Should Germany Save Opel?

I'm guessing that you're culturally still into the "bespoke" thing and we're not so much.

The other thing is that the laundry list of options in the US has been reamed out by competition. Much of what Europeans pay extra for is *standard* equipment in the US, due to the highly competitive market.

For example, the Hyundai Tiburon is sold in the UK as the Hyundai Coupe SIII.

In the UK, the Tib comes with the following items standard and costs the equivalent of about $30K USD:

* 1.6L engine
* 16" alloy wheels
* Air conditioning
* Anti-lock Brakes (ABS) with Electronic Brake force Distribution (EBD)
* Audio system with iPod connectivity
* Body coloured bumpers
* Driver, passenger and side airbags
* Electric door mirrors
* Electric front windows
* Leather steering wheel and gear knob
* Rear spoiler with integral brake light
* Remote central locking with alarm


The US Tiburon starts at about $17K USD and comes with everything the UK one does plus:

- 2.0L, DOHC , 4-cylinder engine
- Tire Pressure Monitoring System (TPMS)
- Heated mirrors
- Sport-tuned suspension
- Kenwood? AM/FM/XM/CD/MP3 audio system
- In-glass antenna
- Fog lights
- Dual exhaust

And all of that is *standard*.
 
Last edited:
Last edited:
Yeah, you guys are definitely still on the laundry list system. Most of your "options" are standard equipment over here.

The following items are often "standard" in the US market:

Air conditioning
Power windows/doors/mirrors
Automatic transmission
ABS/Airbags/TPMS, etc., etc.
Electronic Stability Control
Lightly tinted windows

This is why when we want a feature not offered as standard on a particular size car, we often just go up to the next size car where it is offered, as it is cheaper to get it as part of the "standard" pack in the larger car than it is to option out a smaller one.
 
Also, a multiplicity of engine options isn't exactly a recipe for success in the US market either. I know the Civic comes with a huge number of engine choices in Europe... in the US, it comes with three options (usually). Honestly, the "you can have it with fifty different engines that are almost completely indistinguishable from each other" idea doesn't make the buying process easier. You typically want to have three to five engine options *total*, at most. Three is the most common number, of course.
You're right about nobody needing this amount of engine choices... SEVEN diesel engines, c'mon! But offering a 2.0 liter engine for people who want a little extra performance would not hurt, same for a ecomentalist friendly ultra-fuel-saving 1.6, especially if both engines are readily available and it's nothing but a management descision not to offer them.
 
The following items are often "standard" in the US market:

Air conditioning
Power windows/doors/mirrors
Automatic transmission
ABS/Airbags/TPMS, etc., etc.
Electronic Stability Control
Lightly tinted windows

These are standard on all non-Dacia or Lada cars (and on them, even power steering is an option!) offered in germany, too. Exept for aircon, which most people in our climate see as a useless fuel burner they'd only need twice a year anyways.
 
Spectre, we've talked about the options list in length over PM, so you know how I feel.

I do not, however, see the point in offering:

1.6i 16v Twinport (105PS)
1.8i VVT 16v (140PS)
1.9CDTi 8v (120PS)
1.9CDTi 16v (150PS)
2.0i 16v Turbo (200PS)
2.0i 16v Turbo (240PS)
2.2i 16v Direct (150PS)

this has all to do with taxes. Some countries have tax from a certain amount of hp or engine size. That's why nobody buys a 170 hp BMW 3 series, because as of 163 hp and over, it gets ridiculously expensive. So BMW have a special version for Belgium with, you guessed it, 163 hp.

I have a similar problem with my car, because I have a 130 hp engine, and upto 115 hp you pay 200ish ? a year, and anything from 115-163 hp is 500? a year...

Because different countries have different legislations, almost all of these engine options make sense.

Also, I think Europeans prefer being able to spec their cars EXACTLY like they want. Maybe we're more patient or we are scared of paying for stuff we don't want/need, but I remember options lists being super long since forever.

The "luxury" brands like BMW, Audi and Merc don't have option lists anymore, they have option BOOKS. There's litterally hundreds of thousands of possible combinations.
 
Whats this, an american complaining about too many options? Spectre turning communist? ;)
Choices are good, sure Vauxhall may take it a bit far but that's because it's a fleet car over there (Astra and the Vectra), over here it's not and we only have two trim levels (+OPC), and a bunch of engine choices. The ultimate choice maker is of course BMW, where you can spec up truly weird machines, and have a extremely fast car with manual rear windows. If people want to buy that, I say let them.

NooDle is right, Europeans order their car and have no problem waiting for three months for it to arrive, following the assembly process over the internet, whereas the american forums I frequent people freak out if their dealer can't find a car to their liking in the next state and they have to wait a whole week for shipping one from a state across the country.
 
Last edited:
I forgot lots of paint and paint colour options too.

Paint - flat, mica, metallic and pearlescent.

Colours - usually about 5/6 ranging from Silver, Grey, Red, White, Green, Blue, Black and one minority like Orange. etc.
 
I really don't see what the downsides of the European system are supposed to be either. The customer's happy that he's got the car exactly the way he wants, the carmakers are happy that they make loads of money from the various options and people who are too confused to pick the options will just drive away in the base model that the dealer's got in stock.
The Koreans and Japanese usually offer their cars with a few engines, several trim levels and no options in Europe, as they often still have to ship the cars over from Asia and making them on order would take too long. And if it was really such a great strategy, they would dominate the European maket. And they don't.
The american model is more of a continuation of Henry Ford's strategy with the model T, which you could have in any colour you wanted, as long as it was black.
 
The customer's happy that he's got the car exactly the way he wants, the carmakers are happy that they make loads of money from the various options and people who are too confused to pick the options will just drive away in the base model that the dealer's got in stock.

exactly. I still don't see the problem either. Especially since they make near no profit on the cars themselves, they make profit on selling options, so they try to talk everyone into them.

The people who don't want to wait for "their" car to be assembled are usually not really that bothered about stuff like color, electric windows, etc.
Extra bonus for the dealers is that they get rid of their (usually base model with NO options whatsoever) showroom cars
 
These are standard on all non-Dacia or Lada cars (and on them, even power steering is an option!) offered in germany, too. Exept for aircon, which most people in our climate see as a useless fuel burner they'd only need twice a year anyways.

Orly.

This is why our 24.000? 1 series has manual windows in the back, we paid extra for AC etc etc etc
 
Orly.

This is why our 24.000? 1 series has manual windows in the back, we paid extra for AC etc etc etc

Rly! :p

At the time of this wrinting, electric windows in the back are standard on the BMW 1 series. Don't know how it was when you ordered, but right now it is how it is. But even if there are one or two entry level models per brand which only have front electric windows, my point that these things are mostly standard, like in the U.S., still stands.... then it's not "all" but "almost all" in my original claim.

Aircon: As i said, most people (most people i know, that is) don't want one. I remember the outcry when VW tried to combine aircon and sunroof into one "climate package"...
 
Last edited:
Backseat freeriders can put in the effort and roll down the windows by themselves, if they want luxury then they should get their own car :p
Better yet, get a three door and turn off the aircon and let them boil :D
 

to me, the mere notion that he "expects" others to save his mess of a company makes me sick. thats just audacious.... if he kindly asked for money maybe id have more sympathy, but to kinda sit there and actually expect people to come and give you money? where does this guy come from?!
 
I just read that not only Opel's patents are pawned to the government, but also all immovables of Opel, meaning the production sites and buildings.

So Opel currently isn't much more than an empty shell.

It's interesting how these bad news come dripping in bit by bit, while the management of GM Europe still tries to convince everyone that Opel has a future, if GM goes bust.
 
Top