2011 Formula 1 SingTel Singapore Grand Prix

They both had to pit, and Hamilton even got a drive-through penalty. Yet, Hamilton made it to 5th spot while Massa couldn't move up from the middle of the grid. What does that say about their driving skills?

What does it tell me? Well, it tells me that Hamilton has command over less mental faculties than a wheelbarrow full of bricks. Where could he have been without this stupid arse move? If you have the talent to race to 5th after a forced pitstop and a drive-through, why not bloody avoid those in the first place and race to 2nd or 1st? Seriously, he's been racing like a blithering idiot this year and he doesn't even learn from his mistakes. I wouldn't be surprised if McLaren soon starts to pay him in glass marbles and he doesn't even notice. When does this guy finally grow a brain?? Kudos to Massa for slamming his retarded driving.
 
I'll just say the race was boring (needed some rain or something, I expected more wall kissing incidents too I guess) although Schum's half-arsed Webber impression was a little unexpected. Hamilton, brilliant though I think he is needs to do something about his ability to think before he does (if that's even possible) before McLaren lose their patience with him. Not that I'd like to see that at all, the guy is a real racer, very fearless and very talented, shame it often causes so many problems for others, and more importantly, himself.

As for others: Button was as measured as ever, Vettel as untouchable as ever, and Webber as useless at turn 1 as ever, Ferrari as slightly disappointing as ever. YAWN :yawn: Bring on the next race please.
 
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So... Everybody, who thinks that Hamilton will actually see his mistake, learn from this and starts driving with his brain instead with a crow bar, raise your hand.

*crickets*
 
the guy is a real racer, very fearless

Genuine fearless? I'm not so sure. I guess it's pretty confusing for the guy to understand the difference between fearless and brainless maneuvers.
 
The problem is that McLaren is still defending him. Why should the guy think he's wrong if his team defends his antics? Someone should take him aside and tell him that he needs to get his act together. He doesn't seem to cope well with Button beeing equal if not slightly faster at times.
This years tires clearly favour Buttons smoother style over Hamiltons do-or-die style and instead of adapting he's blaming everyone and his dog for his own failures. When it comes to raw skill, Hamilton may well be in a league of very few people with Vettel, Alonso and maybe Rosberg, but he's lacking in other areas. He's no tactician at all. He only knows pedal to the metal and if that doesn't work, he fails. Button outshines him, because he knows when to settle for second or when to grab the car and wring it's neck, like he's shown in Canada and in the closing laps of this grand prix.

I said it before. McLaren made a mistake by plopping the guy right into one of the best cars on the grid. That didn't work too well and they should have known. It all happened before with a guy called Jacques Villeneuve, who went straight into the best car, got a WDC against weak competition and never showed anything worth mentioning after that. All champions since back in the 80's have one thing in common - they started in weaker teams and worked their way up, learning valuable lessons along their way and producing some stellar, unforgettable performances along the way. Senna's wins in a mediocre Lotus, Schumachers debut in the Jordan, Alonso qualifying an abysmal Minardi in the middle of the pack or Vettel's 2008 victory in the Torro Rosso - these are all drives that one remembers and they all learned their trade without the pressure of having to win right from the first race of their career. This is what ruined Hamiltons development IMHO.

It may sound harsh, but I think it would do Hamilton a world of good, if McLaren 'parked' him in a smaller team for a season, so he can learn to drive his car in the middle of the pack without everyone expecting him to win. There's nothing wrong with his natural speed and talent, but when it comes to tactical knowledge and racing with a clear head, he's completely out of his depths at the moment and instead of defending his antics, McLaren should rather help him overcome these problems or they might be wasting the talent of one of the best drivers in F1.
 
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We get the point mate, you hate the guy to the point where your brain boils out of your ear at the sound of his name. Give it a rest, you're just repeating yourself.
 
I'll just say the race was boring (needed some rain or something, I expected more wall kissing incidents too I guess) although Schum's half-arsed Webber impression was a little unexpected. Hamilton, brilliant though I think he is needs to do something about his ability to think before he does (if that's even possible) before McLaren lose their patience with him. Not that I'd like to see that at all, the guy is a real racer, very fearless and very talented, shame it often causes so many problems for others, and more importantly, himself.

As for others: Button was as measured as ever, Vettel as untouchable as ever, and Webber as useless at turn 1 as ever, Ferrari as slightly disappointing as ever. YAWN :yawn: Bring on the next race please.

Button is litterally a cucumber. His little bant with Brundle on his grid walk really made me smile..... 10 minutes before a rather important race and the boy is cracking jokes and more than happy to indulge Mr. Brundle. Button, in my view is a class act, closely followed by Vettel. I say Vettel second because he does have a habit of being annoying when in the car, but out of the car all the interviews I have seen he comes across as a good lad. Sure its been boring to see him ace qualifying and nail start to finish wins, but I cant say he doesnt deserve it. He's playing every hand he's dealt just right.

For me its fitting to see those two at the top of the leader board. They certainly deserve it as does Alonso who's really punted that Ferrari up there.
 
So... Everybody, who thinks that Hamilton will actually see his mistake, learn from this and starts driving with his brain instead with a crow bar, raise your hand.

what mistake? that slightest touch possible in an F1 car? if you go by that, heidfeld, kobayashi and schumacher should be banned from participating. they wreck a front wing every 2 races!

What does it tell me? Well, it tells me that Hamilton has command over less mental faculties than a wheelbarrow full of bricks. Where could he have been without this stupid arse move? If you have the talent to race to 5th after a forced pitstop and a drive-through, why not bloody avoid those in the first place and race to 2nd or 1st? Seriously, he's been racing like a blithering idiot this year and he doesn't even learn from his mistakes. I wouldn't be surprised if McLaren soon starts to pay him in glass marbles and he doesn't even notice. When does this guy finally grow a brain?? Kudos to Massa for slamming his retarded driving.

he's just frustrated as fuck. knowing he's one of the fastest guys, yet every race something happens which places him in a position he can't win anymore, and then he gets reckless.

great move by webber btw. boxing him in was the action that actually ruined hamilton's race..
and even if he got 2 more drive throughs, he still would've made fifth. that's the place for red bull, mclaren, alsonso if sth goes wrong. if all goes well, they're in top 4, if it doesn't go well, they end up 5th...

and i agree, the race was boring as hell!
 
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We get the point mate, you hate the guy to the point where your brain boils out of your ear at the sound of his name. Give it a rest, you're just repeating yourself.

You obviously didn't get the point mate. If I just hated the guy, I'd certainly not spend 10 perfectly usable minutes of my life with writing down what I think could be done to improve his results. He's clearly one of the most naturally gifted people out there and certainly the most entertaining, when he doesn't leave his brains in the pits, but he throws away all that talent with needless shunts. He was clearly faster than Massa and had he waited for the next run through the DRS zone, he'd probably disposed of the Ferrari just as easy as he coasted ahead of Schumacher, but trying that outside move was a needless risk. And I don't think it means hating the guy if one says he's driving quite erratically at the moment. On the contrary, as long as people keep defending his antics, he'll see no reason to change and that may well make Massa's prediction true. As long as he keeps his 2011 attitude, I can not see him win a second WDC, because no matter how good the next McLaren will be, Button will better him on points again, because he doesn't pile his car into the competition at every other race.
 
but trying that outside move was a needless risk.

This interpretation is causing your confusion though. He wasn't trying to overtake Massa around the outside. He got alongside Massa's right on the DRS zone, but it wasn't enough to pull ahead by the turn-in point, so he let Massa turn in to the corner then turned in to fall in behind him. Either he mis-judged how far his front wing sticks out while falling back in behind him on the line or Massa wasn't as early on the throttle as Hamilton expected.
Either way portraying it as utterly reckless is doolally. There are half a dozen more reckless incidents every single race. It's only because it's Hamilton that it gets talked about in this way. Maybe I just missed you ranting about Schumacher's incident?

Hence my reaction to your ranting.

Also as bone said above, although it had big consequences (puncture), the mistake itself was tiny. You're talking about his wing being 6 inches too far forwards and rubbing against a tyre. That's it. Not him hammering into the back of someone at a high closing speed.

Your feelings about Hamilton have clouded your perception, like they have Massa's. He's one of my least favourite drivers out of the car but all this perception that everything he does is dangerous and reckless needs to stop at some point and you need to call it what it is. It was a light rub with the extremities of the wing whilst falling back in line behind another car.
 
Those front wings are wiiiiide! Alot wider than they used to be, I think they are even a couple of centimeters wider than the front tires...
Hamilton isn't the only driver who snaps a wing every now and then. It's amazing how the FIA likes to punish Hamilton for events wich aren't IMO even punisheable.

I am not sure Hamilton deserved a drive through because of the slight touch he had with Massa.
 
ROFL, hamilton fanboys either can't identify, or won't acknowledge what a genuine driving error is.

The stewards have decided fairly already. hamtilon caused an avoidable accident, especially after several reprimands have been issued this year, hence the penalty.

But no.... It's entirely logical for the hamilton fanboys to stick to the usual conclusion of "IT MUST BE A CONSPIRACY FROM THE FIA TO SLOW HAMILTON DOWN!!"

Loads of ex-F1 champs have openly criticise hamilton's brain-fade maneuvers, for good reasons too. Lauda, Stewart etc..

I guess none of these F1 stewards / pundits / champions are the real deal. Maybe I should ask our faithful forum members like GraemeH & -Cpt. J.- for some great F1 insights. Because according to them, it's perfectly okay for a professional racing driver to rub his front wing against the rear tyre of the car in front, during an overtaking maneuvers.

I'm sure all the team managers will agree as well. Because careless driving and bad judgments are the key to success in motorsports.

Maybe, just maybe.... don't you guys think it's more than a coincidence that hamilton is so often involved in accidents / crashes?
 
They've had 3 seasons to get used to the wide front wings. I hate them, but they know where they end by now, it's no excuse.

Close inspection of the first two corners of the race...
TdYXA.jpg
 
i don't think hamilton was still smiling at that point...
 
Don't think the eyes pointing in different directions and silly smile mean "happy"
 
Rumour has it, that Button's contract has already been prolonged... but Hamilton's hasn't.
 
HERP DERP

Whatever that gibberish means, get a language, mate...

GraemeH said:
Your feelings about Hamilton have clouded your perception, like they have Massa's.

Unless you are an accomplished psychoanalyst, you can't know my feelings about Hamilton. And if you are a shrink, you're the worlds most useless member of the trade, because, I actually like the guy. I followed his progress through the junior formulae and he was a welcome breath of fresh air, but in recent years, he's developed an attitude that's counterproductive.

And I'm terribly sorry to disappoint you:
Frothing_at_the_Mouth said:
Maybe I just missed you ranting about Schumacher's incident?
Schumachers move was boneheaded and he rightly so got reprimanded for it, which puts him in the same situation Hamilton is in. Next stupid move will earn him a drive-through, even if it's minor. There's one major difference though - Schumacher admitted to being at fault afterwards, which Lewis sadly failed to do. Just in case you've prepared to play the nationalistic card and meant to insinuate that I dislike Lewis because he's British, you're wrong. My all-time favourite driver is british (and no - it's not Damon Hill. I don't worship the talentless).

Lewis is fun to watch, when he gets his act together. China was a sublime performance. Had he not ruined so many races by stupid-arse moves, we would have seen the fight taken to Vettel. That's what annoys me. He has the talent to challenge Vettel, but he ruins it by slamming his car into other people. People make mistakes, but Lewis makes too many of them and he blames everyone else but himself. That's not what I expect of a champion. I hope he'll do better next year, because German or not, I don't like people coasting to WDC's, I prefer to be properly entertained.
 
Lewis is fun to watch, when he gets his act together. China was a sublime performance. Had he not ruined so many races by stupid-arse moves, we would have seen the fight taken to Vettel. That's what annoys me. He has the talent to challenge Vettel, but he ruins it by slamming his car into other people. People make mistakes, but Lewis makes too many of them and he blames everyone else but himself. That's not what I expect of a champion. I hope he'll do better next year, because German or not, I don't like people coasting to WDC's, I prefer to be properly entertained.

Which is why his recovery drive was good to watch as a spectacle, the way he picked his way around the track. Button did better though, since his brain is working all the time.

As for the pictures, i'll be uploading them soon, right now down with a shitty(harharhar) case of diarrhea, where I can't even fart normally.
 
Whatever that gibberish means, get a language, mate...

It points out the stupidity of me being called a Hamilton fanboy immediately after saying he's one of my least favourite drivers. Calling someone a fanboy because they don't critisize someone is retarded and intellectually dishonest and MadCow ought to be called out on it.
But the way I said it was shorter and sweeter.

Since you didn't actually respond to my point that he wasn't trying to perform a move ("stupid-arse" or not) but just falling back in line behind Massa, there's no more back and forth discussion here since you aren't discussing the incident any more, just general virtiol.
 
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