American Designs

I'd love to see a picture of new OEM Volkswagen chrome wheels. Not any random CGI rendering of a VW.

Also regarding the subject, the cars of Chrysler are now much more boxy than they were 10 years ago. Caliber, current Sebring etc are way more boxy than PT Cruiser or the previous Sebring. But yeah, the boxy looks are not the biggest problems of those cars. So it's a problem with the Chrysler group, not the whole US car industry.
 
While on the topic of design, there are always a few little tweaks they make to cars for the American Market. Not sure if they are legal things or if they think it looks better, but either way, I dont understand why it's done.

Things like this:
Subaru-Legacy_3.0_R_2008_photo_03.jpg

The American model

2007_Subaru_Liberty_3.0R_Spec_B_01.jpg

The Australian version

The car is ALMOST the same. ALMOST. just little things like orange filters on turn signals, and a different bumper. It seems you can find these differences on every American spec model vs a euro or aus version. I never understood why they bother making those changes.
 
The latter is a 3.0R Spec B, which has unique front bumper in Europa and I think also in Japan. The normal Legacy looks quite same in Europa, US and Japan.

2008-subaru-legacy-2-0d-a_800x0w.jpg

Yeah, the bumper is a bit different, but the differences are quite small.
 
I'd love to see a picture of new OEM Volkswagen chrome wheels. Not any random CGI rendering of a VW.

Also regarding the subject, the cars of Chrysler are now much more boxy than they were 10 years ago. Caliber, current Sebring etc are way more boxy than PT Cruiser or the previous Sebring. But yeah, the boxy looks are not the biggest problems of those cars. So it's a problem with the Chrysler group, not the whole US car industry.
+1
And as they really don't sell American Fords and Chevrolets over here it seems like all the American cars are getting boxy.
 
The obsession with plastic interiors also kinda annoys me, as well as chrome rims!

Hate to break it to you, but unless a car is a luxury car swathed in leather, or an old car with metal interior, pretty much every car is filled with plastic interior parts. Vinyl is a plastic, and 99% of cars have vinyl dashes and door panels and center consoles. Plastic is easy to mold into any shape, fairly lightweight, can be made hard or soft, and thus meet interior occupant protection requirements. My 7 series BMW is all plastic inside, except for a couple leather inserts and leather seats, and some plastic coated wood. My MGB dash is entirely plastic. My Range Rover is plastic with a bit of leather on the door panels, and the seats.

Hate to shock you, but most of this interior is plastic:

2010-Mercedes-Benz-C-Class-interior.jpg


And this is my 740iL. Most of it is plastic, as well (the 750 got leather on all the exposed areas of the dash and center console)

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And don't bother responding with a couple limited edition high end versions of European cars. Look at the mainstream stuff from VW, Citroen, Fiat, Skoda, Peugeot, etc. Even the mainstream BMWs and Mercedes. ALL filled with various plastics, because that's how you build cars.


As for chrome wheels, just like chrome trim, it's about the body accent. A lot of my favorite European cars have chrome or polished wheels and trim, too.

Ferrari_250GT_Lusso_1963_concorso-it_2007_CCC_0066.jpg


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But I love them on hot rods and musclecars, too. It's like jewelry on a beautiful woman.

165255d1234256459-17-torq-thrust-rims-w-new-tires-1000-img_1665_web.jpg




Oh, and one more question, of which I'm genuinely interested: Are there any Americans here who actually liked the Chrysler PT?

I do.

I see what you're saying in the value-for-money argument, but there's a point where standing out in the crowd is happening for the wrong reasons.

Looks are subjective, which is why people like you can still find a girlfriend. :lol:

I like the 3/4 scale street rod look. It's like having a '37 Ford sedan with a warranty and better build quality/versatility. The idea was that it was a small, tall station wagon, the kind of vehicle people were screaming that the average SUV owner should have instead. It wasn't just a featureless small box, or a cute-ute wannabe-offroader (whihc is worse). Just a basic, inexpensive small wagon with a lot of utility, versatilty, and for a lot of us, fun cool style. And not just us. There were PT Cruiser clubs popping up in Japan and Germany within a month of it being announced, and many of the first ones that were ordered ended up there in huge PT Cruiser clubs.

My own PT was a 2002 5 speed manual Touring edition that I had for 5 years. Never had a single defect in it, no squeaks, rattles, parts falling off, no mechanical failures or electrical failures. It went all over the east oast of the US, from Maine to Orlando. It was comfortable to drive for 17 hours straight (the trip to orlando from Baltimore) and for daily commute duties. I carried all the lumber for the deck on my house in it, as well as ALL the replacement windows (a stack of 16 32"x64" double hung windows with frames, stacked floor to ceiling with the hatch closed). I carried home 1500lbs worth of bagged crushed rock for the side driveway in one load with no porblems (and it barely affected the handling). Went camping numerous times in it. Autocrossed it for a season (and taught my wife how to autocross in it). Probably overall the best car I've ever had at the job of being a car, and I've owned over a hundred cars in the last 30 years. When I sold it after getting my first Range Rover (to tow a travel trailer) it was still in as flawless condition as when I drove it off the dealer lot with only 3 miles on it.

As I said, I love the semi street rod styling, though I would have liked to customize it a bit with the billet grillework. I really liked the painted interior bits, comfy steering wheel, and cue-ball shifter, and the seats could fold up and come out in about 50 different configurations.

Just for reference, here's mine. Street rod styling AND Chrome wheels, just to mess with you (left the stock ones on to go autocrossing with) :lol:

PT00.jpg


PT18.jpg


PT14.jpg


PT17.jpg


pt_montage.jpg
 
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There is a difference between using plastics and looking plasticky.
 
Also a difference between using quality plastics and just emptying a garbage bin into your cockpit, hoping it'll pass for an interior.

edit: Sorry if I missed the point in your post, I kinda dozed off after the first Merc-pic.
 
Yeah, plastic is plastic, we got that. The point is, some manufacturers, like Audi, make awesome interiors with plastic, while some others, like pre-FL Caliber, looks rubbish. It's not the material, it's how you use it. And chrome wheels, yeah they're lovely on 60s sportscars. But 2010 midrange sedans? Yeah.
 
While on the topic of design, there are always a few little tweaks they make to cars for the American Market. Not sure if they are legal things or if they think it looks better, but either way, I dont understand why it's done.

Things like this:
The car is ALMOST the same. ALMOST. just little things like orange filters on turn signals, and a different bumper. It seems you can find these differences on every American spec model vs a euro or aus version. I never understood why they bother making those changes.
Regulations. The regulations for bumpers and lights are different on different continents. The US has stricter bumper regulations (and Canada's are even worse than the US, our first-gen Audi TT had to be fitted with awful bumper goiters to meet them), and lighting regs are different between continents though I'm not sure of the details on those. In essence, all changes between continents are entirely due to slight differences in regulations.
 
Also a difference between using quality plastics and just emptying a garbage bin into your cockpit, hoping it'll pass for an interior.

The point is, however, what is "quality plastic?" So many VW soft touch plastics that everyone says are quality have absolutely zero durability. I've seen BMW and Mercedes "quality" plastic dashes warp and crack. Quality isn't whether a plastic is hard or soft, dull or shiny. It's about how well it functions in it's intended role. A lot of surfaces aren't meant to be stroked, so they can be harder, stiffer plastic that only has to stay put and not warp. You can have softer pastics on dash surfaces that may get handled more, or are in danger of being impacted with in an accident, but if they aren't durable, then no matter HOW they feel, they aren't high quality materials. That Mercedes pic I posted is full of plastic, and there's no guarantee it's any better quality than a cheap Jeep Patriot. And unless you know the actual composition of the plastic involved, then looking at picture or even looking in the window won't tell you the quality.

Check this link: http://www.mitsuichemicals.com/interior.htm

The differences you and the OP are talking about aren't in material quality, but in design. And yes, there have been some questionable interior designs in American cars, especially '90s GM cars with their grey round knobs and buttons and large radius edges 9that made them look liek there were HUGE panel gaps).

1998%20pontiac%20sunfire%20(int).JPG


2002-pontiac-sunfire-se-pic-43687.jpeg


Yeah, plastic is plastic, we got that. The point is, some manufacturers, like Audi, make awesome interiors with plastic, while some others, like pre-FL Caliber, looks rubbish. It's not the material, it's how you use it.

Exactly. The response, however, is to counter the OP's question about the fascination with interior plastic. He didn't mention quality at all. Only "plastic." and all manufacturers use plastics.

And chrome wheels, yeah they're lovely on 60s sportscars. But 2010 midrange sedans? Yeah.

Done for the same reason, however. Automotive jewlery. On some colors, the chrome accents really set it off. And if you're used to it in that application it doesn't bother you when it's done. I originally was going to use chromed M-pars on my 740iL. I happen to like that look:

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The point is, however, what is "quality plastic?" .. tldr..

Durable plastics that look good:

http://img212.imageshack.**/img212/8067/17086342ql2.jpg

'nuff said.

too many curves :p
plus an H1 would run over the RR

You're missing the point. The RR will run offroad further than an H1 and if not offroad, then outrun it on the road. Your big-wheeled monster won't have the CHANCE to run it over! :p
 
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too many curves :p
plus an H1 would run over the RR

I agree on the roundyness of modern suvs. Doesn't look right to me. It is supposed to be pointy.
 
I'd love to see a picture of new OEM Volkswagen chrome wheels. Not any random CGI rendering of a VW.

Also regarding the subject, the cars of Chrysler are now much more boxy than they were 10 years ago. Caliber, current Sebring etc are way more boxy than PT Cruiser or the previous Sebring. But yeah, the boxy looks are not the biggest problems of those cars. So it's a problem with the Chrysler group, not the whole US car industry.

On what planet is this boxy?

Chrysler-200_2011_photo_06.jpg
 
Yeah, plastic is plastic, we got that. The point is, some manufacturers, like Audi, make awesome interiors with plastic, while some others, like pre-FL Caliber, looks rubbish.

You're comparing a $40,000 car to a $12,000 car. Of course the former is going to be more nicely executed. The interior plastics on a current-generation Toyota Corolla are rubbish too.

And most of the dash on my Civic is made out of LEGO plastic as far as I can tell. Durable and solid, but hard and inexpensive. You know what? I don't fondle the dashboard, so I don't care.
 
On what planet is this boxy?
I was talking about the lovely version we get in europa.
sebring.jpg



You're comparing a $40,000 car to a $12,000 car. Of course the former is going to be more nicely executed. The interior plastics on a current-generation Toyota Corolla are rubbish too.

And most of the dash on my Civic is made out of LEGO plastic as far as I can tell. Durable and solid, but hard and inexpensive. You know what? I don't fondle the dashboard, so I don't care.

I used the Audi just as an example, because at the moment they're the best by making non-plasticky plastic. But as an example, the normal Golf has rather impressive interior for it's price. Way much better than the Sebring for example. And last time I checked, Golf was cheaper.
 
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