Big Test for Jaguar Land Rover Under Indian Owners

Labcoatguy

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Full article here.

One line in the article popped out and worried me.

JLR now finances itself with the $2 billion plus of cash it generates each year. It has paid back its borrowings to Tata and today is propping up the parent company as its core Indian business struggles with sliding sales and market share.

This had better not become the new status quo, as this same thing happened under British Leyland, starving Jaguar of R&D poundage that it desperately needed.
 

Davetouch

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A proper success story - excellent! Indeed though it'd better not go backwards thanks to Tata pulling it down again. If anything lets just hope that Tata can get back on its feet on its own.
 

SpitfireMK461

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If JLR is doing so well, what's the possibility of it becoming independent? I think it certainly deserves it.
 

Davetouch

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Probably good, but then it probably also owes Tata a lot of money for the bailout (not impossible to raise though). The point is that as long as Tata's position is not a threat to JLR's, there is no real benefit from leaving. With Tata they have full reign of everything and get money when [if] required, but yeah if that stops...
 

laxmax613

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Volume sellers under the LR brand, probably not built in Britain. That's what JLR needs to succeed. If the new Defender is robust and utilitarian enough to be a real solution for enterprise as well as for private ownership, it won't matter whether it's built in Solihull, Sao Paulo, St. Louis or Shanghai. If Land Rover can reestablish itself as a brand for commercial vehicles, it can support itself and Jaguar. The Range Rover models will continue to be successful, but, if R&D depends on some other source of income, commercial and volume private Land Rovers are what need to be.
 

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I think it does, even for LR. Obviously for Jag the 'Built in Britain' badge is one of the main reasons they succeed so well, but I would even say that due to the public knowledge connection of JLR being JLR and not separate companies the link is there to stay. The Range Rover is also a big 'Britain' seller and I think the link is there to stay. It doesn't matter what it actually is - if it says Land Rover on it it is supposed to be British and so people may not be so keen on a new Defender if it isn't built here (even if it is designed here).

That said; I'm not sure the Defender can be successful in enterprise. Private ownership is a small and specialised kind of boat where the buyer knows what they want, but business also know what they want and surely it isn't a Defender. The people who want pickup trucks will either want American or Japanese for reliability because they still think we can't make cars, and those who want vans...well they don't want a LR :p
 

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I am happy to see JLR doing well and would love a XF in the future. But quoting the article: "It will make low-emission, 4-cylinder petrol and diesel engines - a sharp contrast from the giant 2.2 liter powerhouse that gives the Jaguar XF luxury saloon its growl. " I almost fell off my chair laughing. What a big engine this 2.2 litre.... tiny in contrast to those puny V8 engines they offer :p
 

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I think it does, even for LR. Obviously for Jag the 'Built in Britain' badge is one of the main reasons they succeed so well, but I would even say that due to the public knowledge connection of JLR being JLR and not separate companies the link is there to stay. The Range Rover is also a big 'Britain' seller and I think the link is there to stay. It doesn't matter what it actually is - if it says Land Rover on it it is supposed to be British and so people may not be so keen on a new Defender if it isn't built here (even if it is designed here).

That said; I'm not sure the Defender can be successful in enterprise. Private ownership is a small and specialised kind of boat where the buyer knows what they want, but business also know what they want and surely it isn't a Defender. The people who want pickup trucks will either want American or Japanese for reliability because they still think we can't make cars, and those who want vans...well they don't want a LR :p


I actually think that volume enterprise models are something that Tata can do well. Indian companies make some pretty robust cheap products meant for their rough and tumble market. Inject some of that into the Defender (and perhaps the Disco) and you'll have a chance to make a seller.
 

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Yeah Tata can do them well; I'm just wondering how this could apply to the Defender. :) I would say that as a vehicle it doesn't cover enough universally to be able to do this; it's not spectacularly cheap, it's not designed for road use too well and not that many people want something that only works brilliantly offroad.

But that doesn't mean it any change - people who think it should remain untouched are wrong - it's been around in basically the same guise since World War Two. You're more than welcome to buy second hand but for the time being it needs updating, and frankly JLR is the only company that can do that currently.
 

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JLR is an asset that TaTa could sell, or float off if they get cash strapped gaining a big profit on the original investment. I agree that there is a place for a cheap LRs and Jaaags in LDC countries but due to costs absolutely not built in Britain - the brand is what would sell it but it must have some of the key brand values of the originals or it just ruins the brand image. So engineering and design input from Britain but built locally.
 

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Full article here.

One line in the article popped out and worried me.

This had better not become the new status quo, as this same thing happened under British Leyland, starving Jaguar of R&D poundage that it desperately needed.

I think the news of Tata's decline is vastly overstated. The Tata conglomerate consists of over 100 companies, hence the risk is well spread. If they were really in trouble they would be better off selling low-revenue high valuation businesses such as hotels etc. than sell off a high revenue high valuation business such as JLR esp. when the going is so good. Remember, JLR is not only bringing in revenues but also tech know-how for their own automotive business (Tata Motors).

I think a lot of the fears regarding Tata are... well just fears. Where are all the analysts who said back then that Tata wouldnt know how to run a luxury business like JLR?
 

marcos_eirik

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I agree that there is a place for a cheap LRs and Jaaags in LDC countries but due to costs absolutely not built in Britain - the brand is what would sell it but it must have some of the key brand values of the originals or it just ruins the brand image. So engineering and design input from Britain but built locally.
Yes, I can't see anything wrong with having the cheapest car in the range built abroad, with the design and R&D as well as the prestige models done in the UK. I for one, think that the DC-100 Defender looks good, modern and utilitarian, yet still giving a nod to the original. If they can make that simple, and erm... reliable, it would be great... :)
 

Davetouch

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Where are all the analysts who said back then that Tata wouldnt know how to run a luxury business like JLR?

The key is that Tata don't run it. :p But yeah they aren't about to chuck away a large investment that is going so well if they were in trouble.
 
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