I want a manual!

prizrak

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The rear seats look a lot like the rear seats in a 997. They're usable - fine for stuff and short trips. Not great for long trips, but workable if needed. FWIW, the back of the seats in the 997 cab have a concave shape those don't have, and that shape worsens the comfort level.
It highly depends on how tall the driver is, in this car (and most others) I would have to put my seat all the way back and there is no room for legs judging by the first picture. I had the same problem in the A4, no one but REALLY short (we are talking 5'2" max) could seat behind me with any level of comfort.
 

equiraptor

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It highly depends on how tall the driver is, in this car (and most others) I would have to put my seat all the way back and there is no room for legs judging by the first picture. I had the same problem in the A4, no one but REALLY short (we are talking 5'2" max) could seat behind me with any level of comfort.
Um, so? I never said "The back seats will always be useful and comfortable for rear passengers." I said (in summary), "If they're like the 997 seats, they're useable, but not great." You said they're useless, which is wrong. Even with a tall driver, the passenger side rear seat can still carry a person, and a rear area that can hold items is still more useful than no rear area at all.

The back seats are horrible compared to a 5 series. They're fantastic compared to an MR-S. If you're looking for a practical four seater, this isn't the car. If you're looking for a fun 2-seater with some extra practicality thrown in (mediocre rear seats, real trunk space, etc.), it's the right direction.
 
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WDWBen

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Have you tested out a MINI Cooper S yet? I know it was thrown out there, but I didn't (in my quick browsing) see any reaction to it on your part. I highly recommend them, especially the '08 and newer models because they're turbocharged rather than supercharged. Transmission is a six speed, and it's slick (thank you BMW for that). Plus, I'm averaging 35mpg in mine, even with some... erm... spirited driving... on some Connecticut backroads.
 

prizrak

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Um, so? I never said "The back seats will always be useful and comfortable for rear passengers." I said (in summary), "If they're like the 997 seats, they're useable, but not great." You said they're useless, which is wrong. Even with a tall driver, the passenger side rear seat can still carry a person, and a rear area that can hold items is still more useful than no rear area at all.

The back seats are horrible compared to a 5 series. They're fantastic compared to an MR-S. If you're looking for a practical four seater, this isn't the car. If you're looking for a fun 2-seater with some extra practicality thrown in (mediocre rear seats, real trunk space, etc.), it's the right direction.
The seats are useless for passangers with a driver of average height for an american, having extra cargo space was not really what I was talking about, that space could have been there without the seat. I wouldn't call those seats mediocre I would call them horrible, they look like there is less space than a 240sx and that won't fit anyone I know since I don't know any leg amputees.
 

thevictor390

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The Mini is just outside of my budget for a late-model low mileage example. The only reason I considered (am considering?) the Veloster is because despite being over budget it would be brand new. BMW maintenance costs don't help.

I do like it, there are just other cars I like more :)
 

WDWBen

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You'd be quite surprised. I can actually comfortably in the back seat of my MINI, and trust me, that doesn't look large at all!
 

equiraptor

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The seats are useless for passangers with a driver of average height for an american
As I've said before, my comparisons are based on the 997, but based on those, you are wrong. I've been in the back seat of a 997, behind the driver, with a male of average height for the driver (I'm actually taller than average height for a woman in the US). However, it depends on inseam more than actual height, for the driver, and that still doesn't' render the passenger seat unusable for a passenger. Neither of us actually know, either way, until the car is actually available.

But, hey, if you call something useless, clearly it is, no matter what other uses it might have.
 
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WDWBen

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That's a shame; I got mine for $21,000, and it even had the LSD. Fantastic little car. But I recommend a hot hatch. Utility plus mileage plus fun is nearly unbeatable for the price.
 

thevictor390

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That's a shame; I got mine for $21,000, and it even had the LSD. Fantastic little car. But I recommend a hot hatch. Utility plus mileage plus fun is nearly unbeatable for the price.

Let me put it this way. If I wanted, really wanted a Mini, I could swing it. I'm willing to spend a little more for the perfect car. While the Mini is a good car, maybe even a great one, it's not my "perfect" car. Right now that spot is reserved for an RX-8 R3 in blue.

There are so many cars that look interesting that aren't out yet, too.... Dodge Dart has potential on an Alfa platform, Fiat 500 Abarth is hilarious in a good way, Scion FR-S is shaping up to be a pure driver's car... but my general preference is to buy something a couple of years old and avoid the off-the-lot depreciation.
 

prizrak

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But, hey, if you call something useless, clearly it is, no matter what other uses it might have.
And if you call something not useless, clearly no one can disagree with you....

I would say that a backSEAT has a very well defined use, if people can't seat in it that makes it somewhat useless don't it.
 

prizrak

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You could still get two children in those seats easily and without complaint.
Look at this picture, it looks like there is no gap between the back of the front seat and the rear seat.
attachment.php
 

ninjacoco

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The less comfortable my passengers are, the less often they'll ask for rides. I'd call that a win.
 

equiraptor

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Look at this picture, it looks like there is no gap between the back of the front seat and the rear seat.
Because the front seat can't move...

I'm actually giving reasons the seats could be useful. You haven't proven those uses impossible for all (or even most); Rather you've just said they're not important or workable to you. So you wouldn't use the rear seats, that's fine, and I never said you should want the car or like the seats.
 
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CAPT_Howdy

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While we're on the subject of rear seats, there are some cars out there where I just cannot understand why they have rear seats.

Chief among those is Aston Martin. I thought the rear seats on the DB7 were bad, but check out the seats in this DBS Volante:


Now most cars with tiny rear seats you can at least throw a briefcase or some luggage on them. Not on the DBS. Unless you have very small children (But not too small because I doubt a child safety seat would fit back there.) the seats are useless. And does anyone want to take bets on how many Aston Martin owners have small children? I wouldn't.
 

prizrak

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The less comfortable my passengers are, the less often they'll ask for rides. I'd call that a win.
With you on that.
Because the front seat can't move...

I'm actually giving reasons the seats could be useful. You haven't proven those uses impossible for all (or even most); Rather you've just said they're not important or workable to you. So you wouldn't use the rear seats, that's fine, and I never said you should want the car or like the seats.
I was talking about ME driving the car (if you look upthread I stated that clearly) I would have to have the seat all the way back as I have yet to drive a car where I did NOT have to have the seat all the way back due to both my height and seating position preference.
Now most cars with tiny rear seats you can at least throw a briefcase or some luggage on them. Not on the DBS. Unless you have very small children (But not too small because I doubt a child safety seat would fit back there.) the seats are useless. And does anyone want to take bets on how many Aston Martin owners have small children? I wouldn't.
You are forgetting anorexic models :) Also if you do have small children and own an Aston I suspect you also can afford a larger (and likely safer) car to drive them in :p That rear center console is a complete killer for any kind of space.
 

argatoga

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While we're on the subject of rear seats, there are some cars out there where I just cannot understand why they have rear seats.

I believe they add the useless rear seats for insurance purposes. Two seaters are seen as more sporty than four seaters and thus cost more to insure.
 

prizrak

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I believe they add the useless rear seats for insurance purposes. Two seaters are seen as more sporty than four seaters and thus cost more to insure.
One would think that the DBS target market would not be hugely price sensitive :p
 
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