Making a 1080p rip

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Would the 1080i rip be a MKV file ?
 
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I think a lot of these fuzzy PQ issues has to do with the camera lens... and the cameras image processor and such. They may not have the budget for super high quality lenses and cameras you see in big budget movies. Lower bitrate of the streaming video data mentioned above may also have a significant effect on the overall PQ.

I agree, there is even a lot of chromatic aberration around white edges suggesting lower quality camera lenses. The frames that Quiky posted are also indeed quite soft, they almost look upscaled from 720p. This might actually be how it was send from the BBC - This happens quite often in the anime world where encoders get frustrated with upscaled material being advertised as 1080p from broadcasters. The lowering of the bit rate doesn't help either.

One or more of the above factors are contributing to the soft look. I doubt there is any additional information in the 1080i file considering it doesn't have that many additional pixels over 720p anyway...
 
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Hmm, I have two versions and I'm not sure which to use...

Number One

4.44 GB (4,554 MB / 4,664,193 KB / 4,776,133,984 bytes)

Code:
Technical Information
Runtime	1:00:00
Bitrate	9075 kbps
Profile	High@L4.0
	
Resolution	1440x1080 (16:9)
Framerate	25.000 frames/s
Ref. Frames	4
	
Audio	English AC-3 5.1 @ 384kbps
Audio 2	Other MPEG Audio 2.0 @ 256kbps
	
Subtitles
(inbuilt)	None


Notes: The Dolby Digital Audio is 2.0 in a 5.1 container
so I kept the Mpeg layer 2 soundtrack with this too.


Number Two

4.46 GB (4,577 MB / 4,686,921 KB / 4,799,407,820 bytes)

Bigger, but it also contains a BBC HD commercial at the beginning which could entirely make the difference.

Code:
MediaInfo
General
ID                               : 802
Complete name                    : Top.Gear.S14.E01.BBCHD.h264.1080i.English-lcp.ts
Format                           : MPEG-TS
File size                        : 4.47 GiB
Duration                         : 1h 1mn
Overall bit rate                 : 10.4 Mbps

Video
ID                               : 5500 (0x157C)
Menu ID                          : 6940 (0x1B1C)
Format                           : AVC
Format/Info                      : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                   : High@L4.0
Format settings, CABAC           : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames        : 4 frames
Duration                         : 1h 1mn
Bit rate                         : 9 375 Kbps
Width                            : 1 440 pixels
Height                           : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio             : 16/9
Frame rate                       : 25.000 fps
Resolution                       : 24 bits
Colorimetry                      : 4:2:0
Scan type                        : Interlaced
Scan order                       : Top Field First
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)               : 0.241

Audio #1
ID                               : 5501 (0x157D)
Menu ID                          : 6940 (0x1B1C)
Format                           : AC-3
Format/Info                      : Audio Coding 3
Bit rate mode                    : Constant
Bit rate                         : 384 Kbps
Channel(s)                       : 6 channels
Channel positions                : Front: L C R, Surround: L R, LFE
Sampling rate                    : 48.0 KHz
Video delay                      : -1s 51ms
Language                         : English

Audio #2
ID                               : 5502 (0x157E)
Menu ID                          : 6940 (0x1B1C)
Format                           : MPEG Audio
Format version                   : Version 1
Format profile                   : Layer 2
Bit rate mode                    : Constant
Bit rate                         : 256 Kbps
Channel(s)                       : 2 channels
Sampling rate                    : 48.0 KHz
Resolution                       : 16 bits
Video delay                      : -1s 40ms
Language                         : nar



Supposedly the second one is a higher bitrate, but I'm not sure if that's the case or not as I thought a TS was just a direct airing -> file save, no processing done.
 
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I think this pretty much sums it up:

[Thu 01:52:43] <&TechZ> I doubt anyone will notice the 100KB/s diff between the two honestly
[Thu 01:52:47] <&TechZ> They are virtually identical
[Thu 01:53:03] <&TechZ> But they will notice the BBC Ad on one of them
[Thu 01:53:08] <~Viper007Bond> that is true

Going with the first one.
 
Looking at the info i think they've been ripped straight from the dvb signal. The difference in bitrate could be that they aren't absolutely constant so that the point of measurement is different for both files. Another possibility is that the bitrate for the first file doesn't only contain video, perhaps teletext or epg too, you name it.

That they're different in bitrate is probably not true.

If you find out the bitrate of only the video at the same sample of time you should get about the same number for both files.

However, actually saving the stream can be tricky. It's very easily to get loads or errors, but most of these errors don't directly result in a noticeable effect for the video or audio. Video errors like a block artifact appearing or a small drop of audio is the most common if they do.
 
i'm not a very good encoder, i'm still learning. sorry just a little thing to say. if it's hard to put it into 1080 why just convert the 1080i in to mkv and just leaving it on 1080i. 1080i is good if 1080p too hard to hard to make
 
Viper do check if the first one has all the footage. Your info quote says it is 1:00:00 in run time, the 720p release is almost a minute longer.

why would you encode it into mkv if there is already a .ts file already torrented?

In theory ;) the TS file would be insanely huge, for an hour in the region of 8-10GB. For most people that would be too much to download every week.
With such a source you could cut the size by maybe 3 without significant quality losses.

With the BBC HD bit rate cuts that's different, the original broadcast becomes downloadable and the losses from reencoding become larger, even if you reencode to the same target size.
 
tomsmocomp

I'll see what I can do when I get home. Is the torrent for the TS up or would I need to ftp it? I wonder if there's such a thing as unsharpmask in avisynth. *fires up google*
 
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To Viper007Bond,

im new here and i specifically joined because of this discussion and im hoping i can help around and also join the fun of being a Top Gear fan myself.

On your decision of which one to upload, i strongly recommend the 2nd one, why u ask? because asu said that people might find the differece in quality so slightly, why not just uplaod the best possible choice anyways, either way they are both huge files and might take long to download and stuff, plsu there are some who will really appreciate having abit of the begining (before the show starts) and abit fo the ending (after the show's credits).

So please please take this into great consideration, because i think wat im saying makes sense, and as i said i really would like to help out here if i can with this kind fo stuff. You have something very unique and what many people is after, do what is best, and go for the 2nd choice :)
 
How is it going with the encoding?
I would choose the 2. one, it has more kbit/s.
If you need help, I know how to do it with "Megui". If there would be a ts file uploaded or torrented, I could try myself on it.
 
I know this may not contribute much to the encoding discussion, but for those who have PS3's and are able to stream or load media to them, they seem to have a very good software de-interlacer that makes the ts files seem as close as possible to a progressive picture with no apparent side effects (at least I think so :D ).

Give it a go!
 
The 1080i H.264 TS I have is off HDBits. ;)

Oh, god! I lost my account on HDBits after some time of inactivity, god, what a great site!

That's bad news for making a 1080 release with noticeably better quality than the 720p ones. I believe it may not be worth the effort, bandwidth, etc for a few % increase. Shit in, shit out :(

Shit in, shit out, well said

Another idea: just torrent up the 1080i TS and be done with it. Advanced users can do what they want with it, everyone else can stick to the 720p.

Strongly leading towards this option currently.

And I would agree that the raw TS file should do fine for us. However it's 1440 not 1900 ... It's not really 1080i either.
(Can't wait for what I can only assume to be a lesson from narf about 1440 and why it's so prevalent when they quote the size of 1080i. Because I'm sure the 1080i standard reads 1900x1080.)
 
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for those that havent worked it out yet but a bit of this is upscaled SD. As far as i can see the opening credits are still in SD as all the footage the cut up to make them was before they filmed Top Gear in HD. Also all the shots of the boys talking to camera when they are in-car look a bit ropey so i reakon they are upscaled aswell. The latter i am guessing thats just becasue they cant mount a HD camera on the car? But i have to say i dont know much about the actual HD cameras they use to film it so i couldnt really confrm that.

fanny
 
(Can't wait for what I can only assume to be a lesson from narf about 1440 and why it's so prevalent when they quote the size of 1080i. Because I'm sure the 1080i standard reads 1900x1080.)

I think i learnt the lesson from narf (or plissken, who is in the same league knowledge-wise) some months ago in the "Top Gear in HD"-thread: It's a thing called "wide pixels", basically the same an anamorpic lense does in 35mm film: It's a full-frame 4:3 image that's stretched to 16:9, which makes each pixel a bit wider than it's high...
 
1440x1080 is technically anamorphic 1920x1080, this goes exactly for HDV cameras. This is actually very useful because it saves alot of bandwidth by having such a resolution and one can retain better quality by having a slightly higher bitrate.

Almost all TV broadcasts are literally interlace, hence thats where the term 'Video look' opposed to 'Film look' comes in. therefore i am not suprised that the broadcast for Top Gear or any other in the world is 720p OR to benifit those with 'Full HD' 1080i, so u would be getting that full resolution but at a 'video look' that we are all so used to. I dont believe too much in wide pixels except that they will become wide when they are anamorphically stretch correctly.
 
Similar things happen in an old-fashioned DVD (and TV actually). It's resolution is 720x576 (720x480 if you're weird) - pixel AR of 1.25. If it's a full screen DVD it's displayed at 1.33 and one pixel is actually 1.064 times as wide as it is high. If it's a wide screen DVD it's displayed at 1.78 and one pixel is actually 1.424 times as wide as it is high.
 
Regarding the upscaled SD stuff, BBCHD have very strict rules as to how much of a program broadcast in HD may consist of upscaled SD material, and I believe that limit is at around 10%, though it may be lower.

I also don't see why they couldn't mount something like a Canon 7D in the cars for HD incar, but I guess saving the video to storage bigger than a CF card might be a problem there.
 
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