[23x02] June 5th, 2016

[23x02] June 5th, 2016


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gurei17

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Last week I pointed that a bit of hope still remained... Well, while I wasn't totally wrong, the vast majority of people here want CE's head on a plate. Or a kilo of dinamite on his hair.

Either way, I still think they will find their groove somewhere between now and the end of this series, otherwise we're witnessing the end.
 

socorob

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This ep made it all the way up to 2.9/10 on IMDB so far. An improvement over last week already. If they keep up the good work, in a few short episodes it may break into the 3's.
 

lukenwolf

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Last week I pointed that a bit of hope still remained... Well, while I wasn't totally wrong, the vast majority of people here want CE's head on a plate. Or a kilo of dinamite on his hair.

Either way, I still think they will find their groove somewhere between now and the end of this series, otherwise we're witnessing the end.
How is a show supposed to work when the two main presenters quite obviously can't stand each other? If they were brilliant on their own it could perhaps work, but one of them shouts more and louder than a hooligan at Old Trafford and the other one couldn't be more wooden if his name was Pinocchio. It's bound to fail, and nothing screams FAIL like being thrashed in the ratings by Antiques Roadshow.
 

TopGearNorthAmerica

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How is a show supposed to work when the two main presenters quite obviously can't stand each other? If they were brilliant on their own it could perhaps work, but one of them shouts more and louder than a hooligan at Old Trafford and the other one couldn't be more wooden if his name was Pinocchio. It's bound to fail, and nothing screams FAIL like being thrashed in the ratings by Antiques Roadshow.
Um ... Mythbusters? CNN Crossfire? Hello?

One thing to bear in mind: sometimes conflict between presenters actually can actually help the show. If you have people with strong, defensible yet opposing opinions, then getting them to demonstrate their point of view can be TV genius.

One of the reasons why I like the idea of the Guardian's Zoe Williams being on Top Gear is that you can then stage a race between an all-electric "car of the future" and an average unleaded burner like a Ford Mondeo, from London to Zurich nonstop to see which car conks out first. Because in the event that it's the electric, Zoe's reaction would be priceless.
 

Red Falcon

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Um ... Mythbusters? CNN Crossfire? Hello?

One thing to bear in mind: sometimes conflict between presenters actually can actually help the show. If you have people with strong, defensible yet opposing opinions, then getting them to demonstrate their point of view can be TV genius.

One of the reasons why I like the idea of the Guardian's Zoe Williams being on Top Gear is that you can then stage a race between an all-electric "car of the future" and an average unleaded burner like a Ford Mondeo, from London to Zurich nonstop to see which car conks out first. Because in the event that it's the electric, Zoe's reaction would be priceless.
Just a personal opinion, but this realityTV thing of putting people who hate each other together, just to see them tear each other apart for some drama... I hate it. I have to deal with more assholes a day than a proctologist so when I watch TV I prefer to have an atmosphere of friendship going on. Top gear had bickering, yes it did, but the bickering between friends is different from bickering between enemies.

PS: Which is why I barely watch TV. I'm aware 99% of people would find my idea of TV horribly boring.
 
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CrzRsn

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All in all, not bad for only the 2nd ep in the new series. Go back and look at Top Gear S1EP02 before rushing to harsh judgement.
If anyone is going to do this, S02E02 would be more accurate. S01 had Jason Dawe as a presenter; S02 replaced him with James May. That also sets precedent for TG replacing a presenter after the first season...
 
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Four Five Eight

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If anyone is going to do this, S02E02 would be more accurate. S01 had Jason Dawe as a presenter; S02 replaced him with James May. That also sets precedent for TG replacing a presenter after the first season...
Not really, Series 01 was them finding their feet, it's entirely within the realm of possibility that at the end of this series they'll find things to change for the next series. By comparing it with series 2 you're giving them an unfair advantage of having an entire series to make mistakes, they even had 2 pilots to screw up before they went on air. This team as far as we know went straight to air and were expected to not only hit the ground running but perform at a level of a group who had been doing it for 13 years. Not to mention we don't know how many people left and how many people stayed so they have to have time to really gel as a team.
 

CrzRsn

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Not really, Series 01 was them finding their feet, it's entirely within the realm of possibility that at the end of this series they'll find things to change for the next series. By comparing it with series 2 you're giving them an unfair advantage of having an entire series to make mistakes, they even had 2 pilots to screw up before they went on air.
Hold on.... I believe the comment there was to judge the presenters and their team dynamic, in which case S02E02 would be the 2nd episode where CHM were working together as a group.

And please link me to the 2 pilots to which you are referring to. I've never heard of these, and a quick Google/Wikipedia search does not bring up anything.

This team as far as we know went straight to air and were expected to not only hit the ground running but perform at a level of a group who had been doing it for 13 years. Not to mention we don't know how many people left and how many people stayed so they have to have time to really gel as a team.
I don't really see how this is a relevant point. No amount of production staff leaving or staying has any effect on CE, MLB, their presentation style and interaction/chemistry. But since you brought it up, despite the known fact that a lot of the crew followed CHM to Amazon, I'd say the production value really hasn't suffered. The episodes look great and are way better than the first several years of Top Gear. No one really expected these guys to hit the ground running, however I do think people were expecting it to be a little better than it is.
 

socorob

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They have a 13 year old recipe to follow and improve, and they did neither. They turned it from the car is the star (top gear UK, at least the 1st 10 years or so) into Top Gear US (a show about some guys who happen to do stuff in cars). They were handed the formula on a golden platter. Along with the writing, beaker and pinocchio took that golden platter and took a dump on it. The very soul of what the show mainly was is totally missing from these 2 episodes.
 

Four Five Eight

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Hold on.... I believe the comment there was to judge the presenters and their team dynamic, in which case S02E02 would be the 2nd episode where CHM were working together as a group.

And please link me to the 2 pilots to which you are referring to. I've never heard of these, and a quick Google/Wikipedia search does not bring up anything.
https://www.amazon.com/That-Bombshe...dp/140916473X?ie=UTF8&*Version*=1&*entries*=0

This is the first new group of presenters that will host the new show, the reason they had to bring James May in is because after a series of doing the show with Jason it was decided that they needed someone different. You can't compare the 2 because this new group hasn't been given the chance to figure out if they even work as a group. James May was the fix for the original group.


I don't really see how this is a relevant point. No amount of production staff leaving or staying has any effect on CE, MLB, their presentation style and interaction/chemistry. But since you brought it up, despite the known fact that a lot of the crew followed CHM to Amazon, I'd say the production value really hasn't suffered. The episodes look great and are way better than the first several years of Top Gear. No one really expected these guys to hit the ground running, however I do think people were expecting it to be a little better than it is.
It's completely relevant, maybe if you are rooting for the show to fail it isn't but it is. It's not just the shooting but the writing, the planning as well as where the ideas come from. Assuming this isn't a factor just because they still know how to edit and film a car is to show a lack of understanding of how a television show is produced. I think people really did expect them to hit the ground running because if they didn't you'd have seen them give them a bit more slack then immediately saying "It's shit" and "they'll never do this or that" etc. etc.
They put up a bar to compare the show to rather then let it stand on it's own merits.
 
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lukenwolf

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It's completely relevant, maybe if you are rooting for the show to fail it isn't but it is. It's not just the shooting but the writing, the planning as well as where the ideas come from. Assuming this isn't a factor just because they still know how to edit and film a car is to show a lack of understanding of how a television show is produced. I think people really did expect them to hit the ground running because if they didn't you'd have seen them give them a bit more slack then immediately saying "It's shit" and "they'll never do this or that" etc. etc.
They put up a bar to compare the show to rather then let it stand on it's own merits.
Nobody is rooting for it to fail, but the fact remains that they removed the defining element of what made Top Gear so unique. It used to be quintessentially British to the point of exaggeration, and now it features an American and a German with an atrocious accent. Also, it is just too obvious that Evans and LeBland can't stand each other. How is that supposed to work? It's like serving alcohol-free beer. It's fake, doesn't serve its purpose and is all-in-all completely pointless.
 

MacGuffin

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Also, as I have written before, the competence is lost. Clarkson, Hammond and May are journalists who knew what they were doing, saying and writing for the show.

With Evans and LeBlanc I have the nagging feeling they don't have much of a clue and that their texts are being written for them. Whatever they say, reminds me of an amateur actors group.

For instance there was a definite lack of reviewing their cars in the South Africa film. It wasn't a cheap car challenge, mind you, where reviewing is unnecessary. CHM always managed to get their points, opinions and conclusions across. Where was any of that in said film?
 

Four Five Eight

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Nobody is rooting for it to fail, but the fact remains that they removed the defining element of what made Top Gear so unique. It used to be quintessentially British to the point of exaggeration, and now it features an American and a German with an atrocious accent. Also, it is just too obvious that Evans and LeBland can't stand each other. How is that supposed to work? It's like serving alcohol-free beer. It's fake, doesn't serve its purpose and is all-in-all completely pointless.
If you believe that you are either naive or you haven't been reading the comments, there are very much people rooting for Top Gear to fail. And what's with this insistence that they can't stand each other? Because of some scripted banter? As far as I can tell no one except you is saying this so it can't be that obvious.

For instance there was a definite lack of reviewing their cars in the South Africa film. It wasn't a cheap car challenge, mind you, where reviewing is unnecessary. CHM always managed to get their points, opinions and conclusions across. Where was any of that in said film?
Is Richard Porter still with the show? I suspect he's left since he's the sort of person who would have written that stuff into the script. Maybe it just wasn't thought about. Maybe the people who would have pushed for such things left the show or maybe it was shot and wound up on the cutting room floor. It could be any number of things. All I know is that all of the car bore stuff seems to be on Extra Gear and there seems to be a focus on making Top Gear a "Fooling around show"
 
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TopGearNorthAmerica

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Richard Porter did leave the show; however, Alex Renton is still around, being one of the few producers who appeared on screen (among the whitecoats, he's the bald one).
If the BBC management is smart, one of the things they *should* do is re-hire Porter, not as script editor but as a producer. He'd be one of the few who could help Evans and the TG writing staff recapture their focus.

BTW, is Osmin Tymon still with the show? (The guy whom JC punched out)
 

Four Five Eight

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My understanding was that Oisin moved on to another show with the BBC but I don't know for sure. Bringing Porter back could be quite good for the show especially if he's put in a position with some creative control he's been with Top Gear since before Clarkson so he'll bring that certain something to the show that it seems to be needing at the moment.
 

MacGuffin

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...show or maybe it was shot and wound up on the cutting room floor...
I thought of that as well but then I thought about it some more and came to the conclusion that Top Gear might actually be short on filmed material. Maybe what we saw with the McLaren and the Africa film was all they really had after throwing away the unusable material?

Why do I think that, you ask? Simple: Because that is the only logical explanation for the agonizing, 15-minute long SIARXC sectiion. Fifteen bloody minutes. A quarter of the whole episode.
 
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