2014 Formula 1 Season Thread

mercedes removes the engine from the mclaren before it leaves the track
honda can't spy on the engine all that much

mclaren sure will hand them over data though...
 
bone said:
mercedes removes the engine from the mclaren before it leaves the track
honda can't spy on the engine all that much

mclaren sure will hand them over data though...
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Maybe thats why McLaren can't adapt the car to the engine, if they really don't have power units sitting at Woking for them to test and learn about them... But yeah, everything is getting passed on to Honda no doubt about that, it's in their best interest to make sure Honda has as much data as possible for their engine next year.
 
mpicco said:
The thing McLaren fans can be hopeful about is that Honda has had a whole year to spy around and come up with the best engine maybe for 2015, while others, if I understood correctly and this sucks for Ferrari, have their power unit development frozen....
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what's to stop an F1 team from designing a similarly spec'd LMP1 engine?
 
I think McLaren should just go ahead and start making it's own F1 engines, it's as much a gamble as going to Honda, just because it worked for them in the 80s doesn't mean it'll work out for them now and it'll work out with their super car devision to have engines that are designed by the same people who are building their F1 cars.
That said, maybe Honda will be brilliant and apparently McLaren are gearing up to go 'radical' after silverstone so they're all good.
 
jsausley said:
Physics.
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Physics? You're really not up to speed on the current state of affairs at Ferrari and the LMP1 class... Luca has discussed how Ferrari will be looking over the rules and specifications for LMP1, many speculate the reason for this stems from the fact that the current F1 engine spec is nearly ideal for LMP1 application.

I'll give you a moment to justify you're smart-ass remark.
 
mpicco said:
The thing McLaren fans can be hopeful about is that Honda has had a whole year to spy around and come up with the best engine maybe for 2015, while others, if I understood correctly and this sucks for Ferrari, have their power unit development frozen....
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Not nearly completely frozen:
The FIA?s plan for freezing development of the engines calls for 8% of power unit components by weight to be frozen in development by 2015. That will rise to 23% in 2016, 35% in 2018 and 95% the year after that.
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Wow, that didn't look as bad on paper.... Should have an interesting side effect on rear wing stability.
 
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Cellos88GT said:
Physics? You're really not up to speed on the current state of affairs at Ferrari and the LMP1 class... Luca has discussed how Ferrari will be looking over the rules and specifications for LMP1, many speculate the reason for this stems from the fact that the current F1 engine spec is nearly ideal for LMP1 application.

I'll give you a moment to justify you're smart-ass remark.
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In what situation would it be a good idea to put a 1.6L turbo V8 with an operable rev range of 6,000 - 16,000 RPM and a max torque of less than 300 ft-lbs in an LMP1 car? Not to mention a 400km lifespan. They'd need to replace it 13 times during the 24H.

You could possibly convert the engine to an LMP1 spec, but it'd need to be stroked to about twice the capacity and would need a completely new head, new intake/exhaust system to reduce the operable rev range to 2,000 - 9,000 or so where it belongs (in order to get to the 600+ ft-lbs that it'd need to match the Audis), a different turbo system (to encourage lifespan, 3.5 bar would need to drop to 2-2.5 bar with a completely different efficiency map), also likely scrapping the ERS/turbo-exhaust-regen system (because it's designed with 16,000 RPM in mind) or at least heavily redeveloping it... any thing that has been said about interchangeability is just some press terms for the layman to keep that opportunity open. Whatever the F1 engine budget for these turbo powerplants was, redesigning it to work with LMP1 would probably cost at least half as much again, even considering they'd already be started with an engine design that functions.

So, yes. Physics.
 
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They may as well stick some Vuvuzelas on the back of these things. Honestly, it looks like a funnel! If I were an opposing team, I'd build a Spray gun attachment on my car and try to fire hazardous liquids into the back of the merc.

...I think I just invented a new sport.... brb patenting!
 
jsausley said:
In what situation would it be a good idea to put a 1.6L turbo V8 with an operable rev range of 6,000 - 16,000 RPM and a max torque of less than 300 ft-lbs in an LMP1 car? Not to mention a 400km lifespan. They'd need to replace it 13 times during the 24H.

You could possibly convert the engine to an LMP1 spec, but it'd need to be stroked to about twice the capacity and would need a completely new head, new intake/exhaust system to reduce the operable rev range to 2,000 - 9,000 or so where it belongs (in order to get to the 600+ ft-lbs that it'd need to match the Audis), a different turbo system (to encourage lifespan, 3.5 bar would need to drop to 2-2.5 bar with a completely different efficiency map), also likely scrapping the ERS/turbo-exhaust-regen system (because it's designed with 16,000 RPM in mind) or at least heavily redeveloping it... any thing that has been said about interchangeability is just some press terms for the layman to keep that opportunity open. Whatever the F1 engine budget for these turbo powerplants was, redesigning it to work with LMP1 would probably cost at least half as much again, even considering they'd already be started with an engine design that functions.

So, yes. Physics.
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A few things...

-LMP1 spec calls for a max displacement of 2.0L if using a turbocharger.
-The current F1 engines are making ~570 ft.-lbs. (and that's without the addition of the power from ERS)
-The F1 engines while made to rev to 16K, are only being rev'd to 10K due to the fuel flow requirements. Because of that the ERS system could be reused.

I agree that it isn't a direct application but they're close and I would be surprised if technology couldn't be borrowed and used between the two if a simultaneous development was going on.
 
Cellos88GT said:
-LMP1 spec calls for a max displacement of 2.0L if using a turbocharger.
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FYI, that rule is gone, engine capacity and configuration for LMP1 cars is free starting from this year. They do have fuel flow restrictors though, but they have two or three sensors for redundancy, and if all of them fail, the fuel flow sensor module can be changed in about 15 seconds.
 
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vikiradTG2007 said:
FYI, that rule is gone, engine capacity and configuration for LMP1 cars is free starting from this year. They do have fuel flow restrictors though, but they have two or three sensors for redundancy, and if all of them fail, the fuel flow sensor module can be changed in about 15 seconds.
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ahh ok. Do you know what the fuel flow limit is?
 
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