Put simply you carry more energy round the corners.
Put simply you carry more energy round the corners.
prizrak
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Would be interesting to see. I never liked the M5 and I do love my forced induction so I don't care too much that they are dropping the V10
In all honesty I have a very hard time understanding a performance sedan of that size. I mean something like a 545 has plenty of power to get going quickly in a straight and most people who buy cars like that aren't really looking for performance.
LeVeL
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Someone tell me what KERS is, please.
BMW's new _35 range motor is very very good. Power, torque, silky smooth, no lag, and good for ~350whp with just a chip. They should stick a similar engine (twin-turbo V8 doesn't sound too bad to me) in the new M5 and then just focus on handling. I remember watching an old BMI clip with the E39 M5. They said that it handles brilliantly for such a heavy car but you can still tell that its very heavy.
BMW's new _35 range motor is very very good. Power, torque, silky smooth, no lag, and good for ~350whp with just a chip. They should stick a similar engine (twin-turbo V8 doesn't sound too bad to me) in the new M5 and then just focus on handling. I remember watching an old BMI clip with the E39 M5. They said that it handles brilliantly for such a heavy car but you can still tell that its very heavy.
Hercules286
Well-Known Member
Kinetic
Energy
Recovery
System
The term is a more general term than 'hybrid' because it can be either electrical or hydraulic.
edkwon
Forum Addict
bravo, well said :lol:
They're not actually quite the same thing.
KERS specifically extracts energy under breaking from the kinetic energy of the car.
A hybrid makes use of electric motors and batteries to improve the efficiency of a conventional power source by storing energy from that power source.
You can however use KERS to improve a hybrid.
The_Finn
Well-Known Member
is the bi-turbo V8 that BMW currently produces a sequential or parallel system? I assumed it was parallel but i never really looked into it and recently read it used two different sized turbos so that would point to sequential.
thedguy
rides with Rebecca Black.. in the back
BMW should have a good enough name by now to not have to pull that shit. They should just do like I know the M division likely wants to do and come out with something with not much more power, more grip, as good or better handling, and significantly lighter weight, and in the end...faster.
BMW is honestly not all that good at building light weight engines (even for Mclaren F1 it was over the spec).
The 5.0 V10 weighs in at about 550lbs... thats more than a solid cast iron SBC.
Their current M3 v8 currently comes it at 445lbs/202kg
The TT3.0 is 429lbs.
The 3.0 n/a engine is 359lbs.
The latter 2 should give you a rough idea of the weight gain of their turbo setup.
argatoga
Can't Start His Wank
BMW needs to be beat Cadillac. BMWs are suppose to be "the Ultimate Driving machines" and Caddy, mostly known for land barges, has demolished them on their home turf. The good thing for BMW is that they only need to beat them once as government hell will kill of any future performance vehicles from GM.
klankymen
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Stop by my place for a beer when you do
Haha, I know that you are making a joke, but there's probably some truth to that... not a lot of cars will be able to pass it
And yeah, the BMW twin turbo engines that I know (4.4v8 aka _50i and 3.0i6 aka _35i) seem to be pretty epic, so I shan't complain until I see what it can do.
Disciple
Active Member
Wow. 202kgs for a NA 4L V8. Just to give everyone else an idea, the current 6.2L V8 from GM that powers our local HSV products, granted it only has overhead valves, weighs just 202kgs aswell. I don't know about my weight call now. I do know it would be pretty silly to build a brand new engine that's heavier than the one it replaces.
thedguy
rides with Rebecca Black.. in the back
Wow. 202kgs for a NA 4L V8. Just to give everyone else an idea, the current 6.2L V8 from GM that powers our local HSV products, granted it only has overhead valves, weighs just 202kgs aswell. I don't know about my weight call now. I do know it would be pretty silly to build a brand new engine that's heavier than the one it replaces.
Depending on exact displacement and spec the current LS engines weigh as little as 418lbs and no more than 445. The LS7 is somewhere around 430 IIRC. Not bad for a 505hp engine.*
It's actually kind of funny that it took BMW nearly 10 years, and an engine developed "in the same place as our F1 engines" to get a 4.0 litre, 400hp engine, to weight the same as GM's standard issue truck engines with 100k mile warranties on them.
*discounting all forced induction versions of the engines. And these are factory numbers.
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Disciple
Active Member
To be fair tho, the weight of all modern engines is in the head design. DOHC and multi valve setups weigh a lot, not to mention systems like Nissans variable valve lift which requires more parts again. GM's OHV setups, without getting too far into it or starting an argument, are very simple by design and consequently lighter I suppose, but they will never have the hp/lt numbers of DOHC engines.
Sorry, we're way off track here now.
Sorry, we're way off track here now.
thedguy
rides with Rebecca Black.. in the back
Yes we are, especially since you just brought up the most useless point. hp/lb or hp per lb/hr (fuel economy) it's every bit as good or better.
My whole point was, if BMW is as bad as they are at making "light weight engines" I can only imagine how much worse a Forced induced one is. At least their turbo engines are genuinely awesome. The N54B30 seems to have a wonderful ability to pull from idle to it's 7k redline, I fail to see whats so bad about that? It's not 8k, but it also doesn't look like a Honda race tuned b16 for torque compared to hp.
Wizegui
Well-Known Member
I think the supercharged LS9 engines from the ZR1 weighs in at around 240 kg which is impressive considering it's power and torque output. I'm not sure though if that includes the twin superchargers or the intercooler. Those DOHC BMW engines are quite heavy to say the least.
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Disciple
Active Member
It's not a useless point, because at some stage you need a good hp per litre number. I mean, weight is very important, but so is size, and you can't just keep making an engine bigger and bigger to get more HP - sooner or later you're gonna run out of bonnet space. :lol:
argatoga
Can't Start His Wank
Ugh. Displacement does not equal size.
https://pic.armedcats.net/a/ar/argatoga/2009/06/26/CamvsPushrod.jpg
Disciple
Active Member
Don't get me started on Fords' truck engines...
argatoga
Can't Start His Wank
Truck engine? What makes an engine a truck engine? The Ford GT40 Mark II had an engine sourced from a Ford pickup truck and it beat the shit out of Ferrari's race designed Colombo. The Koenigsegg CCR, which was the fastest production car in the world for a time, used an engine based of the above 4.6 DOHC. Is the Corvette a truck or the TrailBlazer a sports coupe? Both use the same "truck" engine.
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