Denmark vs. Islam

swek

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So we can make up for the loss easily eh ? I agree that this whole boycott business is stupid. But if you can get stupid so can I. In a wave of sympathy I only bought Danish products today. This shopuld make up for the loss. :lol:

http://img140.imageshack.**/img140/2743/1103qk.jpg
 

Lilleput

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^^ Hahaha! i love that!


... Wheres the B&O TV / Stereo? :)
 

Firecat

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I really don't think the boycott is stupid. What's stupid are all these papers running to reprint (or print more) of these drawings.
 

Lilleput

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^^ By the reactions and comments i hear i think people are fed up with the middle east, we get bombarded with news from that area always negative - The general feeling is that the Muslims now want to push their belief onto liberal little europe and if we let that happen "they" will just keep infiltrating our lives with their laws, beliefs and norms.

I have to admit that it kind of feels that way sometimes.
 

tloekke

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swek said:
So we can make up for the loss easily eh ? I agree that this whole boycott business is stupid. But if you can get stupid so can I. In a wave of sympathy I only bought Danish products today. This shopuld make up for the loss. :lol:

http://img140.imageshack.**/img140/2743/1103qk.jpg

Swek: You rock!!
 

fluffnik

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Firecat said:
I have a problem with the drawings. This newspaper obviously had an agenda and wanted to incite some kind of negative reaction from the muslim community, otherwise why print them?

The varous cartoons are very different; each is the cartoonist's take on a broad brief.

This, for example,
m7.jpg

lampoons the commission rather than Islam.

How could
m12.jpg
,
with its literary and artistic allusions, offend anyone?

Some of the others may be a little edgier, but so what?

One cannot expect religious freedom unless one is willing to grant it to others - you are as free to call me a godless heathen as I am to describe your faith as delusional - and must accept that others will not, and need not, share your beliefs.

I don't see why anyone should defer to the ignorant superstition or supersticious ignorance of others just because it is dressed up as "Religious Faith".
 

fluffnik

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Firecat said:
I really don't think the boycott is stupid. What's stupid are all these papers running to reprint (or print more) of these drawings.

The boycott is attacking freedom of speech, the papers are asserting it.

I'm off to drink some Carlsberg in the pub...
 

Firecat

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A boycott is a legitimate (and legal) form of protest. The people are asserting their rights as well.
 

zenkidori

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Firecat said:
I really don't think the boycott is stupid. What's stupid are all these papers running to reprint (or print more) of these drawings.
What is stupid is retarded Muslims trying to force thier religion on the rest of the world. You don't like what's printed in a paper? Don't fucking buy it! Now you're going to advocate violence because people are taking a dim view of people who share your belief? I guess you're not so reasonable or smart after all, as you've just lowered yourself down the the level of Osama. Nice. You're actually worse than Justin.

When TV shows make fun of Jesus or Moses, some people get offended. Then they make more shows showing that they have the right to do so, it's FREEDOM OF FUCKING SPEECH AND IF YOU DON'T LIKE THAT YOU CAN GO LIVE IN SOME SHITHOLE SANDBOX WHERE THEY DONT HAVE ANY!

If this was a republican boycott or something liberal, you'd be all, "that's stupid" but because you all pray in the same direction you're all for it. See what I mean in saying you can't be trusted to be reasonable on this subject? Why do Muslims try and force thier religion on everyone else? Other contries have other cultures and your god may be offended by someone, get the fuck over it you stupid ignorant closed minded babies. This is the same thing as some wacko attacking a nation because they are "sinful". We don't all pray to your god or read your stupid book! GET THE FUCK OVER IT!
 

Ultra_Kool_Dude

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My biggest consolation about this whole thing is that free-speech democratic countries have the bigger guns, else we'd probably be forced to obey this garbage.
 

///M

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zenkidori said:
Firecat said:
I really don't think the boycott is stupid. What's stupid are all these papers running to reprint (or print more) of these drawings.
What is stupid is retarded Muslims trying to force thier religion on the rest of the world. You don't like what's printed in a paper? Don't fucking buy it! Now you're going to advocate violence because people are taking a dim view of people who share your belief? I guess you're not so reasonable or smart after all, as you've just lowered yourself down the the level of Osama. Nice. You're actually worse than Justin.

When TV shows make fun of Jesus or Moses, some people get offended. Then they make more shows showing that they have the right to do so, it's FREEDOM OF FUCKING SPEECH AND IF YOU DON'T LIKE THAT YOU CAN GO LIVE IN SOME SHITHOLE SANDBOX WHERE THEY DONT HAVE ANY!

If this was a republican boycott or something liberal, you'd be all, "that's stupid" but because you all pray in the same direction you're all for it. See what I mean in saying you can't be trusted to be reasonable on this subject? Why do Muslims try and force thier religion on everyone else? Other contries have other cultures and your god may be offended by someone, get the fuck over it you stupid ignorant closed minded babies. This is the same thing as some wacko attacking a nation because they are "sinful". We don't all pray to your god or read your stupid book! GET THE FUCK OVER IT!

This isn't about shoving religion down anyone's throat, it's about having some respect and being a responsible journalist. Look at the situation in France. Do you really want those riots to start up again? Which ever way you put it, muslims in Europe aren't getting the fairest treatement, no need to add fuel to the fire. This is the only reason this whole thing exploded. Perhaps the muslims in Europe are making this whole mess bigger than it is by going to the arabs for help, but ignoring why they feel disenfranchised in the first place isn't going to help anyone.

Stop making this an us-them situation.
 

zenkidori

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So don't piss Muslims off because they'll cause trouble if you offend thier religion? Sounds more like strong arm tactics against freedom of speech to me.
 

Firecat

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zenkidori said:
Firecat said:
I really don't think the boycott is stupid. What's stupid are all these papers running to reprint (or print more) of these drawings.
What is stupid is retarded Muslims trying to force thier religion on the rest of the world. You don't like what's printed in a paper? Don't fucking buy it! Now you're going to advocate violence because people are taking a dim view of people who share your belief? I guess you're not so reasonable or smart after all, as you've just lowered yourself down the the level of Osama. Nice. You're actually worse than Justin.

When TV shows make fun of Jesus or Moses, some people get offended. Then they make more shows showing that they have the right to do so, it's FREEDOM OF FUCKING SPEECH AND IF YOU DON'T LIKE THAT YOU CAN GO LIVE IN SOME SHITHOLE SANDBOX WHERE THEY DONT HAVE ANY!

If this was a republican boycott or something liberal, you'd be all, "that's stupid" but because you all pray in the same direction you're all for it. See what I mean in saying you can't be trusted to be reasonable on this subject? Why do Muslims try and force thier religion on everyone else? Other contries have other cultures and your god may be offended by someone, get the fuck over it you stupid ignorant closed minded babies. This is the same thing as some wacko attacking a nation because they are "sinful". We don't all pray to your god or read your stupid book! GET THE FUCK OVER IT!

You really need to relax some. I have the ability to think for myself, and I think i've proved that in a number of threads. There are a number of issues that I fall on a different side of than other muslims (or what is generally thought to be an Islamic view). I am more than capable of keeping my personal religious beliefs from my political beliefs.

You can call me Osama or Justin...or whomever else. But take a look at how I have tried to make my argument and how you have tried to make yours.
 

///M

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zenkidori said:
So don't piss Muslims off because they'll cause trouble if you offend thier religion? Sounds more like strong arm tactics against freedom of speech to me.

Again, you're looking at the effect and ignoring the cause.
 

zenkidori

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The cause would be free speech, and a satirical cartoon, what's wrong with that? Wasn't it them who made it the us v. them situation by soliciting "help" from Muslim countries and taking the position of a vicitimized people? So you are basically saying don't piss anyone off, and don't express ideas in the media? Yeah that's an awesome idea. :roll:

I am more than capable of keeping my personal religious beliefs from my political beliefs.
I really don't think you are.
You can call me Osama or Justin...or whomever else. But take a look at how I have tried to make my argument and how you have tried to make yours.
The fact is you support violence in response to exercising the right of free speech, that's a pretty fucked up position to take. and I said you were WORSE than Justin, I don't think he ever advocated violence against those who do not believe the same as him. My harsh words may have not been the best way to make my point, but the still stand. This is why many people hate Muslims, your own people are responsible.

Again I ask, why are Muslims trying to force thier ideas on other people? It's our/thier right to make satirical cartoons, even ones of religious icons, so deal with it. We do not and will never abide by the laws of Islam, you cannot change that. If you want to live in a place where it is illegal to make fun of your religion, go live in a theocracy state.
 

Firecat

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zenkidori said:
I am more than capable of keeping my personal religious beliefs from my political beliefs.
I really don't think you are.

Well, you know nothing about me and obviously haven't read (or paid attention) to my posts in other threads. If what you think is true, then you probably would have known I was a muslim prior to this thread.


zenkidori said:
You can call me Osama or Justin...or whomever else. But take a look at how I have tried to make my argument and how you have tried to make yours.
The fact is you support violence in response to exercising the right of free speech, that's a pretty fucked up position to take. and I said you were WORSE than Justin, I don't think he ever advocated violence against those who do not believe the same as him. My harsh words may have not been the best way to make my point, but the still stand. This is why many people hate Muslims, your own people are responsible.

Once again. My initial posts were clear. I never said that I was supporting violence "in response to exercising free speech".....I took that position after several other papers decided to make the situation worse (like asking readers to send in their own cartoons). And I stand by that. If they want to perpetuate the problem, then they deserve what they get. The route they should have taken is understanding..not exacerbating an already sensitive issue..they are the civilized ones, right?

Furthermore, in addition to mentioning the laws several of these countries have against "incitement" ...i've also gone over the hpocrisy of the "Free speech" argument because some of these same countries have deported people just for what they say. And some even make "holocaust denial" criminal, how's that for free speech.

zenkidori said:
Again I ask, why are Muslims trying to force thier ideas on other people? It's our/thier right to make satirical cartoons, even ones of religious icons, so deal with it. We do not and will never abide by the laws of Islam, you cannot change that. If you want to live in a place where it is illegal to make fun of your religion, go live in a theocracy state.


Let's be clear. It is western society that has been forcing their ideas on muslims. The problems facing the world today are a direct result of that.

Regarding the printings of these cartoons. It's more about respect than anything else.

The whole thing isn't really a big deal to me, there are greater problems.
 

Firecat

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zenkidori said:
Why can't we be friends? :dunno:

http://img92.imageshack.**/img92/4145/letsbfriends1fg.jpg

Alright. Now, i'll first point out that i'm not in any way offended by this.

However, if I as a friend told you ...hey dude, that picture kinda offends me...could you refrain from doing more. Would you respect that, or deliberately post more and try to get me pissed off...because hey, it's free speech and your right to do so.
 

fluffnik

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Firecat said:
A boycott is a legitimate (and legal) form of protest. The people are asserting their rights as well.

Yup.

Me, I don't buy out of season air-freighted veg.
 

zenkidori

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These crazy people were the ones who even MADE it an issue in the first place, and the made it WORSE by thier own actions. Of course you can see how a paper would be shocked that people were threatening it for printing what it wanted, so what's it to do, back down? Bend under the pressure of violent threats from unreasonable people gone out of thier minds? No. I see printing more as a way of saying, "fuck you" to thier unreasonable demands. This happens all the time, take South Park for example. The church of scientolgy was pissed at them a long time ago, so what did they do? They made an entire episode satirising Scientology, what's wrong with that? It's a way to stand up for your rights and give a big "fuck you and the horse you rode in on" to those who want to pressure people into not criticizing them. Do you think Islam is beyond criticism? A wonderful thing about being in a non-theocracy state is that we don't have to respect the laws of any religion, they can print as many Mohammed cartoons as they want. People weren't just saying, "...hey dude, that picture kinda offends me...could you refrain from doing more?" they were talking about violence before the paper even asked for other cartoons! It's one thing for the Muslim community to come out and say, "we feel this is very disrespectful and we urge those in the Muslim comminty and those who support use to no longer buy this newspaper or it's products", but it's quite another to solicit help from other nations, boycott an entire country and put out death warrants.

Of course I don't think laws against holocaust denial are right, but that isn't the issue.

If a bunch of republicans starting putting out death warrants and screaming for violence against say, the daily show, would you back that up? It's the same thing.
 
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