for this discussion.

1 Imperial gallon = 1.20095042 US gallons

39/1.2 = 32.5, so 39mpg Imperial is roughly 32.5mpg US.