Chicago 2011: 2012 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 is the fastest, most powerful ever

[edkwon]

I like the upgrades they made to the car, but having sat in them (friends car) and in auto shows, like all the new gen muscle cars, this camaro is just too big and feels huge when you sit inside, nice for the luxury I guess but still feels like your driving a fast boat, compared to the old school 60-70s Camaros that were physically much smaller and almost taut in comparison (granted they had primitive suspension and chassis technology).

Even if they made this new Camaro about new Mustang size that would be ok, but not this 125% photocopied version

 

[smib]

I agree. I would really like to see the next gen Camaro being a bit smaller and lighter, with a lower beltline and smaller pillars so I can actually see out of it.

 

[tigger]

I'm getting bored of this HP war everyone is having. Can we try something different? I'm thinking something lightweight that handles and is just plain fun to drive at legal speeds?

Agreed. I'd rather see a lightweight Z28, with a decent suspension and 350-400hp. The ZL1 is a beast and everything, but it's just a halo car. A proper Z28 would be 20 grand cheaper and make a great DD.

Umm, these are muscle cars though?

Camaro's aren't muscle cars; they're pony cars.

Not that the term really means anything anymore, but still.

I agree. I would really like to see the next gen Camaro being a bit smaller and lighter, with a lower beltline and smaller pillars so I can actually see out of it.

IIRC GM is going to put the Camaro on a smaller chassis for the next generation. But knowing them, that will be 10 years from now.

 

[sonza68]

I like the upgrades they made to the car, but having sat in them (friends car) and in auto shows, like all the new gen muscle cars, this camaro is just too big and feels huge when you sit inside, nice for the luxury I guess but still feels like your driving a fast boat, compared to the old school 60-70s Camaros that were physically much smaller and almost taut in comparison (granted they had primitive suspension and chassis technology).

Even if they made this new Camaro about new Mustang size that would be ok, but not this 125% photocopied version

They don't just feel huge, they are huge. I was shocked when I first saw they weighed as much as my Lincoln (3780 for a V6 Camaro, 3768 for the Mark VIII) and then I started looking at the dimensions. The Camaro is 0.7" wider and 0.6" taller than the Mark VIII, and the wheelbase is only 0.7" shorter. It is 17" shorter overall, but trim the overhangs down and they are really close in size.

 

[jontoad]

i like it. like the old ZL-1 it has real understated looks that could almost pass for a run of the mill camaro.

Still too damn heavy. I wish they would have given it the LS9, but then the price would have been higher (though 638hp justifies 60k in my book).

honestly the LS9's big power difference is the bigger displacement blower. the rest is just durability parts. with the blower cam the LS9 has i think i it would actually be lower hp numbers naturally asperated than the LSA is. remember from the factory they have to build these motors to go around 100,000 miles with all that power.

in conclusion i think if you felt like pushing it you could add the bigger blower of the LS9 powered car and be in the same ballpark of power as the ZR-1 vette.

 

[edkwon]

Camaro's aren't muscle cars; they're pony cars.

What exactly is a Pony car anyway? I thought it was just a term applied to Mustangs because of the horse theme, and otherwise was a throwaway marketing term that didn't mean anything specwise. Not that 'muscle car' is a well defined term either.

 

[Labcoatguy]

What exactly is a Pony car anyway? I thought it was just a term applied to Mustangs because of the horse theme, and otherwise was a throwaway marketing term that didn't mean anything specwise. Not that 'muscle car' is a well defined term either.

Roughly speaking a pony car was a compact car with a midsize car's engine (Mustang, Camaro, Barracuda) while a muscle car was a mid-size car with a full-size car's engine (GTO, Chevelle, and that class). Both were defined by having an engine that "belonged" in a size one step up.

 

[thedguy]

Umm, these are muscle cars though? The whole point is to have as much muscle as possible. Lightweight and handling don't fit into this car class, they never have, and they don't have to. It's like complaining that a minivan doesn't handle well enough, or a supercar lacks fuel economy, it's simply irrelevant.

Well technically it's a pony car. Regardless I was getting more on the point of GM coming out with yet another huge, heavy car.

Seems as though this auto shows news is all about this stuff. I thought we were trying to greener and all that bs? Looks more like they are falling back into that same hole they fell in multiple times before

 

[jontoad]

Seems as though this auto shows news is all about this stuff. I thought we were trying to greener and all that bs? Looks more like they are falling back into that same hole they fell in multiple times before

your mistaken. there is tons of greener cars at the auto show this year. more than ever, just nobody cares about it. doesn't mean people don't buy them, i see more prius cars on the road now than new camaro's around here. they don't get talked about on forums and show up in the headlines like halo cars and muscle cars do.

 

[Initial_B]

well, with the introduction of the Cadillac CTS-V, it was only a matter of time.

 

[_HighVoltage_]

Oh yeah, because 550hp is just the same as 465hp (the new rumored number for the SRT8)

 

[Canuck]

I would argue that cars like the Camaro and Challenger are not pony cars anymore as they're based on full-size car platforms, while only the Mustang has a dedicated platform. I would also argue that terms such as pony car really don't matter anymore (how many new Camaro owners call up their buddies and tell em they just bought a 500hp pony car?).

But then again I get my facts from Wikipedia and my opinions from my ass, so feel free to correct me

 

[argatoga]

Full sized cars where bigger back in the day. The original Falcon was a mid sized American car.

 

[tigger]

@ Canuck

:lol: That's exactly what we're complaining about. These cars shouldn't weigh two tons and have 500hp. If GM wants to build something like that they should bring back the Chevelle.

 

[TC]

@ Canuck

:lol: That's exactly what we're complaining about. These cars shouldn't weigh two tons and have 500hp. If GM wants to build something like that they should bring back the Chevelle.

Welcome to the 21st century. Enjoy your stay.

 

[tigger]

Welcome to the 21st century. Enjoy your stay.

Whatever man. I'm sorry I'm not joining in the circlejerk over this car. The Mustang weighs 400lbs less and there is nothing exotic about it.

 

[jetsetter]

The Camaro in itself is not exotic. The addition of a blown 500+ horsepower V8 certainty does make things interesting however.

 

[TC]

Whatever man. I'm sorry I'm not joining in the circlejerk over this car. The Mustang weighs 400lbs less and there is nothing exotic about it.

Don't be hating. I'm just pointing out that in today's day and age, cars are much much heavier than before. They have more reinforcements, safety equipment, electronics, etc, which results in less room inside. It's just the nature of the beast that they're getting a big porky. Times change.

Plus, the Mustang is still running a solid rear, which takes some weight off. To be honest though, I would take a Mustang GT over the Camaro SS, but I'm interested to see how the suspension and steering improvements have helped with this ZL1 model.

 

[tigger]

Don't be hating. I'm just pointing out that in today's day and age, cars are much much heavier than before. They have more reinforcements, safety equipment, electronics, etc, which results in less room inside. It's just the nature of the beast that they're getting a big porky. Times change.

Plus, the Mustang is still running a solid rear, which takes some weight off. To be honest though, I would take a Mustang GT over the Camaro SS, but I'm interested to see how the suspension and steering improvements have helped with this ZL1 model.

Of course cars are getting heavier; I just see no reason that a Camaro should weigh 2 tons. That's my issue.

And I'd absolutely take a Mustang over a Camaro. I don't know how much bigger brakes and magnetic shocks will help the ZL1. Most of the reviews I've read made it sound like the Camaro (compared to the Mustang anyway) handled poorly.

 

[TC]

Of course cars are getting heavier; I just see no reason that a Camaro should weigh 2 tons. That's my issue.

And I'd absolutely take a Mustang over a Camaro. I don't know how much bigger brakes and magnetic shocks will help the ZL1. Most of the reviews I've read made it sound like the Camaro (compared to the Mustang anyway) handled poorly.

2 tons doesn't seem like much to me, by today's standards. That's what, a few hundred pounds more than a Honda Accord?

But anyway, the Z06 Corvette's ride was considered back breaking by a certain fat British car reviewer, but when the magnetic shock equipped ZR1 was handed to him, those complaints disappeared. I think it will help greatly and the new steering, if GM does it right this time, should tidy things up nicely. That was the biggest issue I read about the Camaro, the turn in wasn't as sharp as the Mustang with the track pack. If GM can nail that down properly and give the magnetic suspension stiff enough settings for track driving, they'll have a winner. In my opinion anyway.