2011 Technical Regulations - The Changes

bone said:
they need rules. or the cars would be going around a hairpin at 400kmh, and be as wide as the track itself
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No, the truth is that they keep adding rules in order to balance out certain major teams desires to scream bloody murder and refuse to race if they don't get their way (read - the greatest advantage from any rule changes). Ferrari is definitely the worst about doing this. Before the signing of the last Concord agreement, they threatened to walk away several times if some of the proposed rules changes were not modified to suit their pre-existing chassis. (I can present some of the specifics, but I'm going to have to dig out some 4 year old issues of Autosport and F1 Racing. I'll do it if you like.)

Unfortunately for all F1 fans, Bernie always bends over because he's convinced that F1 can't succeed without the Ferrari "halo".

Also, (to pick up another point made earlier):
The original KERS introduction was strictly a case of green-washing what is, admittedly, a disturbingly petroleum consuming sport. (I forget the exact figures, but an F1 car makes a Hummer look like the environmentally sensitive choice.) For instance, look at that dumb-ass 2008 Honda "paint" scheme. Fortunately for us all, the weight of their marketing bullshit slowed the car so much they had to leave the sport completely, leaving Ross Brawn to do his thing, and create an innovative and entertaining car/driver combo for '09. (Hey, I'm a die-hard McLaren guy, but I cheered for Button and Reubens all season...)

However, KERS has definite applications in the commercial automotive market. I do agree with Vikrad that it's a complete shame that they're not developing it to its' maximum potential. F1 is supposed to be the pinnacle of motorsport. The apex of technology and all that (think turbochargers, ECUs, TCM, and ABS, all of which were developed or highly refined in F1).

In the case of KERS, let the technology develop for chrissakes! I, for one, would love the opportunity to bolt some aftermarket parts on to my vehicles that would increase the fuel mileage. Maybe, with the weight allowance being made in this iteration of KERS, more teams will elect to develop the technology, and we will all potentially see the benefit. (sorry if this rambled a bit too much...)
 
ncrypted said:
No, the truth is that they keep adding rules in order to balance out certain major teams desires to scream bloody murder and refuse to race if they don't get their way (read - the greatest advantage from any rule changes).
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I don't agree. Big teams with a big budget don't like rule changes. With steady rules they'll always make (at least) a good car after some time. When rules change - it's a chance for some that are behind (Honda-Brawn, Red Bull, even Toyota and Williams in 2009). Ferrari and McLaren lost the most then.
Also more rules in general aren't good for teams like Ferrari and McLaren. Why? They have money, good (and many) engineers so it would be easier for them to be well ahead.

ncrypted said:
I forget the exact figures, but an F1 car makes a Hummer look like the environmentally sensitive choice.
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I think I read somewhere that when you drive F1 car like a normal car (low rpm) it is very efficient (for an over 700 bhp car of course).

edit:
As for KERS. Mike Gascoyne said they will have adjustable rear wing from the beginning of the season, but no KERS. They think it still will not give any advantage in a quali and not that big in a race. When they'll start using KERS it will be from Renault.
 
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In my opinion, the biggest limiting factor to overtaking atm in F1 is rev-limiters. As the engine can't rev higher than 18,000, and the teams set there gearing up to hit this at the fastest spot anyway, these gimicks like KERS and the wing won't be enough, because the car overtaking will just hit his limiter. They just cannot get past the car infront with this limiter, and i dont really see teams getting around this with higher gears, as you just lose too much in normal-running speed to be useful
 
settler said:
I don't agree. Big teams with a big budget don't like rule changes. With steady rules they'll always make (at least) a good car after some time. When rules change - it's a chance for some that are behind (Honda-Brawn, Red Bull, even Toyota and Williams in 2009). Ferrari and McLaren lost the most then.
Also more rules in general aren't good for teams like Ferrari and McLaren. Why? They have money, good (and many) engineers so it would be easier for them to be well ahead.



I think I read somewhere that when you drive F1 car like a normal car (low rpm) it is very efficient (for an over 700 bhp car of course).

edit:
As for KERS. Mike Gascoyne said they will have adjustable rear wing from the beginning of the season, but no KERS. They think it still will not give any advantage in a quali and not that big in a race. When they'll start using KERS it will be from Renault.
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Cosworth said sometime over the season that F1 engines are more efficient than a Prius because of how fuel they use with the amount of drag and downforce they create.
 
settler said:
I think I read somewhere that when you drive F1 car like a normal car (low rpm) it is very efficient (for an over 700 bhp car of course).
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That's very true. I mean, when you look at it, the current F1 engines are producing in the neighborhood of 720hp from 2.4l of displacement, which makes about 300hp/l. That's freakin' amazing. Granted they're using an oversquare stroke and 18k RPM to achieve that figure, but still...in the words of one Mr. Joseph Dirt...daaaaaang! Also, if you look at the efficiencies of the engine, the F1 2.4l V-8 achieves about 30% greater efficiency at turning fuel into horsepower than a typical road car's engine. Truly amazing!

But the MPG figures suck. An F1 car gets approx. 3.92 US MPG (4.72 Imp.). A Hummer H2 gets about 9 MPG US. (Depending on who was doing the testing it ranged as high as 11.)

F1technical.net has an awesome article on F1 engines (it was the source of most of my numbers). I'm really excited for when they announce the regs for the 2013 engines when rumor has it they're going to be re-introducing turbocharging.
 
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ncrypted said:
That's very true. I mean, when you look at it, the current F1 engines are producing in the neighborhood of 720hp from 2.4l of displacement, which makes about 300hp/l. That's freakin' amazing. Granted they're using an oversquare stroke and 18k RPM to achieve that figure, but still...in the words of one Mr. Joseph Dirt...daaaaaang!
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They also fall apart after about 2,000 km or so... But yes, they're amazing things. Designed very specifically for their job. If you hooked them up to your regular road car, it probably wouldn't move at all.

Anyway back on topic of the rules for 2011, doesn't anyone else find it quite arbitrary that you need to be within 1 second of the leading car to use the rear wing's moving flap? 1 second is a tiny gap in F1 and cars rarely follow each other at that gap, specially in the leading places. Something like 5 seconds would make much more sense. Although to be fair scrapping the whole movable rear wing would make a lot of sense, too.
 
The entire movable rear wing regulation is bizarre to me. Only within one second of the car ahead, and then only in certain areas of the track?!?!? I think this silliness going to vanish almost immediately unless someone finds a way to really exploit it.

I just wonder what the hell they were thinking...Jim Hall's Chaparral? Not even close...
 
If they stuck another ECU for eco driving in the engine instead of super performance, they would as mentioned become super efficient.
 
ncrypted said:
That's very true. I mean, when you look at it, the current F1 engines are producing in the neighborhood of 720hp from 2.4l of displacement, which makes about 300hp/l. That's freakin' amazing. Granted they're using an oversquare stroke and 18k RPM to achieve that figure, but still...in the words of one Mr. Joseph Dirt...daaaaaang! Also, if you look at the efficiencies of the engine, the F1 2.4l V-8 achieves about 30% greater efficiency at turning fuel into horsepower than a typical road car's engine. Truly amazing!

But the MPG figures suck. An F1 car gets approx. 3.92 US MPG (4.72 Imp.). A Hummer H2 gets about 9 MPG US. (Depending on who was doing the testing it ranged as high as 11.)

F1technical.net has an awesome article on F1 engines (it was the source of most of my numbers). I'm really excited for when they announce the regs for the 2013 engines when rumor has it they're going to be re-introducing turbocharging.
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They already have. See the technical developments thread. And the numbers suck. :(
 
The driver adjustable front wing is now deleted from the rules and instead the rear wing is now driver adjustable. This is because the expected benefit of greater front wing angle never provided the driver with more grip when following another car. The front flap adjustment was much more a solution to tune the cars handling in between pitstops. The TWG found that the loss of drag from the rear wing was a more effective solution to allow the following to overtake. Now the rear wing flap can pivot near its rear most point and open the slot gap from 10-15mm to up to 50mm. Opening this gap unloads the flap and reduced both downforce and drag.
This being controlled by the timing gap to the car ahead and managed by the FIA. So there?s two ways the driver can use the system. Firstly in free practice and qualifying the rear wing is solely at the control of the driver. They can adjust the wing at any point on the track and any number of times per lap. So for the ideal lap time, as soon as the car is no longer downforce dependant (straights and fast curves) the driver can operate the wing, just as they did with the F-duct. Although a small complication to the driving process, at least their hands remain on the wheel and not on a duct to the side of the cockpit.
Then in the race the wing cannot be adjusted for two laps, then race control will send signals to the driver via the steering wheel, such that when they?re 1s or less behind another car at a designated point on the circuit, the rear wing can be trimmed out. The wing returns to the original setting as soon as the brakes are touched.
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:wall::-?:shakefist:
 
Who comes up with these things?
Right now the gaps between the cars are measured at the end of the sectors.. are they going to add more sensors or are these the ones that count?
 
mpicco said:
Right now the gaps between the cars are measured at the end of the sectors..
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No they aren't. During the 2010 season I've noticed that gaps were updated very often. Check tv coverage if you want to know how big is the distance between measuring points. Somewhere I read that it will be measured at these points.

Also there is tracker, but I don't know if it's accurate enough.

Edit:
I've just found that there about 45 sensors on every track.
 
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mpicco said:
Who comes up with these things?
Right now the gaps between the cars are measured at the end of the sectors.. are they going to add more sensors or are these the ones that count?
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if one is in the pits, they often show a map of the track with the position of the opponents, and that's pretty accurate!

doesn't an F1 car have a GPS module?
 
ahpadt said:
As none of us are engineers in here, I think it's best to stick with something more 'basic'. :)
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I believe there are several engineers on this site and some may visit this section, I am a studying engineer and will most likely read through those and try to understand them.
 
ahpadt said:
As none of us are engineers in here, I think it's best to stick with something more 'basic'. :)
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I am 1 semester away from graduating

The more technical, the better! :)
 
As expected. Rule changes aren't that significant and if the base is good there is no reason to make a completely new car. I wouldn't be surprised if Ferrari and McL (or even more "old" teams) will do the same.
 
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