CrzRsn
So long, and thanks for all the fish
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What would you buy?!
- Thread starter looneycooney
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Z3M Coupe is a powerful car but it doesn't handle like an MX5 or even a Z4. It's basically the bare minimum car that BMW had to build in order to support the torque of the S54 engine. The corners they cut show all over. The suspension on the Z3 is a huge, glaring weak spot. Plus it's expensive (from rarity) and trips both of his ">2L engine" and ">210bhp" tax and insurance thresholds.
I'd still go with the MX5 unless "unique" has an unusually large appeal and would overshadow "handling" and "fun."
I owned a Z3M (convertible, not coupe) for five years. The torque was fun but when I started going to the track I dropped it for a car that could actually handle.
I'd still go with the MX5 unless "unique" has an unusually large appeal and would overshadow "handling" and "fun."
I owned a Z3M (convertible, not coupe) for five years. The torque was fun but when I started going to the track I dropped it for a car that could actually handle.
looneycooney
Member
Indeed for me , i don't care if it is unique or has a certain badge ...
I've had many driving-lessons allready , but i know there's still much to learn and that's the whole point in this buy and having fun is point nr.1
The z3 is a beautifull car in design , but indeed it goes too wild on the financial side.
I've visited the ford/mazda-showroom today and asked for a testride .
Next friday i'll have a testride in one with a 2.0 6-speed manual.
What we did do , was talking a bit about these cars , insurance etc and they aswell told me i'd should first have a go for a mx-5 ,
don't think about buying an ST and the RS would be more interresting buying second-hand in a later stage .
Though they told me that i'd have more fun with the rwd mx then with a more powered fwd .
Tuningwise i was in for a surprise , i must say .
I could opt for a complete racing-package even legit on the belgian roads !
I didn't know that..they told me if i do it before i set it on the road it isn't any problem to get the papers .
The package-list contains a +20bhp upgrade , racing suspension , rims aswell as racing bucket seats and 2 bodykits .
On the other hand they pointed out there is a huge mx-5 fanclub in Belgium aswell , organising many events and trackdays with driving-instructors in Spa and Zolder.
On this very moment i'm subscribing myself on their forum to find out what their thoughts are and what they all do with the club .
Must say , i think i've fallen for it ... Also some nice accessoires on that mx-5 , though that's something to build on i guess, because those aren't cheap.
I'll let you guys know how the testdrive turned out
ps: while reading tests and looking for video's i've found another nice thing about the mx-5
It came first in the Dekra-M?ngelreport 2010 as the best car with the least problems in the class cabrio/sportcars 0-50.000km
Even in the class 100k - 150k kms km it came third right behind the 911 and the CLK ..nice detail !
I've had many driving-lessons allready , but i know there's still much to learn and that's the whole point in this buy and having fun is point nr.1
The z3 is a beautifull car in design , but indeed it goes too wild on the financial side.
I've visited the ford/mazda-showroom today and asked for a testride .
Next friday i'll have a testride in one with a 2.0 6-speed manual.
What we did do , was talking a bit about these cars , insurance etc and they aswell told me i'd should first have a go for a mx-5 ,
don't think about buying an ST and the RS would be more interresting buying second-hand in a later stage .
Though they told me that i'd have more fun with the rwd mx then with a more powered fwd .
Tuningwise i was in for a surprise , i must say .
I could opt for a complete racing-package even legit on the belgian roads !
I didn't know that..they told me if i do it before i set it on the road it isn't any problem to get the papers .
The package-list contains a +20bhp upgrade , racing suspension , rims aswell as racing bucket seats and 2 bodykits .
On the other hand they pointed out there is a huge mx-5 fanclub in Belgium aswell , organising many events and trackdays with driving-instructors in Spa and Zolder.
On this very moment i'm subscribing myself on their forum to find out what their thoughts are and what they all do with the club .
Must say , i think i've fallen for it ... Also some nice accessoires on that mx-5 , though that's something to build on i guess, because those aren't cheap.
I'll let you guys know how the testdrive turned out
ps: while reading tests and looking for video's i've found another nice thing about the mx-5
It came first in the Dekra-M?ngelreport 2010 as the best car with the least problems in the class cabrio/sportcars 0-50.000km
Even in the class 100k - 150k kms km it came third right behind the 911 and the CLK ..nice detail !
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Posmo
I'm a piano until proven otherwise
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In a lot of countries, insurance doesn't work that way. Insuring a boxster would only cost me ~12?/year more than the Sierra.
On Topic:
REAR-WHEEL DRIVE.
Steve Levin
Master of Disaster
I do like the MX-5, but I'm going to toss my choice behind a Civic variant. I've driven the US-Spec Civic Si sedan and it's more than entertaining on the track, while it is still a very good car to drive around day to day. It's not a muscle car (with less power than some cars) but it does have impeccable handling manners and good balance.
Steve
Steve
Pry
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I've heard the Z3 Coupe handles quite well compared to the Roadster because of the extra rigidity. I've had an impression that the M Coupe is pretty reasonable priced track toy in that power segment (with the 321 hp S50 engine). At least http://carfreaks.net/ these guys seem to like it.
From your list I'd buy an old Z4 with a largest possible engine you can afford
. I think it looks even better than the new one. It doesn't look girly like many other convertibles do.If I wanted a light small engined convertible I'd try to find an Elise.
And straight pipes? :lol:
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Having had to make a similar choice a few months ago, maybe I could share my experience.
My budget was slightly higher, so the possibilities I had in mind were a bit different but it was in the same spirit.
Firstly, I don't think you should hesitate between buy new and buy used. Personally, I'd never buy a new car, considering how much they devaluate, you can get a much better car if you look at the 2-3 year old market. But if you want a new car, why even look at used ones?
Secondly, the cars you listed fall in two main categories: hot hatches and roadsters. You should make up your mind about what kind of car you want. I went with roadster, mostly to see what it's like to live with. Also, I was already driving a clio RS, ie a hot hatch.
After those steps, my list was very short: Boxster S versus S2000. I really couldn't decide, both are great cars. In the end, I chose the Boxster because a flat-6 sounds a lot better than a straight-4.
To answer your question, if I can do without the practicality of a hacthback, I would buy a roadster over any hot-hatch. And I think you can guess which roadster.
PS. to help you choose even further, here's two more cars to add to your list: clio RS and S2000
My budget was slightly higher, so the possibilities I had in mind were a bit different but it was in the same spirit.
Firstly, I don't think you should hesitate between buy new and buy used. Personally, I'd never buy a new car, considering how much they devaluate, you can get a much better car if you look at the 2-3 year old market. But if you want a new car, why even look at used ones?
Secondly, the cars you listed fall in two main categories: hot hatches and roadsters. You should make up your mind about what kind of car you want. I went with roadster, mostly to see what it's like to live with. Also, I was already driving a clio RS, ie a hot hatch.
After those steps, my list was very short: Boxster S versus S2000. I really couldn't decide, both are great cars. In the end, I chose the Boxster because a flat-6 sounds a lot better than a straight-4.
To answer your question, if I can do without the practicality of a hacthback, I would buy a roadster over any hot-hatch. And I think you can guess which roadster.
PS. to help you choose even further, here's two more cars to add to your list: clio RS and S2000
Austere
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^ I don't know who this guy is but I like this guy.
kurthest
Well-Known Member
You got to be joking?
Hard choice between the Boxster and Z4, but I'd go for the Boxster if you can find one thats been owned by someone who took care of it properly.
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No, absolutely not. I'd much rather an MX5 over a Boxster 2.7 or a Z4. For the OP and the additional constraints of his regional insurance and tax issues I think it's a total no-brainer.
MX5 is tons cheaper and (in my experience) more fun to boot. Especially on track.
looneycooney
Member
It is true the boxster does drive seriously well ..although there were some things i didn't consider when i put that on the list though ...
What do the boxster owners think about my following questions :
-battery-life..should it allways be on a loader or not when it's not used?
..these cars without a working battery , can end up with some costs , phone up the dealership , which must help with the codes of the alarm etc before you can drive away ,
in some cases even resetting the car's key.
A friend of mine had it 3 times in 1 year .
-needs to be driven on a regular basis , which offcourse i plan to do , but not allways the big rides ..so it could eat up it's clutch , battery etc
You guys had any problems as such? It could also become a 'tame' car , when not really driven weekly so i've been told .
That's something you'll get stuck with in a longer period of time . When it's then pushed you can even hurt the engine badly .
-Oil -use how is with that actually?! Does it use much or is it just an oil-change like in normal cars?
Now i've been looking and asking around at dealerships and they told me i should find myself a 2.5 instead of the 2.7 ..insurance wise it's better for me aswell as a 'beginners' porsche-drive .
On the other hand i was quit impressed with the maintanance costs for the 2.5 aswell as the 2.7 !
It's way lower then i thought it would be and actually isn't that far from a normal car , even my former tuned fiesta ST comes in close with the prices ..although i did do more distances .
yearly maintenance (until 10.000km) : 175? ..each 20.000km 445? , although at the dealers they say it isn't needed! They really trust these cars that well.
Each 40.000km (which they recommend only doing this) 689? , incase of a new drivebelt count a 70? extra
each 2y brake fluid : 185? , brakepads (each 30k kms) 369? ..brakecallipers can be just switched with repaired ones by handing the ones on the car over..so that costs nothing!
so even if i would do a 30.000km/year like i used to do , it just sets me back for about 1300?/year in 'normal' use .
With a monthly track-use they'd recommend doing the big checkup twice a year ending up at around a 2000? /year only in garage-maintenance costs !
That's exactly the same as with my fiesta actually ...although i did get 3 new ignition-systems on that one.
And that's exactly like my friend told me aswell last year ..he owns also a xr3i escort cabrio , we gave it a makeover and
he told me besides fuel/oil/tires it costs almost the same as the porsche .
And now after my research i have to conclude the same thing.
So actually i guess i can afford it..the main question of course is ..did you guys had any fast wear on the clutches/gearbox or anything .
When i look at the standard tyres...also those won't set me back that much more. So it's all about how well i can trust on a second-hand cheap buy ...
Should a dealer-buy be more interresting?
They also give me 1y-waranty , aswell as a yearly invitation on the porsche-days at spa and 1 free track-lesson and the porsche 2-monthly magazine.
So ok , i'll let it all sink in and see what you guys have to say about it..offcourse the insurance i still don't have a clou about , but it will be seriously higher then an mx-5 offcourse .
Also , when i do crash it , how much are bumper-parts , lights etc in prices actually ?
Because i can imagin as soon as you get more confidence with a car , a crash is allways closeby , even with an mx-5 or anything else ...
To answer on the roadster/hatch..i'd go for a roadster , i do have a heart for ford's hatches..but actually i really want to have a roadster once in my life...
About the mx-5 ..you'd be surprised how seriously similar these cars are , offcourse the boxster is way more powerfull , the mx surely stands it's own i'd have to say .
The feeling how it drives , the way you sit in it with comfort etc , it's actually a 'little boxster' you could see it like that and now with the updates it's even better in quality-finish.
The z4 though , that one feels very different in ride and comfort aswell..the biggest plus the mx-5 has over all of these..the practicality !
Bigger boot, many many nice accessoires , easy to jump in and take a long cruise , cheaper roadgoing and it can even have a bike/ski-rack for example.
It's actually even possible to go on holidays with this car , because you can take everything with you aswell .
What do the boxster owners think about my following questions :
-battery-life..should it allways be on a loader or not when it's not used?
..these cars without a working battery , can end up with some costs , phone up the dealership , which must help with the codes of the alarm etc before you can drive away ,
in some cases even resetting the car's key.
A friend of mine had it 3 times in 1 year .
-needs to be driven on a regular basis , which offcourse i plan to do , but not allways the big rides ..so it could eat up it's clutch , battery etc
You guys had any problems as such? It could also become a 'tame' car , when not really driven weekly so i've been told .
That's something you'll get stuck with in a longer period of time . When it's then pushed you can even hurt the engine badly .
-Oil -use how is with that actually?! Does it use much or is it just an oil-change like in normal cars?
Now i've been looking and asking around at dealerships and they told me i should find myself a 2.5 instead of the 2.7 ..insurance wise it's better for me aswell as a 'beginners' porsche-drive .
On the other hand i was quit impressed with the maintanance costs for the 2.5 aswell as the 2.7 !
It's way lower then i thought it would be and actually isn't that far from a normal car , even my former tuned fiesta ST comes in close with the prices ..although i did do more distances .
yearly maintenance (until 10.000km) : 175? ..each 20.000km 445? , although at the dealers they say it isn't needed! They really trust these cars that well.
Each 40.000km (which they recommend only doing this) 689? , incase of a new drivebelt count a 70? extra
each 2y brake fluid : 185? , brakepads (each 30k kms) 369? ..brakecallipers can be just switched with repaired ones by handing the ones on the car over..so that costs nothing!
so even if i would do a 30.000km/year like i used to do , it just sets me back for about 1300?/year in 'normal' use .
With a monthly track-use they'd recommend doing the big checkup twice a year ending up at around a 2000? /year only in garage-maintenance costs !
That's exactly the same as with my fiesta actually ...although i did get 3 new ignition-systems on that one.
And that's exactly like my friend told me aswell last year ..he owns also a xr3i escort cabrio , we gave it a makeover and
he told me besides fuel/oil/tires it costs almost the same as the porsche .
And now after my research i have to conclude the same thing.
So actually i guess i can afford it..the main question of course is ..did you guys had any fast wear on the clutches/gearbox or anything .
When i look at the standard tyres...also those won't set me back that much more. So it's all about how well i can trust on a second-hand cheap buy ...
Should a dealer-buy be more interresting?
They also give me 1y-waranty , aswell as a yearly invitation on the porsche-days at spa and 1 free track-lesson and the porsche 2-monthly magazine.
So ok , i'll let it all sink in and see what you guys have to say about it..offcourse the insurance i still don't have a clou about , but it will be seriously higher then an mx-5 offcourse .
Also , when i do crash it , how much are bumper-parts , lights etc in prices actually ?
Because i can imagin as soon as you get more confidence with a car , a crash is allways closeby , even with an mx-5 or anything else ...
To answer on the roadster/hatch..i'd go for a roadster , i do have a heart for ford's hatches..but actually i really want to have a roadster once in my life...
About the mx-5 ..you'd be surprised how seriously similar these cars are , offcourse the boxster is way more powerfull , the mx surely stands it's own i'd have to say .
The feeling how it drives , the way you sit in it with comfort etc , it's actually a 'little boxster' you could see it like that and now with the updates it's even better in quality-finish.
The z4 though , that one feels very different in ride and comfort aswell..the biggest plus the mx-5 has over all of these..the practicality !
Bigger boot, many many nice accessoires , easy to jump in and take a long cruise , cheaper roadgoing and it can even have a bike/ski-rack for example.
It's actually even possible to go on holidays with this car , because you can take everything with you aswell .
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looneycooney
Member
Hey guys
After a good time , i had to completely rethink everything...
In the while i was gone from the forums , many things have happened !
I moved towards the coast , got a new job etc etc ...
Thanks to my family i found a great and good earning job aswell and only live 500m from it! (no car needed for transport)
This offcourse changed everything!
With the blessing of the homefront (my mom) , I also got some extra savings etc and now my 'dreamcar' is well under way !
As i allways have been a fan of Porsches , but i allways thought this would be too much to spend on...
Yet , i never gave up the dream...
I know i was looking for a rearwheel-driven cabrio , but i stumbled upon something completely different.
Never expected to say it , but i signed the papers for a Carrera Coup? today !
Had some testdrives, also in a boxster fe. ..but since a 911 allways been a real dreamcar for me..i just couldn't resist after seeing the pricetag !
Spend many hours at the dealer spread over 3 days , the last day he took me out on a spin with several cars...
Still it is a second hand one, but for me it's a real beauty ..it's a 996 ,3.6cyl. 320bhp 2003 with only 78.000km on it !
It even became better when i got the real price in front of me...for 35.000? it stood in the showroom , but i signed it for 32.k because it had a small crack on the passenger-seat's leather and some other small interior-flaws . Myself being a proffesional carcleaner helped in looking for the details aswell as for the haggling offcourse .
I can pick it up next week ..and best thing of all , it comes with an invitation on a trackday with the local porsche-club !
Ok, it's not a convertible etc..but still this is way beyond my wildest dreams and i'm going to cherish this car like no other i've had before
..i'll give it a hug everytime before i get in for sure x-)
Thanks for all the help and replies..i'll soon send some pics etc ...
Wkr,
Lc
ps: my mom allready got her share of hugs aswell
After a good time , i had to completely rethink everything...
In the while i was gone from the forums , many things have happened !
I moved towards the coast , got a new job etc etc ...
Thanks to my family i found a great and good earning job aswell and only live 500m from it! (no car needed for transport)
This offcourse changed everything!
With the blessing of the homefront (my mom) , I also got some extra savings etc and now my 'dreamcar' is well under way !
As i allways have been a fan of Porsches , but i allways thought this would be too much to spend on...
Yet , i never gave up the dream...
I know i was looking for a rearwheel-driven cabrio , but i stumbled upon something completely different.
Never expected to say it , but i signed the papers for a Carrera Coup? today !
Had some testdrives, also in a boxster fe. ..but since a 911 allways been a real dreamcar for me..i just couldn't resist after seeing the pricetag !
Spend many hours at the dealer spread over 3 days , the last day he took me out on a spin with several cars...
Still it is a second hand one, but for me it's a real beauty ..it's a 996 ,3.6cyl. 320bhp 2003 with only 78.000km on it !
It even became better when i got the real price in front of me...for 35.000? it stood in the showroom , but i signed it for 32.k because it had a small crack on the passenger-seat's leather and some other small interior-flaws . Myself being a proffesional carcleaner helped in looking for the details aswell as for the haggling offcourse .
I can pick it up next week ..and best thing of all , it comes with an invitation on a trackday with the local porsche-club !
Ok, it's not a convertible etc..but still this is way beyond my wildest dreams and i'm going to cherish this car like no other i've had before
..i'll give it a hug everytime before i get in for sure x-)
Thanks for all the help and replies..i'll soon send some pics etc ...
Wkr,
Lc
ps: my mom allready got her share of hugs aswell
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Polygon
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Nice job and congrats!
I could never suggest a Boxster (non-S). They can be beaten by much lesser names driven by the front wheels. They are a joke. However, a 911 is no joke. Had that been in the options it's the one I would have picked for sure.
I could never suggest a Boxster (non-S). They can be beaten by much lesser names driven by the front wheels. They are a joke. However, a 911 is no joke. Had that been in the options it's the one I would have picked for sure.
looneycooney
Member
Thanks , i'm thrilled with my purchase
Although it will be a good lesson for me, even with all the experiences i've had with high-powered cars..owning one myself soon still is very different .
First thing to do is ask for some laps with an instructor on the local tracks (zolder/spa) aswell as getting interesting feedback,and experiences from the guys in the porsche-club .
Well to be honest , i look at it this way ...
Every car has it's well respected place on the roads , i and probably many others also have beaten more powered cars with smaller ones . It all depends on the enviroment and maybe even more on the driver .
The hardest thing i found over the years, is knowing i could drive way better then most people out here on the roads , but never had a car to really say it out loud.
For example i probably can drive an AMG SL way better then most of the owners..but try telling them ! (fact is i've driven them daily, while owning a fiesta myself...)
The real drivers aren't made by the keys in their pockets..their are made by their talent !
Thruth is a 911 is faster and even better for track-use etc , but sometimes also overrated , depending on the driver behind the wheel!
I'm pretty sure a well talented Boxster driver can have just as much fun with his tool then others in their 911 .
Like Jeremy said some seasons ago , when he left one of my favorite hometracks (zolder) :
Wkr,
Lc
Although it will be a good lesson for me, even with all the experiences i've had with high-powered cars..owning one myself soon still is very different .
First thing to do is ask for some laps with an instructor on the local tracks (zolder/spa) aswell as getting interesting feedback,and experiences from the guys in the porsche-club .
Well to be honest , i look at it this way ...
Every car has it's well respected place on the roads , i and probably many others also have beaten more powered cars with smaller ones . It all depends on the enviroment and maybe even more on the driver .
The hardest thing i found over the years, is knowing i could drive way better then most people out here on the roads , but never had a car to really say it out loud.
For example i probably can drive an AMG SL way better then most of the owners..but try telling them !
(fact is i've driven them daily, while owning a fiesta myself...) The real drivers aren't made by the keys in their pockets..their are made by their talent !
Thruth is a 911 is faster and even better for track-use etc , but sometimes also overrated , depending on the driver behind the wheel!
I'm pretty sure a well talented Boxster driver can have just as much fun with his tool then others in their 911 .
Like Jeremy said some seasons ago , when he left one of my favorite hometracks (zolder) :
..and he'd probably be right
Wkr,
Lc
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I'm so sorry to hear this because it means you're now ruined for life. Once you've got that rear-engine handling under your skin no other car is ever going to satisfy you the same way. I'm afraid it's 911s from here on out for you. Believe me, it's a rough burden.
Now hurry up and post a bunch of pics to the "Post Your Car" board.
mclarensmps
Well-Known Member
It's a wonderful feeling to be able to sit and drive something that you've dreamed about for years. I'm really happy for you, I'm a bit in the same boat as you, but on a much cheaper scale :lol:. It's a wonderful feeling, and I love 911s (apart from their limited production supercars, the 911 is the only car Porsche makes, in my eyes :lol, a fantastic choice.
Don't go ignoring us, though, once you get her, post pics, we all want to see and drool ^^.
, a fantastic choice.Don't go ignoring us, though, once you get her, post pics, we all want to see and drool ^^.
AudiV6
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Z4.
Labcoatguy
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