5 freedoms you'd lose in health care reform

[Plissken]

So Doctors are disallowed - who then decides - Politicians?

How many dead people then because of them?

"Why settle for millions when you can have... billions?" *raises pinkie to mouth*

 

[nomix]

So Doctors are disallowed - who then decides - Politicians?

How many dead people then because of them?

You don't. You guarantee the right of every citizen to purchase health insurance. If no one wants to insure them, the government should make a public option available. In the end, it will lead to cheaper insurance from the private providers, and coverage for more people.

I'm not saying doctors don't sit on those panels. I'm saying that participating in a system that effectively leaves people without coverage is deeply imorral.

 

[GRtak]

So Doctors are disallowed - who then decides - Politicians?

How many dead people then because of them?

Bean counters.


And I don't think it will lead to cheaper insurance from private companies. You are mandated to buy insurance so they can bump the normal premiums up a bit without worry of loosing any customers.

 

[mpicco]

I love these "I don't want Obama to shove his idea of what healthcare should be down my throat", when the current US system started when Nixon did exactly that.

But anyway I hope for the best for our american friends, although I don't know much about the subject, I hear horror stories about the US system and how you can end up with a pile of bills just for injuring yourself while vacationing there... Makes me not wanna go to be honest, and there are a bunch of places I'd like to visit there.

 

[GRtak]

This is not healthcare, this is corporate welfare. If they wanted to give every American healthcare all they needed to do was remove the age limits from Medicare.

 

[IceBone]

I thought it was the family who decided whether to end their loved one's suffering, the whole point was to just have the option of it.

 

[nomix]

This is not healthcare, this is corporate welfare. If they wanted to give every American healthcare all they needed to do was remove the age limits from Medicare.

Fuck yeah.

 

[katwalk]

Bean counters.


And I don't think it will lead to cheaper insurance from private companies. You are mandated to buy insurance so they can bump the normal premiums up a bit without worry of loosing any customers.

My mother could afford private health care before they mandated it here, now she has to be on the state one because the rates on the private one went up. We are low income, if we were medium income and she didn't qualify for the poor person insurance she would be utterly fucked.

 

[DNRClothing]

Australia has something like obamas plan, and it works VERY well, Its just that americans want to profit from the sick, so this is a good way to do it, by keeping them sick

 

[katwalk]

Australia has something like obamas plan, and it works VERY well, Its just that americans want to profit from the sick, so this is a good way to do it, by keeping them sick

And my state has something similar to obamas plan, it doesn't.
I am sick and poor so I would know these things.

 

[tigger]

And my state has something similar to obamas plan, it doesn't.
I am sick and poor so I would know these things.

There are some structural similarities, but also quite a few differences between the MA Healthcare Reform and the Affordable Care Act. And the federal will supersede MA law. For example, unless you've got a policy that was "grandfathered" in, you will no longer have to pay copays or deductibles for a bunch of general tests and "preventive services". Premiums for lower income individuals will be much more heavily subsidized. Those within 150% of the poverty level pay 2-4% of their premiums, those within 400% pay 4-9.8% of their premium (while MA doesn't subsidize coverage for those above 300%).

Of course the problem is still cost, no matter who is paying for it. The Affordable Care Act (and I think the MA Law) require that insurers spend 80-85% of your premium on actual health services. But there is no cap on premiums. And the MA Law hasn't caused premiums to shoot up; they're going up for everyone. I think the average increase is over 10% a year now and it's much higher in some places. This law is better than nothing, but it still needs a government alternative, even if that's just letting individuals buy into Medicare. That would be a whole lot cheaper than even the most basic private plans.

 

[nomix]

10 percent? TEN?

Fucking aye..

 

[Cobol74]

What I would have done is packaged up people by SS number into lots say 500,000. Get the care providers to bid for the business from the Government, that is how much they want to get paid by the government. There of course be a set of targets that have to be met and if they are not - fine. The healthcare providers would not know the health care history of any of the people so it would be a smoothed out amount. By bundling up and going by say State you could reflect the various state costs - California mucho expensive, Alaska cheapo. ...

What do you think?

Also - could get Government bonuses by outcomes too. Death rates drop, average age of death goes up, lower Cancer rates not in remission etc. ...

Funded out of say a National Premium payable by each and every person across the country at a set rate that pays for the whole shebang, you do not need to pay anything extra, you can if you wish to get better 'Hotel' accomadation in hospital.

What do you think chaps? You need treatment you get it.

 

[tigger]

10 percent? TEN?

Fucking aye..

That was actually a couple years ago. Just found this article:

According to Hewitt's analysis, the average total health care premium per employee for large companies will be $9,821 in 2011, up from $9,028 in 2010. The amount employees will be asked to contribute toward this cost is $2,209, or 22.5 percent of the total health care premium. This is up 12.4 percent from 2010, when employees contributed $1,966, or 21.8 percent of the total health care premium. Average employee out-of-pocket costs, such as copayments, coinsurance and deductibles, are expected to be $2,177 in 2011?a 12.5 percent increase from 2010 ($1,934). These projections mean that in a decade, total health care premiums will have more than doubled, from $4,083 in 2001 to $9,821 in 2011. Employees' share of medical costs?including employee contributions and out-of-pocket costs?will have more than tripled, from $1,229 in 2001 to $4,386 in 2011.

Looks more like a 12.5% increase this year and that's if you have insurance through a large company (which can of course negotiate lower premiums based on their larger pool of employees).

What do you think chaps? You need treatment you get it.

Doesn't sound too bad. I'd still prefer true universal coverage though, cut out insurance companies entirely (unless someone wanted to supplement their coverage).

 

[Cobol74]

We are going the other way - and you do need to get an incentive to GET YOUR DRUG COSTS DOWN - they are insane!

 

[katwalk]

We are going the other way - and you do need to get an incentive to GET YOUR DRUG COSTS DOWN - they are insane!

my allergy meds (the insurance company list says they are covered, but when you actually buy them they say that they are over the counter versions available that do not exist for that particular drug so they don't cover them) is over 100$. For freaking allergy pills.

 

[Cobol74]

Your drug costs are a fix, someone is taking the piss.

There have been 'Justifications' for it but they are really thin.

 

[British_Rover]

Yeah I think a 10% increase would be the absolute bottom of the increase rate. Just to give you an example when I started working for my company nearly six years ago the insurance premium per week that I paid was 45 or 35 dollars I forget exactly. That was with $3,000 deductible and my employer covering half of that. The health insurance company will find excuses to exclude things from the deductible so that $3,000 was mike like $3,500 or so.

Last year the premium was $90 a week a $4,000 deductible and the company covers 25% of it. This year the premiums are just under a $100 a week and the deductible is the same amount but now their is co-insurance for amounts from $4,000 to $6,000 of 80% or 85% I forget which percent it is for family plans like mine. Basicly instead of covering at 100% above the deductible they will cover that percentage till you go over $6,000 in a year. Now if history is anything to go by that $6,000 will be more like $6,500 or $7,000 in reality.

That is a 100 plus percent increase in just premiums in 6 years not counting the 100% to me increase in deductibles plus the co-insurance. It is insane. The total cost of my health insurance to me andy employer is more then my wife and pay in federal, state, social security and Medicare taxes combined.

 

[tigger]

We are going the other way -

I don't think we should go quite so far as England did, but we need some kind of public option. No matter how "competitive" these exchanges are healthcare premiums are going to continue to explode here.

Your drug costs are a fix, someone is taking the piss.

There have been 'Justifications' for it but they are really thin.

That's the truth. 8 years of ideological Republicans running the FDA didn't help matters at all.

 

[nomix]

Yeah I think a 10% increase would be the absolute bottom of the increase rate. Just to give you an example when I started working for my company nearly six years ago the insurance premium per week that I paid was 45 or 35 dollars I forget exactly. That was with $3,000 deductible and my employer covering half of that. The health insurance company will find excuses to exclude things from the deductible so that $3,000 was mike like $3,500 or so.

Last year the premium was $90 a week a $4,000 deductible and the company covers 25% of it. This year the premiums are just under a $100 a week and the deductible is the same amount but now their is co-insurance for amounts from $4,000 to $6,000 of 80% or 85% I forget which percent it is for family plans like mine. Basicly instead of covering at 100% above the deductible they will cover that percentage till you go over $6,000 in a year. Now if history is anything to go by that $6,000 will be more like $6,500 or $7,000 in reality.

That is a 100 plus percent increase in just premiums in 6 years not counting the 100% to me increase in deductibles plus the co-insurance. It is insane. The total cost of my health insurance to me andy employer is more then my wife and pay in federal, state, social security and Medicare taxes combined.

I'm chaffed to bits I don't have to understand that.

I don't think we should go quite so far as England did, but we need some kind of public option. No matter how "competitive" these exchanges are healthcare premiums are going to continue to explode here.

The only reason they can up the premiums all the time is that it's private highway robbery. If it was federal highway robbery, they would never, ever get away with it. Perhaps the deficit would be declining if the federal government upped the income tax at the same rate.

That's the truth. 8 years of ideological Republicans running the FDA didn't help matters at all.

They're like marxists. Only the other way around. I hate marxists with power.