4cyl 20 valve 1.6....possible?

chaos386

.sa = bad driver!
Joined
Nov 8, 2004
Messages
7,960
Location
Back in Saudia
Car(s)
SEAT Leon FR
I think Toyota did pretty well with the 20v 4A-G. It made around 165~170hp and yes, it's a 4-cyl. There has to be more to vales than just surface area though, because a 3v setup actually has a larger area than a 4v setup, yet 4v is more popular than 3v and generally makes more hp/torque from what I've seen.

Could 4Throttle be the individual throttle bodies? I think the Toyota 20v had those. Supposed to bring even better performance.
 

uncivilised

Member
Joined
Nov 11, 2004
Messages
45
Location
vic, aus
Car(s)
99 Integra Type R JDM
yeah, both 4age "silvertop" and "blacktop" 20v's have 4 individual throttle bodies.
dont go quoting 165-170hp because toyota kinda bumped up the figure. they actually make aprox 110kw at the flywheel (150hp???) accroding to corolla experts.
 

Cubits

Active Member
Joined
Dec 7, 2004
Messages
149
Location
Brisbane, Australia
Car(s)
Peugeot 205 GTI Mi16 + JDM supercharged MR2
The V5 engine IS a V shaped engine, but it's a very narrow V, like the australian commodores v6 (15 degrees i believe). This means no counterweight is required, and it is quite devoid of vibration (smoother than a v6 because of it's inline-ness).

The result is an engine that is narrower than a proper v engine, and shorter than an inline engine.

It was specifically developed to meet size constraints.

The 5 valve head isn't developed to increase the inlet area, it's designed to increase swirl into the chamber. The engine in question is quite a goodun, with individual throttle bodies as standard fit (they smooth the idle and generally make it more driveable). The only downside is the lack of torque.

For the same or possibly less money, you could go with the 4AG-ZE, which is a much better allrounder. The supercharger compliments the twin-cam effect brilliantly (i used to own a mk1 mr2 with this engine), effectively flattening the torque curve and giving you great urge from idle to 7k. It's much more practical than the 20v engine, and faster in most instances. I believe it can also be tuned harder, for less.
 

uncivilised

Member
Joined
Nov 11, 2004
Messages
45
Location
vic, aus
Car(s)
99 Integra Type R JDM
cubits got any pics of ur 205GTI or the engine conversion? sounds good and very different. i havent heard of such a swap. ur car sounds like a real weapon :p
 

chaos386

.sa = bad driver!
Joined
Nov 8, 2004
Messages
7,960
Location
Back in Saudia
Car(s)
SEAT Leon FR
If you like thinking outside the box and have lots of spare time and money, some guy has squeezed an F20C into his AE86. Loads of torque across the whole revrange, and you still have that high-redline and N/A feel to it. Probably not something you'd think about doing, but it's still cool to know what other people have done. :)
 

mr_diss

Active Member
Joined
Mar 4, 2005
Messages
170
Location
'uddersfield
VW DEFINATELY make a V5 engine, it just looks like a V6 with one cylnder lopped off the end. I would guess it needs one camshaft per cylinder bank (like any other engine), so 2 if it was a SOHC or 4 if it was DOHC.

Are they not mounted transversely anyway? So the weight imbalance would be front-back rather than left-right?
 

andyhui01

Forum Addict
Joined
Jun 4, 2004
Messages
8,532
Location
Melbourne, Australia
Car(s)
00' Subaru Forester GT
I don't think a V5 can be a mounted transversely... unless the V is very narrow... like 15degrees or something...
 

Jostyrostelli

Forum Addict
Joined
May 29, 2004
Messages
8,061
^The VR6 and the V5 engines have a very narrow V-shape.
 

Cubits

Active Member
Joined
Dec 7, 2004
Messages
149
Location
Brisbane, Australia
Car(s)
Peugeot 205 GTI Mi16 + JDM supercharged MR2
Hello, did noone read my previous post?! :p
 

Jostyrostelli

Forum Addict
Joined
May 29, 2004
Messages
8,061
^Oops...but Cubits...you need an avatar...it's SO much easier to recognise someone by the avatar!

With an avatar I only have to look at the colors on the left and I know who posted it...there are lots of people without avatars and you're prolly the only one I can name...

Get one! :lol:
 

general

Active Member
Joined
Mar 31, 2005
Messages
219
Location
Shah Alam,Malaysia
toyota has a 20 valve 1.6 I have seen it with my own eyes.I am not sure but then I think it belong to the Levin 1.6 supercharged engine
 

andyhui01

Forum Addict
Joined
Jun 4, 2004
Messages
8,532
Location
Melbourne, Australia
Car(s)
00' Subaru Forester GT
general said:
toyota has a 16 valve 1.6 I have seen it with my own eyes.I am not sure but then I think it belong to the Levin 1.6 supercharged engine

uh... your point is?... we're talking about 20v 4cyl engines... are 16valve 4cyl engines thar rare that you're making a big deal out of it? :mrgreen:
 

aqualung

Member
Joined
Apr 18, 2005
Messages
32
Location
Finland
Car(s)
Audi A6 2.8 quattro -99
I have a longitudally mounted turbocharged 4-cyl inline 20V in my VW Passat, works fine. Yay for 20 valves.

The 2.3 litre VAG VR5 engine has been mounted both longitudally and transverse, as all engines in Golf/Bora (Jetta)/A3/TT are transversely mounted and Passat, A4, A6 and A8 use longitudally mounted engines. The new Passat (2005-) has reverted to transverse engines and the 4WD models use the inferior Haldex system instead of Torsen used in the previous incarnations and current Audis.

I've seen the VR5 featured in Golfs, Boras and Passats, but they haven't been too successful since the I4 20V turbo has the same power, less weight, smaller price and loads of enhancement potential for relatively small money (basic 1.8T 150 bhp 210 Nm chiptunes to 190+ bhp 300 Nm).

[edit]
Found a picture:
otvet-05.jpg
 

Leppy

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 29, 2004
Messages
1,774
Location
Brisbane, Australia.
andyhui01 said:
general said:
toyota has a 16 valve 1.6 I have seen it with my own eyes.I am not sure but then I think it belong to the Levin 1.6 supercharged engine

uh... your point is?... we're talking about 20v 4cyl engines... are 16valve 4cyl engines thar rare that you're making a big deal out of it? :mrgreen:

bit of editting got done...
 

andyhui01

Forum Addict
Joined
Jun 4, 2004
Messages
8,532
Location
Melbourne, Australia
Car(s)
00' Subaru Forester GT
^agualung... that's still considered a V engine?... you might as well call it inline :lol: , btw what are the advantages of 5cyl engines, why not make them 6?
 

aqualung

Member
Joined
Apr 18, 2005
Messages
32
Location
Finland
Car(s)
Audi A6 2.8 quattro -99
andyhui01, it's VR, considered neither an inline nor a V-engine, as the angle is only 15 degrees.
I have no idea why they dropped off one cylinder, perhaps the VR6 was too long for some applications. Can't understand why, though, as the Golf R32 has a proper 6-cylinder fitted and the 3B and 3BG Passats have up to 2.8 l V6 engines. Perhaps the engineers didn't think they could fit a V6 in the Golf/Bora chassis, and later discovered otherwise.

Or maybe... Heard in a final test of a new VR6 engine: "Look, this baby runs allright with just five!"

The advantages and disadvantages of the VR5 are the same as with VR6. Runs smoothly, sounds better than I4 and compared to the I4 1.8T it has no turbo lag. On the flipside it's more expensive to service and it's a bit thirstier too.
Someone put it "All the faults of VR6 without the power".

My choise was clearly the 1.8T, as it's cheaper, lighter and can be tuned way beyond the VR5.
 

andyhui01

Forum Addict
Joined
Jun 4, 2004
Messages
8,532
Location
Melbourne, Australia
Car(s)
00' Subaru Forester GT
plus, by the looks of it, it must be a bitch fixing the VR5 engines, on a normal V6, it is already hard enough, making the angle 15degrees just makes it worst... :lol: .... I'm a fan of 5cyl engines as well, like the Volvo 850 T-5's 5-cyl 20v engine, doesn't have the four-banger sound, has just as little turbo lag as 6-cyl engines which is :thumbsup:
 
Top