News: Ferrari F70 - The Enzo successor [LaFerrari]

[Paul_The_Aussie]

I do like it, a lot but something keeps drawing me to the McLaren P1
Nothing wrong with the Ferrari (except the name) just prefer the McLaren.

 

[Aston Martin]

Would I object if someone gave me a LaFer or a P1? No, if it's my money, it's getting spent on the elusive SuperVeyron.

 

[jetsetter]

Remove the stupid hybrid bit and it's perfect.

 

[47]

The name is pretty idiotic, and I'm still a bit indecisive on the styling. It's not gorgeous, but's it's got that hypercar crazy look about it.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

I wonder how close the Enzo would be to 'LaFerrari' (That name is just ridiculous) around Fiorano if it was wearing the same tires? I know it's a short track, but 5 seconds doesn't really seem like the improvement expected with 10 years of development, a much more effective transmission, and an additional 300bhp. I would estimate at least 3 of those seconds are down to the tires alone. The transmission is then probably worth a second of improvement. That leaves the power. 300bhp for a 1 second improvement?

I don't see the point of having more than 700hp in a road car. Honestly, having driven a few cars in the 500whp range, I don't see the point in having a road car with more than 600bhp. Maybe that's just me.

I would be more impressed if the car had exactly the same power as the Enzo and was 5 seconds faster.

 

[jsausley]

Agreed, this should definitely be more than 5 seconds faster than the Enzo given that the 458 was already faster than the Enzo with a measly 562 bhp.

However, seconds on a track are hard to pick up, I wouldn't say that the tires alone are worth 3 seconds unless the Enzo was on street tires and the OoLaLa was on racing slicks. Given Ferrari's history with cheating on road tests, I'm sure they put ALL of their test cars on slicks for their Fiorano times, or at least semi-slick cheater tires akin to Pagani's recent debacle with the Huayra.


Regardless, I mostly agree with your comment about power. The way I see it, about 250-300 wheel torque per axle is the most you can possibly put down on a road tire without some creative wizardry (ahem, GTR) or high speed downforce. I'm very interested to see how both this and the P1 respond to massive throttle input at low speed. :lol:

 

[Cellos88GT]

I wonder how close the Enzo would be to 'LaFerrari' (That name is just ridiculous) around Fiorano if it was wearing the same tires? I know it's a short track, but 5 seconds doesn't really seem like the improvement expected with 10 years of development, a much more effective transmission, and an additional 300bhp. I would estimate at least 3 of those seconds are down to the tires alone. The transmission is then probably worth a second of improvement. That leaves the power. 300bhp for a 1 second improvement?

I don't see the point of having more than 700hp in a road car. Honestly, having driven a few cars in the 500whp range, I don't see the point in having a road car with more than 600bhp. Maybe that's just me.

I would be more impressed if the car had exactly the same power as the Enzo and was 5 seconds faster.

I'm sorry but no. You are simplifying it way to much. If it was a matter of just fitting on larger tires, you don't think Ferrari would've gone ahead and done that? Give me a break.

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Are you possibly the world's biggest fanboy, or can't you simply acknowledge the existence of two fabulous supercars?

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We couldn't tell. Honest.

I can acknowledge it's existence, I just don't care for it. Neither of their cars are interesting to me.

 

[jsausley]

I'm sorry but no. You are simplifying it way to much. If it was a matter of just fitting on larger tires, you don't think Ferrari would've gone ahead and done that? Give me a break.

It has nothing to do with size. The Enzo went into production in 2002. In the early 2000's most tire manufacturers were bragging about just hitting 1.00g skidpad on a street compound (I believe it was Bridgestone on a GT3 that did it first). Now we have several street compounds out there producing as high as 1.30g. Tire development, in both the internal structures of the tire and much better compounds, has evolved dramatically over the past decade and that is one of the big reasons why so many cars now are much faster than their decade-old counterparts. "Give me a break," as you said.

*EDIT* As an example, don't forget that the Maser MC12 was significantly faster than the Enzo solely because of it's more advanced Pirelli tires. Underneath they were basically the same car.

This is the tire that came on the Fezza: http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Bridgestone&tireModel=Potenza+RE050A+Scuderia

This is the tire that came on the Maser: http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Pirelli&tireModel=P+Zero+Corsa+System

The OoLaLa will probably have something similar to the OE tire on the Huayra, P1 and/or Agera R. Which is basically a modern street slick, which will be much better than either of those for dry grip.

 

[bone]

I can acknowledge it's existence, I just don't care for it. Neither of their cars are interesting to me.

none of the cars fiat makes are to any interest to me either, i don't go bashing them in every single thread...
you're worse than a KKK-member who has seen a black person!

i'm realy expect to hear in a while you came across a ferrari IRL, in all your excitement ran onto the road...
...and got run over by it

 

[Cellos88GT]

It has nothing to do with size. The Enzo went into production in 2002. In the early 2000's most tire manufacturers were bragging about just hitting 1.00g skidpad on a street compound (I believe it was Bridgestone on a GT3 that did it first). Now we have several street compounds out there producing as high as 1.30g. Tire development, in both the internal structures of the tire and much better compounds, has evolved dramatically over the past decade and that is one of the big reasons why so many cars now are much faster than their decade-old counterparts. "Give me a break," as you said.

*EDIT* As an example, don't forget that the Maser MC12 was significantly faster than the Enzo solely because of it's more advanced Pirelli tires. Underneath they were basically the same car.

I don't disagree that tires provide a significant improvement but, I don't believe that it accounts for more than 50% of an improvement, especially in the hypercar realm of automobiles. There many other technologies to consider in this car and I believe they contribute a fairly equal share. To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if it came down more to the dynamic aero.

 

[jsausley]

I don't disagree that tires provide a significant improvement but, I don't believe that it accounts for more than 50% of an improvement, especially in the hypercar realm of automobiles. There many other technologies to consider in this car and I believe they contribute a fairly equal share. To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if it came down more to the dynamic aero.

It makes every bit of that much difference. A good set of tires on a track is worth AT LEAST 3-5 seconds.

See the recent TG test of the Huayra if you don't believe it.

 

[Cellos88GT]

It makes every bit of that much difference. A good set of tires on a track is worth AT LEAST 3-5 seconds.

See the recent TG test of the Huayra if you don't believe it.

Again, if it was JUST the tires, why not remake the Enzo and just throw new tires on it if it were that simple?

 

[ALXBWSCREW]

It makes every bit of that much difference. A good set of tires on a track is worth AT LEAST 3-5 seconds.

See the recent TG test of the Huayra if you don't believe it.

No, they are not. Especially around a short track like Fiorano. And also remember that, as with everything, the gap decreases between tyres as you climb further up the scale of their performance.

 

[jsausley]

No, they are not. Especially around a short track like Fiorano. And also remember that, as with everything, the gap decreases between tyres as you climb further up the scale of their performance.

Do you do any track driving? Tires are THE most important factor of your car and the difference from one set to another at the limit is huge. I guarantee you could take a set of the most modern and advanced road legal semi-slicks (a Trofeo, Sport Cup, Proxes or similar) and throw them on a sports car, even a hypercar, from the early 2000's and pick up 3-5 seconds a lap over that same car on it's OEM tire. I don't have any way of proving that claim as I am not a millionaire with access to a Ferrari Enzo, but trust me.

 

[ALXBWSCREW]

Do you do any track driving?

Regular driver in the national karting championship so yeah...more than most of you

Tires are THE most important factor of your car and the difference from one set to another at the limit is huge. I guarantee you could take a set of the most modern and advanced road legal semi-slicks (a Trofeo, Sport Cup, Proxes or similar) and throw them on a sports car, even a hypercar, from the early 2000's and pick up 3-5 seconds a lap over that same car on it's OEM tire. I don't have any way of proving that claim as I am not a millionaire with access to a Ferrari Enzo, but trust me.

Oh and I am pretty sure we are talking about rubbish OEM tires with the Ferrari Enzo here. But yeah since you're telling me that with so much passion I am going to believe you :lol:.

 

[Eunos_Cosmo]

Quick search of Ferrari Chat. This is from an Enzo owner (I believe).

Very nice information.

However, it must be pointed out that both the F430 Scuderia and F360 Stradale come with DOT race compound tires, while the Enzo/599/F430 use conventional street tires. I have tested one of the best street tires (Michelin PS2) and the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup (race tire), and the Cup gives a 1 second faster lap on a 60 secs course.

The times from the FXX are due to racing slicks. An Enzo on the same slicks would drop at least 3 seconds at Fiorano.

I think that a regular F430 with the Pirelli Corsa race tires from the Stradale/Scuderia would drop another 1.3 secs at Fiorano.

That post was made 5 years ago, and tire tech has advanced quite a bit even since then.

 

[chaos386]

Again, if it was JUST the tires, why not remake the Enzo and just throw new tires on it if it were that simple?

FFS, he said three of the five seconds, not all five. Take off your goddamn fanboy glasses for a while...

 

[Cellos88GT]

FFS, he said three of the five seconds, not all five. Take off your goddamn fanboy glasses for a while...

He said "AT LEAST 3-5 seconds." not sure how that translates to 3 out of 5...

 

[jsausley]

He said "AT LEAST 3-5 seconds." not sure how that translates to 3 out of 5...

I said 3-5 seconds on a typical lap. That doesn't mean 3-5 seconds at Fiorano. Fiorano would be closer to 3 seconds, a track like VIR which is 3.2 miles would be closer to 5 seconds.

 

[NRento]

As long as the tyres are black and round who cares. When you think of the lines the Mac is the most smooth design here and my money would go that way. On the other hand I kind of understand some of the features of the Lalala. For excempel the huge front lip will generate a lot of downforce and to be honest, after while it's not that bad. I would say more of a BadAss