Land Rover Defender 2015

[Pry]

I like old cars but if new cars can be faster and more comfortable at the same time why couldn't they be better off-road?

 

[Mills]

I'm not digging the front end, too rounded, doesn't seem to mesh with the rest of the squareness. I would have liked to see something more like that old Ford Bronco concept.

 

[argatoga]

As long as they keep it utilitarian and keep the price down I'd be happy. I'd like Land Rover (not Range Rover) to go back to competing against Jeep again. My Discovery had cost about as much as a mid ranged Grand Cherokee when it was new.

 

[WillDAQ]

Except that isn't working for Jaguar either. Sales are reportedly way, way down, more than the economy can account for.

Without knowing how a new model from the old Jaguar 'country cottage on wheels' philosophy would have sold it's hard to make a comparison.

 

[Spectre]

Without knowing how a new model from the old Jaguar 'country cottage on wheels' philosophy would have sold it's hard to make a comparison.

The XF still has yet to surpass the S-Type's sales in a year to year comparison, despite both being sold in some nasty economic conditions and the XF being offered in far more trim and performance levels. The first year of the 'New' XK, the car couldn't even sell as many as the last full year of the XK it replaced.

Don't think the move to the 'new' design language is working.

 

[captain_70s]

I've always considered the Series III to be the ultimate Land Rover anyway, combining the off road ability, cost effective nature and relative simplicity of the machine itself. The Defender improved on the dynamics and with advent of computer integration the 4x4 system in now better but as a working vehicle the SIII remains king of the historic Land Rover vehicles.

I generally live in rural area and Land Rovers are everywhere in various states of repair and use. From the well to do chap who own a considerable amount of land in his new shiney black 110 to the numerous farmers who run about in tatty SIIIs or 1980s Defenders. It barley registers how old most of these Landies are until I spot one with B&W plates and it strikes me many of them are still going strong after 40 years of hard labour.

I for one can not see a farmer going out and buying one of them as a work vehicle, these are the sort of people who spec their cars with steel wheels, they won't want bits of plastic and bizzare styling efforts. They'll want something that looks like it was made out of sheets a square metal, rivited together and given a going over with army surplus paint!
They'll also want the ability to hose down the interior, and they'll want to throw things into it without interior styling motifs breaking off, and at least some will want to bodge the electricals to power a drill or a spot lamp.


To sum up, the Defender isn't broken, it still sells well despite not being cheap and is popular with its customer base, why fix it?

Just more Britain desperately trying to be a modern country to "match the rest of Europe" when in reality most tourists only want to visit Britain to look at the shit it did years ago, (which we are desperately trying to hide/destroy, bye bye Routmaster Bus and FX4 Taxi and red phone boxes, you may have become national symbols and recognised the world over but you don't fit into the picture of modern Britain) and most modern brits like cutesy shops in medieval buildings where they can buy a cup of tea with a hint of Ye Olde Englandshire.

I await the day where Britain is simply an awkward mess where it has a nice modern sheen that is completely unlike what anyone actually expects fom the country misplaced amongst its historic buildings and the waving monarchy as it grinds to halt as a place that is stuck between the image people have of it and the country its people are told to want... Oh wait...

 

[laxmax613]

This is certainly the case for britain and perhaps the parts of Africa where the Land Cruiser hasn't taken a much larger foothold, but I think that the other parts of the world are going to expect something more modern from LR. The LC 70 which is the workhorse in Oz and most of Africa, has integrated hinges, modern headlight assemblies and more features that buyers have cometo expect. The Defender has stayed relavent through parts availabilty and legacy. Yes, it's a good truck, but it's certain that the US market is important to LR and that competing with Toyota needs to start now if LR doesn't want to get permanently sidelined. If LR decides to compete with the FJ, as it looks right now, the game is over. If they try to compete with the Land Cruiser 200, it was over when the Range Rover came out in the 70s. And if they want to forge their own path on the basis of the Defender's place in the market, they will actually succeed. But only if they improve and don't reposition.

 

[Dr_Q]

These April fools jokes really are getting earlier every year. Anyway, I'm off to buy my Christmas tree.

 

[laxmax613]

Luxury, exemplified by the Range Rover, should reach two million units per year globally across the segment by 2017; Leisure, where the Freelander resides, should hit eight million vehicles, while Utility, in which today?s Defender competes, should achieve 3.3 million units.

Where does the Disco fit?

 

[jack_christie]

Where does the Disco fit?

Its actually based on a Disco platform.

 

[laxmax613]

Its actually based on a Disco platform.

No, but in to the brand philosophy of Leisure, Luxury and Utility. Is it a cheaper Range Rover, a big Freelander or a Defender for families?

 

[captain_70s]

I think originally the Disco was supposed to be most of the off-road aspects of a Defender with all the comforts of a family car, not too sure about how the modern version fits in though. The Disco seems to have become a cheap Range Rover for the middle classes to roll around in and the Freelander has taken over the Discos original purpose.

 

[Matt2000]

The Disco seems to have become a cheap Range Rover for the middle classes to roll around in and the Freelander has taken over the Discos original purpose.

That's pretty much it. The Disco was always designed to fill the chasm between the RR and the Defender. It used the same rolling chassis as the RR but had a shorter body allowing it to be almost as good off road as the Defender.

It's much more blurred now but the Disco still sits in the same position, more capable than the Freelander and the Range Rover off road (due to the RR's body overhangs). Having said that the trim levels of the D4 are so high now that people are probably buying them instead of Range Rovers.

This appears to put the Defender above the Freelander, greater off road ability with similar levels of trim.

 

[Andeh]

I think originally the Disco was supposed to be most of the off-road aspects of a Defender with all the comforts of a family car, not too sure about how the modern version fits in though. The Disco seems to have become a cheap Range Rover for the middle classes to roll around in and the Freelander has taken over the Discos original purpose.

That's pretty much it. The Disco was always designed to fill the chasm between the RR and the Defender. It used the same rolling chassis as the RR but had a shorter body allowing it to be almost as good off road as the Defender.

It's much more blurred now but the Disco still sits in the same position, more capable than the Freelander and the Range Rover off road (due to the RR's body overhangs). Having said that the trim levels of the D4 are so high now that people are probably buying them instead of Range Rovers.

This appears to put the Defender above the Freelander, greater off road ability with similar levels of trim.

That's how we've always treated our Disco, a Defender with a little more space and comfort, but similar off-roading capability. While the new Disco (3 & 4) is as captain_70s puts it a cheap(er) Range Rover.

 

[BerserkerCatSplat]

I'm not digging the front end, too rounded, doesn't seem to mesh with the rest of the squareness. I would have liked to see something more like that old Ford Bronco concept.

I'm still annoyed they didn't make at least something based off of that concept. I saw it in person and it was extremely cool.

 

[JipJopJones]

I agree, that bronco concept is beyond cool!

 

[argatoga]

That's pretty much it. The Disco was always designed to fill the chasm between the RR and the Defender. It used the same rolling chassis as the RR but had a shorter body allowing it to be almost as good off road as the Defender.

It's much more blurred now but the Disco still sits in the same position, more capable than the Freelander and the Range Rover off road (due to the RR's body overhangs). Having said that the trim levels of the D4 are so high now that people are probably buying them instead of Range Rovers.

This appears to put the Defender above the Freelander, greater off road ability with similar levels of trim.

The problem is Ford ruined the Disco by moving it too far up market. They need to knock it back down to a Grand Cherokee competitor.

 

[laxmax613]

The problem is Ford ruined the Disco by moving it too far up market. They need to knock it back down to a Grand Cherokee competitor.

Or even lower to a Tahoe competitor.

 

[jack_christie]

Considering how badly LR neglected the Defender, maybe they need a transition or more retro model for starters.

 

[laxmax613]

But that might come with the added negative result of making the truck less practical. that's not good.