Toyota Tundra "quality"

jeffy777 said:
I'd still take a Toyota over just about any American "equivalent".
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For cars I would agree, but for big trucks I don't think so. I do like the titans and the tundras, and for a smaller truck I would want a tacoma(hilux), but I've seen people have problems with the nissan and toyota full size trucks that I haven't seen with any of the domestic trucks. were I in the market for a big full size truck, my money would be going to a big domestic diesel.
 
Toyota, in the US, has never had a reputation for building great full size trucks. Their Tacoma's/smaller pick-ups weren't bad (better than an S10 or ranger, especially when reliability is concerned), but they've never really competed well in the full size class..
 
All I can say is that when I was in a Tundra, the interior felt rubbish. The plastics were rock solid, and the build quality was very unToyota-ish. There is a really big difference in fit and finish between my 93 Tercel and an 01 Sienna.
 
Remember, this is the first year for the "full-sized" Tundra (the last one was 7/8ths scale). They're going to have some teething trouble.... though that tailgate issue looks like someone *really* dropped the ball.

Personally, I like the Titan a lot better than any of the other F-150/1500/half-ton pickups. It's easily as sturdy as an F-150 (class benchmark), but it's so much better in almost every respect. Yeah, the Titan had teething troubles too, but they were all relatively minor - like the Bosch brakes wore out too fast or the Dana rear axle overheated (because Dana told Nissan they didn't need a finned diff cover on that truck - idiots).

I think the big difference is that Nissan went and raided supplier parts bins for what Nissan considered the "best of the best" in each category and then used them on their truck. Toyota seems to have engineered almost all of the new Tundra themselves.
 
We have the same problem here in aus with early versions of the current Landcruiser Prado where the tailgate was cracking at the hinges due to the weight of the spare wheel carrier. Also a recall has just been announced for current Hilux for the same thing but around the bonnet catch.
 
Spectre said:
Remember, this is the first year for the "full-sized" Tundra (the last one was 7/8ths scale). They're going to have some teething trouble.... though that tailgate issue looks like someone *really* dropped the ball.

Personally, I like the Titan a lot better than any of the other F-150/1500/half-ton pickups. It's easily as sturdy as an F-150 (class benchmark), but it's so much better in almost every respect. Yeah, the Titan had teething troubles too, but they were all relatively minor - like the Bosch brakes wore out too fast or the Dana rear axle overheated (because Dana told Nissan they didn't need a finned diff cover on that truck - idiots).

I think the big difference is that Nissan went and raided supplier parts bins for what Nissan considered the "best of the best" in each category and then used them on their truck. Toyota seems to have engineered almost all of the new Tundra themselves.
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Speaking of the Titan's rear end, is it just me or does it and the Armada's diffs look a bit... wimpy?

andyhui01 said:
I just have one question... how do you load a golf cart into a truck? A ramp?
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Most likely. We do it with bikes and quads/atv's all the time. If I actually had anything personally to wheel on a truck like that, I'd like to put air bag suspension on it to be able to drop the bet as low as possible for loading.
 
jeffy777 said:
I have over 100,000 miles on my '04 Sienna and the only maintenance has been oil changes.
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Put about 200k miles on an '81 Chevrolet C10 with just oil changes and a new clutch :p. Personally I think it all comes down to how well you maintain the vehicle.

I can't believe that a fullsize pickup tailgate would fail under such conditions. Even on a Toyota. I've literally had myself and my motorcycle, about 450lbs total, sitting on the tailgate of my brothers S10. C'mon Toyota, it's gotta be bad welds or something.
 
Looks like someones having a little nap in the engineering department. Wakey Wakey fellas
 
Wow - they manage to make door welds seem really ominous. There is always that Mercedes-Benz type risk - they make reliable cars, the get a reputation for it, the cut costs capitalizing on the reputation, lots of people fall for it. Only time will tell.
 
i have loaded a good 600-700lbs of bricks on the tailgate of my truck with out a peep of protest. i will stick to my Ram
 
HuevosRancheros said:
i have loaded a good 600-700lbs of bricks on the tailgate of my truck with out a peep of protest. i will stick to my Ram
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Good move. If people think the Tundra is reliable, then they haven't heard about the Cummins. 8)
 
thedguy said:
Speaking of the Titan's rear end, is it just me or does it and the Armada's diffs look a bit... wimpy?
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I think it may just be you, or rather the massive "look" of the truck on top of it. That rear axle is the latest revision of the venerable Dana 44 rear axle, used in many, many, many domestic half-ton pickups, SUVs, and Vans. At least Nissan had the sense to go with a proven system for their half-ton efforts rather than try to release their own as a starter.

PS: Nissan has a history of releasing the first version of a product with outsourced components of good quality and reputation, then coming up with their own, better components later. A good example was the 84-89 Z31 300ZX - the early turbo models came with ZF power steering lifted straight from the BMW 3-series, the manual transmission was the Borg-Warner T5 out of the Mustang and Camaro, and the fuel injection was a textbook Bosch LH-Jetronic built under license by Hitachi. The transmission was later replaced by a Nissan-built unit of their own design, the power steering became a Nissan/ZF hybrid in the 90 models, and the 90-up cars got a Denso injection system. I'd expect the next version of the Titan/Armada 1/2 ton truck to replace the Bosch brakes, Rancho shocks and Dana axles with something bigger, badder, and stronger built by Nissan.
 
Spectre said:
PS: Nissan has a history of releasing the first version of a product with outsourced components of good quality and reputation, then coming up with their own, better components later. A good example was the 84-89 Z31 300ZX - the early turbo models came with ZF power steering lifted straight from the BMW 3-series, the manual transmission was the Borg-Warner T5 out of the Mustang and Camaro, and the fuel injection was a textbook Bosch LH-Jetronic built under license by Hitachi. The transmission was later replaced by a Nissan-built unit of their own design, the power steering became a Nissan/ZF hybrid in the 90 models, and the 90-up cars got a Denso injection system. I'd expect the next version of the Titan/Armada 1/2 ton truck to replace the Bosch brakes, Rancho shocks and Dana axles with something bigger, badder, and stronger built by Nissan.
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Sort of, the Nissan FW5-71c (MX7 in GM speak) gearbox found in the turbo 300ZX (which also comes in a GM Holden VL Commodore Turbo and RB25DET powered R33 Skyline) many consider to be around equal to a T5. The only problem is they are a huge bloody gearbox. Still they are a massive (thankgod!) stepup from the "small" Nissan gearbox the FS5-71c (again MF5 in GM speak)

Australian 300ZX's ran a Jecs ECCS computer, like the RB engines that where put into local Australian cans (VL and R31), I'm kinda wondering maybe they had some special deal with the cars sold in the US? That particular computer had some changes done to it to drive the multicoil (6x ignition outputs) on the Z31 RB powered 2 litre turbo and the R31 2 litre turbo skyline.

If you look at the way Nissans are put together ect, you'll see a rot from around 1995 onwards. Cheapening up and the like. A simple example is the pivot system on the steering colum on the older cars. In the old days they had a rear pivoting hinge that was built like a brick sh1thouse. Then they changes and put in a crappy piece of bending metal that won't hold anything. Spot welding on later cars sucked one particular S14a I had a look at was terrible with welds not going through the sheet of metal to the next one therefore making the pannel pull away.....do you want me to go on?
 
The US and Canadian ones, at least, had single coil ignition and a Hitachi-built computer.

Over here, where a lot of people are building up their Z31s with stupid levels of boost, the evidence on the transmissions is empirical - the T-5s blow up a LOT sooner than the Nissan ones do under high power and boost.

I agree that after 95 or so, some sort of malaise set in over at Nissan. Not sure exactly why (though there have been lots of theories) but I wouldn't buy any Nissan car (except maybe the Skyline) from 95-2002. Their trucks were pretty good, though.
 
If you want to buy a new full size truck I say go with the new GMT 900 based trucks. Most of the magazines agree that the Silverado and Sierra are class toppers.
 
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