Ipod Touch vs. Archos 604 vs. Archos 605

Ipod Touch vs. Archos 604 vs. Archos 605


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73GMCSprint

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When did it become popular to shit on the iPods?

Since some of us have owned multiple brands. I own an iPod and an older Creative player. I'll admit the iPod can do some cool things, but as a MUSIC player, it's crap. Compared to my Creative player (and most other brands for that matter - look it up if you dare, you'll find reputable reviews) the audio quality from the iPod is absolute shit.
 

Lilleput

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Since some of us have owned multiple brands. I own an iPod and an older Creative player. I'll admit the iPod can do some cool things, but as a MUSIC player, it's crap. Compared to my Creative player (and most other brands for that matter - look it up if you dare, you'll find reputable reviews) the audio quality from the iPod is absolute shit.

So you sit on the train listening to your... Creative Player with $3000 Headphones with custom gold plated connectors? Because thats really the only way you can tell a difference in the two. 98% of people wont be able to tell Mp3 from Ogg / Lossless and theres an even smaller difference in the playback of two Audio players..
 

killpanda

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the audio quality from the iPod is absolute shit.

That's bullshit... the Apple earbuds aren't exactly good, but so are the ones bundled with most of music players.


I saw those Archos at a store a few days ago, they look nice but you are not going to put that in your pocket, that's for sure :-D They are huge.

I would get the iPod Touch ;-)
 

chilicoke

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DAPs from Creative and other brands have much more effective (better if you will) equalizer when compared to iPods, this often lead people to believe that iPod have bad sound.

However, if you are using decent headphones, you shouldn't use equalizer in the first place. As most of you probably already known, equalizers boost certain frequencies to usually increase bass and treble, but doing so will cause the overall sound to be unbalanced, usually known within audio communities as "colored" sound.

In high-end audio, equalizer is usually ignored. What you will usually see is simply:
source (CD, record player etc) > interconnect > amp > output (headphones/speakers)

Of course equalizer has its use, it is very useful to covercome your headphones/speakers shortcomings to achieve flat (ideal) sound. But most people just use equalizer to give them enough bass to blow their heads off. :lol:

my point is, iPods have weak equalizer, but it does have very nice sound. Of course which one is best is subjective, if you want you guys can head over to head-fi.org for more information on headphones and sources, and you will notice that many people (when I said many people I don't mean clueless people, but people who are HARDCORE audio nuts) actually use iPods through an external portable amp to drive their high-dollar headphones/earphones.

Pictures of Your Portable Rig [Part IX] at Head-Fi
Part 1 http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=49559
Part 2 http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=106263
Part 3 http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=137206
Part 4 http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=155048
Part 5 http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=171232
Part 6 http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=200547
Part 7 http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=217466
Part 8 http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=240807
 
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Hercules286

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DAPs from Creative and other brands have much more effective (better if you will) equalizer when compared to iPods

I'm not sure how true that statement is. FWIW the EQ on my Zen V is shit. The whole sound quality of the player is surprisingly mediocre and bass is very weak, no matter what you do. My mobile phone has a better EQ.

Now I can't really disagree with you, because I haven't heard an iPod, but my Sony Discman used to sound significantly better, so yeah.

Oh, and the joystick broke in half, but that's completely unrelated.
 

chilicoke

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Actually Sony Discmans are known for their sound quality, especially those that were manufactured between late 80s and early 90s. They are extremely popular among audiophiles for portable use, certain models are worth big bucks. I should know, I collect them:lol:. It's pretty unfair to compare Discmans with current DAPs though, electronics just aren't designed/built like that anymore.
IMG_0088.jpg


Back on topic:

having owned many Creative players, I can definitely say they do have better EQ than iPods, but that's like saying which car has better seat heaters, doesn't make a difference to me because I don't use it.

However instead of providing useful information to help the OP's decision easier, this thread had turned into a huge flame war filled with biased personal opinions.

CBuck03, you should be more specific about what features you are looking for and how you will be use it. Not knowing exactly what you what, I can only suggest to focus on:

As a portable music player:
1. sound quality.
2. portability (size)
3. user interface.

As a portable video player:
1. what video formats does it support.
2. battery life on video playback.
3. are other functions (ex. camera) necessary?

The biggest factor to sound quality are the headphones. If you are comparing sound quality of players with standard earbuds than your argument is moot, what's the point of purchasing the "better sounding player" when you can't even hear the difference? I do not have experience with the new Archos players to comment on its sound, but having extensive experience with many different DAPs, IMO iPods' sound quality are just as good (if not better) than its competitors. Conclusion: the difference is soo small, I would be very impressed if it's noticeable on portable headphoens.
 
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cvrefugee

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I like the iPod Touch but I need 30+ GB to store my music collection. Let me know when they put a 32GB flash drive in there and the price is $200 :)
 

Hercules286

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Actually Sony Discmans are known for their sound quality, especially those that were manufactured between late 80s and early 90s. They are extremely popular among audiophiles for portable use, certain models are worth big bucks. I should know, I collect them:lol:. It's pretty unfair to compare Discmans with current DAPs though, electronics just aren't designed/built like that anymore.

Mine was a 2003 model, I believe. 'twas really nice to listen to, except its output power was pathetic. I kinda miss that piece of overly cheap noisy gray plastic. :(

The biggest factor to sound quality are the headphones. If you are comparing sound quality of players with standard earbuds than your argument is moot, what's the point of purchasing the "better sounding player" when you can't even hear the difference? I do not have experience with the new Archos players to comment on its sound, but having extensive experience with many different DAPs, IMO iPods' sound quality are just as good (if not better) than its competitors. Conclusion: the difference is soo small, I would be very impressed if it's noticeable on portable headphoens.

I'm not sure about that. I mean, if your main problem is frequency response, phase response and distortion, the fault is definitely in your speakers, but if the sound lacks dynamics, you should look at the previous components in your system.
 

chilicoke

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I'm not sure about that. I mean, if your main problem is frequency response, phase response and distortion, the fault is definitely in your speakers, but if the sound lacks dynamics, you should look at the previous components in your system.
I agree completely, I should have been more specific, sorry about that. What I meant to say was, when comparing different sources (in this case, DAPs) sound quality, same output (headphones) should be used, and they can not be the bottleneck. If the players can output sound frequencies your headphones cannot, then the comparison is useless. In order to compare each player's sound quality fairly, higher quality headphones should be used that can revel accurately the sonic difference between each player.

Of course this is going to the extreme, I was simply stating my experience that iPods do sound just as good as other players. Just like Lilleput pointed out earlier, we don't listen to high-dollar headphones on the go.
 

Hercules286

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Of course this is going to the extreme, I was simply stating my experience that iPods do sound just as good as other players. Just like Lilleput pointed out earlier, we don't listen to high-dollar headphones on the go.

I listen* on 35 Euro Sony clip-ons. The difference between sources was fairly audible.

* - or should I say I used to... my rats chewed the cable in half.
 
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CBuck03

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Actually Sony Discmans are known for their sound quality, especially those that were manufactured between late 80s and early 90s. They are extremely popular among audiophiles for portable use, certain models are worth big bucks. I should know, I collect them:lol:. It's pretty unfair to compare Discmans with current DAPs though, electronics just aren't designed/built like that anymore.
IMG_0088.jpg


Back on topic:

having owned many Creative players, I can definitely say they do have better EQ than iPods, but that's like saying which car has better seat heaters, doesn't make a difference to me because I don't use it.

However instead of providing useful information to help the OP's decision easier, this thread had turned into a huge flame war filled with biased personal opinions.

CBuck03, you should be more specific about what features you are looking for and how you will be use it. Not knowing exactly what you what, I can only suggest to focus on:

As a portable music player:
1. sound quality.
2. portability (size)
3. user interface.

As a portable video player:
1. what video formats does it support.
2. battery life on video playback.
3. are other functions (ex. camera) necessary?

The biggest factor to sound quality are the headphones. If you are comparing sound quality of players with standard earbuds than your argument is moot, what's the point of purchasing the "better sounding player" when you can't even hear the difference? I do not have experience with the new Archos players to comment on its sound, but having extensive experience with many different DAPs, IMO iPods' sound quality are just as good (if not better) than its competitors. Conclusion: the difference is soo small, I would be very impressed if it's noticeable on portable headphoens.

I already have an ipod... so im looking to use it for surfing the web and watching videos
 

73GMCSprint

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So you sit on the train listening to your... Creative Player with $3000 Headphones with custom gold plated connectors? Because thats really the only way you can tell a difference in the two. 98% of people wont be able to tell Mp3 from Ogg / Lossless and theres an even smaller difference in the playback of two Audio players..

No. I can easily tell a difference with my $30 headphones, with or without EQ, take your pick. True, if you're sitting on a train/plane/car, you'll probably never tell the difference. If that's where you're always listening, who cares what brand you buy? I'll admit I usually take my ipod in those situations because it is smaller than my old Creative player. I do a LOT of listening at home where it's quiet, and I can't stand to use the ipod there.

That's bullshit... the Apple earbuds aren't exactly good, but so are the ones bundled with most of music players.

When did I ever say the earbuds had anything to do with it? Get any half decent headphones and you'll tell a difference. And I do recommend a headphone upgrade no matter what brand player you buy.
 

chilicoke

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chilicoke - It looks like you have a Cowon A2 and an Ipod Touch.... whats your opinion on the two?:D
IMO it's pretty hard to compare them directly, I bought them for different purpose and they are definitely very different.

The A2 is an excellent video player, it is probably still my favorite even compare to these newer models. some of the main features that caught my attention were native support for both Divx and Xvid video formats, long video playback battery life, and drag-n-drop file transfer. I bought it mostly to watch Top Gear on the go, it's drag-n-drop file structure allows me to drag the video file into the player without any softwares like an external HDD, plus if my friends want a copy of the latest Top Gear, I can just plug it into their computer directly via USB and do whatever transfer I want. It also has other cool features such as TV recording with (included) RCA cables, USB on-the-go etc, but to be honest, I have never used any of those features.

However, there are a few things that kept the A2 from being my audio player. 1. it's bulky size, 2. slow start up time, 3. so-so (decent but no where as easy/fast as iPod's) interface, 4. lack of gapless music playback, and 5. the deal breaker, the faint hiss sound from its headphone output that my Etymotic ER-4S (which are known distinctively known for their detailed sound) constantly picks up. Sound quality wise, it was no match for my Sony Discmans, so it remained strictly as a video player.

IMG_0077.jpg

IMG_0078.jpg

I apologize if it seems like I am re-posting the same pictures from The New Toy thread, but it's pretty much the same topic at 2 different locations.

Touch on the other hand, is very different. I bought the Touch purely as a convenient music player. After years of carrying large portable players (believe it or not, I used to carry one of my Discmans connected to portable headphone amplifier to power my ER-4S), the size of iPod Touch is definitely something I appreciate. What truly sold me on the Touch is it's interface, it is hard describe how easy and efficient its interface is, even web browsing on something this small is incredibly fast and easy, the controls just works. But it is not as feature rich on video playback as the A2, it only handles MP4 video files via iTunes and I would much rather not deal with video conversation, its tiny storage doesn't help either. The Touch works very well for me on school campus, small size, instant start up time, streams YouTube videos, and its fast web browser makes quick web browsing and checking email very easy, now that I have jailbroken (look it up if your unfamiliar) my iPod and installed iPhone apps, it even allows me to check my emails directly through its interface, check Google Map, and even chat on AIM.

Again, two very different animals, but neither of these seems to fit your requirements (Touch's a so-so video player, A2 doesn't have wifi) so we might be back to square one :? :lol: Hope this would be at least some help to your decision.
 

IceBone

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The D2 is where Cowon excells in music reproduction. Go take your fancy schmancy headphones with you to a cowon store and check it out. ;)
 
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