2016 USA Presidential Elections

_HighVoltage_

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"Place is going wild over the vote." He must be imagining things again, just like he claimed he saw thousands of Muslims cheering in New Jersey after 9/11.

Side note: Scottish swear words are amazing.
 

argatoga

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Such sound and brilliant speech in response.
 

nomix

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It's possible to take joy in the simplest of things.

Polls, for instance. They proved to be accurate enough during the primaries, and now they seem to punish mr. Trump for his words. It's taken time to get here, but finally, mr. Trump is being punished by voters for acting the way he is. Superb. He's even slightly weak in Texas in one recent poll. Texas. But that's probably an anomaly. More than 20 straight polls having him behind nationally, though.

Great times. I'm going for a water melon.
 

TC

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Trump is the worst possible choice for president, except for Hillary.
 

nomix

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Mr. Trump is a lot, lot, lot, LOT worse.
 

LeVeL

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Trump is the worst possible choice for president, except for Hillary.
This is spot-on. Trump is terrible, absolutely terrible. But at least he is not a corrupt, lying, stealing, conniving traitor.
 

nomix

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This is spot-on. Trump is terrible, absolutely terrible. But at least he is not a corrupt, lying, stealing, conniving traitor.
For fucks sake. He has never held elected office. But he's still a lying, stealing, conniving fraudster. And while most frontline US politicians are corrupt to a certain degree, Clintons corrupt nature has been so overblown it's laughable. And she's not a traitor, at worst, she's been very stupid over the e-mails.

As for Trump and treachery, again, he has never held elected office. He's never been in charge of serious matters. He hasn't really had the chance. Just let him try. You'll see. Every single piece of information known about mr. Trump indicates he would be an absolute disaster if given any power what-so-ever. He's been disastrous enough as a businessman, please don't give him nukes and an army.
 

LeVeL

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He has never held elected office.
Good.


But he's still a lying...
The first thing that pops into people's heads when they think of Hillary is "liar". Followed by "dishonest", "untrustworthy", and "criminal".


...stealing...
What has Trump stolen? Meanwhile, the Clintons literally stole from the White House.


... conniving fraudster.
Aside from the Trump University crap, how is he even remotely a fraudster?


And while most frontline US politicians are corrupt to a certain degree, Clintons corrupt nature has been so overblown it's laughable.
:roflmao: :roflmao: "OVERBLOWN" :roflmao: :roflmao:


And she's not a traitor, at worst, she's been very stupid over the e-mails.
No, she is a fucking traitor. She knowingly ignored the law and exposed top secret information. It's too bad that the Obama-controlled DoJ won't let the FBI off the leash, nor will they charge her. Lynch is as corrupt as any of them.


He's never been in charge of serious matters.
...
Every single piece of information known about mr. Trump indicates he would be an absolute disaster if given any power what-so-ever.
You're probably right. Still better than Hillary though. By a long shot.


He hasn't really had the chance. Just let him try. You'll see.
I hope we do give him a chance.


He's been disastrous enough as a businessman, please don't give him nukes and an army.
Uhh what? He has been very, very successful. What are you talking about?
 

DanRoM

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Still better than Hillary though. By a long shot.
As far as I can read from your posts, you despise Clinton out of principle because she allegedly broke laws (while in office) and paint her with the term "traitor" because of that. But a traitor is someone who knowingly and with full intend works against his own country and for an enemy. I really don't see that in Clinton's case. So what actual damage to the US has she caused?
 

LeVeL

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As far as I can read from your posts, you despise Clinton out of principle because she allegedly broke laws (while in office) and paint her with the term "traitor" because of that. But a traitor is someone who knowingly and with full intend works against his own country and for an enemy. I really don't see that in Clinton's case. So what actual damage to the US has she caused?
She knowingly violated federal security laws, thus exposing top secret information. This wasn't a little honest mistake with no repercussions - she knew what she was doing when she put the safety of the nation at risk.

The Clinton Foundation also accepted very large donations from other nations while Hillary was SoS, which is out-right corruption bordering on treason. I really dislike Trump and won't vote for him but he is a damn saint compared to that witch Killary.

Oh, and she also hasn't actually accomplished much of anything, while Trump built a worldwide real estate empire.
 

nomix

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The first thing that pops into people's heads when they think of Hillary is "liar". Followed by "dishonest", "untrustworthy", and "criminal".
Yeah. An impressive job's been done to paint her as some despicable figure of evil and lies. It's quite incredible. Not really accurate to that extent, though. Although she's done her share of lying, she's a politician, after all.

What has Trump stolen? Meanwhile, the Clintons literally stole from the White House.
Okay, I'll cede that. he's just run away from bills and local businesses, among other places in Atlantic city.

Aside from the Trump University crap, how is he even remotely a fraudster?
That's plenty. He's allegedly a billionaire, even so he had time to defraud normal working people. Wouldn't trust him with a piggy bank for five minutes.

:roflmao: :roflmao: "OVERBLOWN" :roflmao: :roflmao:
It has. She's been made out as this arch crook, the personification of corruption and dishonesty. And to be honest, she is not.

No, she is a fucking traitor. She knowingly ignored the law and exposed top secret information.
That might be criminal, but it is not treason. That's just pundit bullshit.

It's too bad that the Obama-controlled DoJ won't let the FBI off the leash, nor will they charge her. Lynch is as corrupt as any of them.
Or, perhaps, there's not enough evidence to convict. I've been told every week since perhaps March it's only a matter of time until Clinton is charged. Still hasn't been.

You're probably right. Still better than Hillary though. By a long shot.
He is the most dangerous man ever become a major party candidate for the office of president of the United States of America. He doesn't have the experience to be president. He doesn't have the mental capacity to be president. He doesn't have the psychology to be president. Frankly, his tenure as a businessman prove beyond any doubt that he should never be given any power at all.

He's a de facto racist, his foreign policy sounds like the rejected idea for a ghost written Tom Clancy book in the late 90s. And he's just a very, very nasty guy.

Did I mention he spent a very long time being the poster child of birtherism?


I hope we do give him a chance.
He doesn't even deserve being the nominee.

Uhh what? He has been very, very successful. What are you talking about?
He's been close to personal bankruptcy. Not to mention the bankruptcies his companies have declared. Back in the early 90s, he was put on a tight budget of just 400.000 a month back in those days.

Here's the thing. Mitt Romney screwed common people to make money for his stockholders. At least he did that. Trump didn't do that. He screwed common people, then he didn't pay the small local contractors he'd hired, and when he declared bankruptcies, he screwed his stockholders as well. The only one to come out on top was mr. Trump.

He's what's wrong with capitalism. He's a leech on the backs of common people.
 

Blind_Io

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We don't know because the only people with access to the classified emails she illegally stored are Hillary, the FBI, and whoever managed to get into her server - which could be a very long list.

At a minimum, she is a major security risk. We still don't know everything that was compromised, but we do know she deleted emails. At a minimum, she is very vulnerable to extortion and blackmail while in office. My brother had access to the "Secret" network as part of his job in the Army. If he had done even 10% of what Hillary did with "Top Secret" clearance, my brother would have been in a federal prison before his rank insignia had hit the floor. The only reason this is not the case for HRC is because she is a Clinton.

She has a well-established behavioral pattern of ignoring rules and regulations that are inconvenient. I can't make a clinical diagnosis based on what I read, but it would not surprise me at all if she was an Antisocial Personality (no, not the nanny-state definition of "anti-social" I mean the real, clinical diagnosis). I've worked with APD and NPD before and I can say without hesitation that no one exhibiting these traits to the degree of Hillary Clinton should be allowed within 100 miles of government office or any position of power.
 

nomix

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If anything, the fact she's been through the recent storm, I expect her to tow the line in the future.

And she's not getting away with it because she's a Clinton. She's getting away with it because she was a member of the cabinet.
 

LeVeL

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Yeah. An impressive job's been done to paint her as some despicable figure of evil and lies. It's quite incredible. Not really accurate to that extent, though.
I guess some people can't see the forest for the trees.
 

Blind_Io

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I disagree entirely, so far she has suffered no political consequences, no legal consequences, and has smugly defected or refused to address a growing mountain of evidence. She won't toe the line, if anything, she will be even more brazen in her flaunting of laws and regulations.

Her use of the private email server was a calculated move to subvert US law regarding federal documents, the Federal Records Act. She knew that her emails were subject to the FRA and FOIA and simply refused to comply with the laws and regulations regarding the handling of federal papers. Moreover, she refused to follow the law regarding the handling of Secret and Top Secret documents and has been playing games in the media by saying, "No documents were stamped 'Top Secret'". Of course they fucking weren't, that only happens in the movies! Secret and Top Secret documents aren't scanned in with a big red stamp on them; she's playing games. We know that the entire fucking State department had to disable most of their security just to accommodate Secretary Clinton - and her excuse is that she "didn't want to carry two devices."

Bullshit. She won't even carry her own bags, while in the White House she tried to treat her security detail like bellhops; her excuse is that she won't make her aid carry a Blackberry?

Then we can start looking at the Clinton Foundation slush fund. I can't even begin to scratch the surface of that cesspool, but there is evidence that they accepted donations from Saudi Arabia and arms dealers as defacto brokerage fees for allowing the sales of arms and other material. She was the Secretary of State and accepting illegal political contributions and bribes to grease the rails for foreign powers to acquire US arms and ammunition. That is fucking treason! The Clinton Foundation has also payed out hundreds of thousands of dollars per year to the Clinton's personal political character-assassin who has been in their employ since before Bill got sucked off in the Oval Office. Sidney Blumenthal is the same guy who proposed using photos of Bin Laden's corpse in debt-ceiling negotiations.

She stood in front of a nation while the bodies of our diplomats and security in Benghazi were still warm and said that the attack was the result of a mob angry over a movie; this was a complete fabrication as we now know. In fact, she was so busy trying to spin it to the media that her department was actually delaying rescue efforts. She fabricated a story about taking sniper fire when there is fucking video of her walking out of the plane and being greeted by a child. She has tried to re-write her own history by saying she has "always opposed" the TPP, when she is on-record (and video) supporting it - not only supporting the TPP, she helped negotiate and draft the fucking thing! She has maintained she "took what was offered" for her Wall Street speaking engagements, but we now know that the banks actually negotiated her down from her $300,000 demand for a 20 minute speech - she settled for about a quarter-million dollars, five-star accommodations for her and her entourage, and a private jet no smaller than a Gulf Stream 450 (or larger); oh, and demands that no record other than a single transcript be kept of the speech, which would be handed over only to her and not released. All this while speaking publicly about getting corrupt money out of politics.

Speaking of corruption, she and the DNC had already decided that HRC was going to be the nominee before the first primary. The Gucifer 2.0 hack showed close collusion between the DNC and the HRC campaign.

This is not a single "woopsie" mistake, she has an established behavioral pattern of ignoring rules and regulations, and lying on a grand scale for personal profit.
 

LeVeL

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... her excuse is that she "didn't want to carry two devices."

Bullshit. She won't even carry her own bags, while in the White House she tried to treat her security detail like bellhops; her excuse is that she won't make her aid carry a Blackberry?
Slightly off-topic: I use a pocket holster to carry concealed at work, which means one less pocket to utilize for other things. I hate having anything in my back pants pockets too. In the winter I got by with a jacket or vest with pockets, or a few times I carried inside the waistband and covered the gun with a sweater. Anyways, now that summer is in full swing, I am very short on pocket space. Yet I still manage - I carry my phone and car keys in my hand because I have nowhere else to put them. Yet Hillary Clinton couldn't fit a second device into her purse or handbag? Oh please!


Then we can start looking at the Clinton Foundation slush fund.
Fun fact: I had an internship at the Clinton Foundation back in college. Even in my bottom-feeder position I saw some sketchy stuff. Got a picture with Bill Clinton out of it though :lol:


She has maintained she "took what was offered" for her Wall Street speaking engagements, but we now know that the banks actually negotiated her down from her $300,000 demand for a 20 minute speech - she settled for about a quarter-million dollars, five-star accommodations for her and her entourage, and a private jet no smaller than a Gulf Stream 450 (or larger); oh, and demands that no record other than a single transcript be kept of the speech, which would be handed over only to her and not released. All this while speaking publicly about getting corrupt money out of politics.
That's not true at all! The Clintons were broke! BROKE I TELL YA!
Hillary Clinton said:
...we came out of the White House not only dead broke, but in debt. We had no money when we got there and we struggled to, you know, piece together the resources for mortgages for houses, for Chelsea's education, you know, it was not easy.
:rofl:
 

_HighVoltage_

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I disagree entirely, so far she has suffered no political consequences, no legal consequences, and has smugly defected or refused to address a growing mountain of evidence. She won't toe the line, if anything, she will be even more brazen in her flaunting of laws and regulations.

Her use of the private email server was a calculated move to subvert US law regarding federal documents, the Federal Records Act. She knew that her emails were subject to the FRA and FOIA and simply refused to comply with the laws and regulations regarding the handling of federal papers. Moreover, she refused to follow the law regarding the handling of Secret and Top Secret documents and has been playing games in the media by saying, "No documents were stamped 'Top Secret'". Of course they fucking weren't, that only happens in the movies! Secret and Top Secret documents aren't scanned in with a big red stamp on them; she's playing games. We know that the entire fucking State department had to disable most of their security just to accommodate Secretary Clinton - and her excuse is that she "didn't want to carry two devices."

Bullshit. She won't even carry her own bags, while in the White House she tried to treat her security detail like bellhops; her excuse is that she won't make her aid carry a Blackberry?

Then we can start looking at the Clinton Foundation slush fund. I can't even begin to scratch the surface of that cesspool, but there is evidence that they accepted donations from Saudi Arabia and arms dealers as defacto brokerage fees for allowing the sales of arms and other material. She was the Secretary of State and accepting illegal political contributions and bribes to grease the rails for foreign powers to acquire US arms and ammunition. That is fucking treason! The Clinton Foundation has also payed out hundreds of thousands of dollars per year to the Clinton's personal political character-assassin who has been in their employ since before Bill got sucked off in the Oval Office. Sidney Blumenthal is the same guy who proposed using photos of Bin Laden's corpse in debt-ceiling negotiations.

She stood in front of a nation while the bodies of our diplomats and security in Benghazi were still warm and said that the attack was the result of a mob angry over a movie; this was a complete fabrication as we now know. In fact, she was so busy trying to spin it to the media that her department was actually delaying rescue efforts. She fabricated a story about taking sniper fire when there is fucking video of her walking out of the plane and being greeted by a child. She has tried to re-write her own history by saying she has "always opposed" the TPP, when she is on-record (and video) supporting it - not only supporting the TPP, she helped negotiate and draft the fucking thing! She has maintained she "took what was offered" for her Wall Street speaking engagements, but we now know that the banks actually negotiated her down from her $300,000 demand for a 20 minute speech - she settled for about a quarter-million dollars, five-star accommodations for her and her entourage, and a private jet no smaller than a Gulf Stream 450 (or larger); oh, and demands that no record other than a single transcript be kept of the speech, which would be handed over only to her and not released. All this while speaking publicly about getting corrupt money out of politics.

Speaking of corruption, she and the DNC had already decided that HRC was going to be the nominee before the first primary. The Gucifer 2.0 hack showed close collusion between the DNC and the HRC campaign.

This is not a single "woopsie" mistake, she has an established behavioral pattern of ignoring rules and regulations, and lying on a grand scale for personal profit.
Thank you for the elaboration, Blind. The last time I asked Lev to explain what exactly have been the repercussions or damages from Clinton's mishandling of security documents he ran away saying that I can't be reasoned with, but effectively gave no answer. You at least have a rationale.

However, on your point about her treason in accepting bribes and greasing the rails for foreign powers to obtain US weapons...didn't the great Ronald Reagan illegally sell weapons to Iran, despite the arms embargo? And didn't he fund the mujahidins in Afghanistan, so they could fight the Soviet Union?

As I've said in the past, I am not a fan of Hillary Clinton, but I'm also tired of people calling her traitor. If we are going to do that, we have to admit that Reagan was one too (perhaps even worse than her), and so have many other past presidents, based on the criteria that Clinton is being judged with.

Edit: Back on the topic of Trump, I saw his latest speech regarding the attacks in Istanbul

"As you know we had another suicide bombing, Istanbul, Turkey," he said. "Many, many people killed. Many, many people injured. Folks, there's something going on that's really, really bad. Alright. It's bad. And we better get smart, and we better get tough or we're not going to have much of a country left, OK? It's bad. Terrible."
He said absolutely nothing of substance. Historically, U.S. Presidents have had the power, duty, responsibility to inspire, lead the nation, and shape a path for the future. In times of crisis, they have given hope, inspired courage, and offered reassurance to the people. Basically, they provided a model for the future of socio-political life in America.

And here we have Trump...It's bad. Terrible. We don't know what's happening. Awful. Our leaders are stupid. I will fix this.

Hardly inspiring, motivational, or honorable. I understand that a big part of his appeal is that he is not part of the institution, but if he is going to be elected as President he has to study the history of the U.S. Presidency and understand what the responsibilities of a president are. It's not just about poll numbers or telling people what they want to hear.
 
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Momentum57

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That's not true at all! The Clintons were broke! BROKE I TELL YA!

:rofl:
Iv always had a problem when she said that but not because i think they had alot of money. Dont get me wrong im sure they had enough for the house and Chelsea after the Presidency. Now I believe she knows what its like to look at the bottom line when she was working and Bill was chasing elected office in Arkansas. Im also sure when they left the white house they budgeted and she like all people thought the money would go further. When she says were were almost broke its sounds like me complaining about not having fresh squeezed orange juice in my mimosa while asking for a cig from a homeless person.
 
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