Clarkson bashing the Mustang

Magnet

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* puts popcorn in microwave and waits for arguments to begin
 

zfzfrost

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The only worry is that if I did buy a Mustang, I?d get the car over here and on a wet November night realise that, actually, what I wanted to bring home was San Francisco.

The Mustang, then, is a great car in America. But here you?re better off with a Golf.

looks to me like he liked it, since I live in the bay area.. :)

Actually this article does underscore an interesting phenomenon, it seems to me like Europeans demand much higher quality and upscale cars. and they are very willing to pay the premiums for them..

A Golf GTI at 22,000.00 GBP
United Kingdom Pounds = 39,030.13 USD
United States Dollar

for 40k here you can get a bmw 330i...
 

fbc

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Nothing earth shattering in the article - we know the 'stang's got a solid rear axle, and the handling, brakes, engine, quality etc aren't up to scratch. But despite that the car's got a certain charisma (and good hp/$) - which for some will outweigh the, er, more 'average' parts. I actually think JC went a bit easy on the car.

And it seems we have more information on what TG were doing at Laguna Seca now.
 

flyingfridge

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Heh, perfectly written, and I think he summed up the difference in the continents thinking about cars extremely well. To make my place clear, I think Australia can be categorised somewhere between Europe and America, just far far up the Europe end.
 

Buba

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^^ditto
 

juicebox12

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Yeah, our cars are a bit more efficient than American cars, but we have to learn that a car with a 4L V6 should be able to push out more than 180kW. It's just unfortunate that these cars (Falcon, Commodore) are the stereotypical Aussie car, and there is a stigma associated with 'being un-Australian' if you don't own one.

Give me a 184kW 2.3L turbo anyday over those other engines. I'll be around 5L/100km happier - not to mention the definite acceleration and speed advantages...
 

bihus

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static said:
zfzfrost said:
..for 40k here you can get a bmw 330i...

You can't compare UK and US prices that easily or you'll go wrong.

Exactly...
I don't know if it still happens, but there was a time when it was cheaper to get an european car that was already shipped to the USA shipped back to Europe than buying it here...
 

gtrietsc

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Y'know, a lot of the reason we dont make as much power as we should has to due with our environmental laws. Here in the states, automakers must live up to the CAFE standard, which means that the average fuel economy of all of their vehicles must be a certain number. Cars like the Ford GT obviously bring that number down, and cars like the Focus or Ranger bring it up. The Mustang is a heavy volume seller for Ford, and if they sacrificed any more MPG for HP, it would be difficult to make their CAFE number(which they have a hard time making as is right now.) Remember that we dont have Focus diesels, etc over here.

Oh, and I have another good reason too. If they car made more power, it would be more difficult to insure cheaply, and not as many would be sold. That happens a lot here - the last Cobra was rated at 390HP, even though many dynos say it was more. ;)

Just thought I would offer that different viewpoint.
 

BlaRo

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I just don't see why he didn't like the Solstice. Has he written anything else on it, or did he bash the interior and assumed the rest was equally typical American?

Ironically enough, most American publications swooned over the Mustang; hell, even Car and Driver thought the handling was precise, and they haven't had an American car win a comparison test against imports since the Crimean War. Typical European snobbiness? (Here come the flames...)
 

gtrietsc

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Well, I rarely like anything GM makes, and VERY rarely like anything with the Pontiac badge on it. But I will say the Solstice looks very interesting, until you look at the front. Ick. The Saturn Sky looks better, IMO.
 

94Camaro

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Wow. Bashing not just the Mustang, but bashing America with untrue cheapshots. He loses credibility with the very first sentence. Here is what he thinks is a sportscar:
http://autos.msn.com/research/vip/S...&model=Solstice&trimid=-1&src=VIP&tab=2&sub=0

$19,420

2.4L 177 hp I4

LMAO. How can you possibly ignore all the cars in the past 50 years and come to the Soltice as our first attempt at a sportscar?

The article could have been good if he had just stuck to reviewing the mustang, but no, he had to be a pathetic elitist. The mustang is an average sporty coupe. Once a muscle car like the Camaro/Firebird, but it has always lagged behind. I'm not a fan of the Mustang or was very impressed with its stats. Calling the stang a sports car is a no no.

"Of course, the American way means they?ll never be able to build a sports car"

Corvette or Viper ring a bell?

"How come America?s massive car industry can?t make what is basically beans on toast?"

How many American cars has he actually driven? And watch examples does he have for this statement? Oh yea....the Solstice :lol: :lol:

"If you do encounter someone over there who?s fond of performance cars they?re only really interested in how much g can be generated in the bends"

I've lived in america for 20 years, and I don't know what the **** that is. I'm sure he's been to America, but somehow he's managed to avoid actually talking to any Americans while he was there.

"But by European standards this car is rubbish"

This makes me think that he thinks Europe has a much higher standard. As examples to back this up he compares an average classed Mustang to a Lotus and an Aston Martin? And then back to a Pontiac Solstice. Apparently he's never heard of a fact checker, who would have saved him from humiliation. No such luck for him.


I could go on and on with this. He has some good points, but they are overshadowed by arrogant statements with very little thought, other than pride, put into them. Things said with nothing to back it up.

Brits are a lot smarter than that. This little twirp gives them a bad name.

If this guy said all this in an open forum (not an internet forum), he would be eaten alive.

Oh, and gtrietsc, Cobras are underrated from the factory, always have been. GM underrates as well.
 

zgrabill

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First, a question: where is his review of the Solstice (I suspect the new season may have his review)?

Second, looking at it objectively, how many American-built cars don't have some sort of compromise? Even the Corvette, amazing as it is, has a cheap, plasticky interior, something the Top Gear folks hit on. American engines typically have low volume-to-power ratios (Pontiac's 185 hp, 3.5 liter V6 anyone?) or cheap suspension bits. Ford will pass of its solid rear axel as a tipped-hat to the drag racing crowd, but, even assuming that's at least a little true, I suspect it had mostly to do with money.

If the American car makers want to built a car that does have the word "but" attached to it, then quit compromising. I understand building to a price point, but even some lower priced European cars at least have soft touch plastics.
 

bartboy9891

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^ By sports cars, he means small cheap good handling cars, not performance monsters like the viper. He's driven just about all the major American cars before, so he has basis for his statements. And by european standards, he means cars like the 3-series and A4 which have a high level of attention to detail.
 

94Camaro

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Sorry about my rant. I simply just don't like this Clarkson guy. I like the show, I love cars from all countries, but Clarkson is just an arrogant asshole. There's nothing wrong with making a bad review of an American car if that is your opinion, but the elitist undertones are pathetic. Way to perpetuate stereotypes; Europeans think the U.S. is filled with idiots, Americans think Europeans are filled with snobs who think they're better than everyone else. Let's continue that, Mr. Clarckson :thumbsdown: .
 

BlaRo

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Clarkson likes big, powerful American cars like the Viper and the Corvette, even if he does focus too much on their crappy interiors. He's probably not used to the idea of an American car in the veins of the Miata and the Elise.

I bet if the Solstice was produced by Alfa Romeo or Lotus he would be more forgiving, as would half the people who hate it.
 

patrick10

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zgrabill said:
Ford will pass of its solid rear axel as a tipped-hat to the drag racing crowd, but, even assuming that's at least a little true, I suspect it had mostly to do with money.
the 03 and 04 cobra had irs and so will the new cobra.

it all comes down to price for american cars. you people now living in the states will never realize how cheap american cars are. for example, a stock srt4 has a lsd, 230 hp and runs 13s stock but costs 21,000 usd. this is just in my head but that equals about 13,000 pounds.
 

watto

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patrick10 said:
it all comes down to price for american cars. you people now living in the states will never realize how cheap american cars are. for example, a stock srt4 has a lsd, 230 hp and runs 13s stock but costs 21,000 usd. this is just in my head but that equals about 13,000 pounds.

?11, 805... Dirt f**king cheap.
 

BlaRo

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About as sophisticated as a mine cart, but fast enough that it doesn't matter. That's the beauty of American cars, and that's what Clarkson can't seem to understand.

Edit: On second thought, Clarkson does understand, but a lot of Europeans might not. Though does he have to make such a big deal out of the dashboard materials? Nobody's going to see you whizz by at 150mph going, "yeah, well my instrument faring is 0.15mm thicker!"
 
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